FIA says Brawn, Williams and Toyota diffusers are legal – what happens next?
Toyota's diffusers have been cleared along with those of Williams and Brawn
Brawn GP, Williams and Toyota will be allowed to continue using their controversial ‘double decker’ diffusers after the FIA rejected an appeal against them by four other teams.
The verdict was handed down at a meeting of the International Court of Appeal attended by the seven teams involved, plus McLaren. So which of the teams will now equip their cars with the feature? And will there be any more fall-out from the hearing?
The FIA’s procedures are under scrutiny once again. The first concerns about the diffusers were raised in January and it has taken until the middle of April to get a final verdict. In this time they’ve been passed once by the FIA, again by their own stewards, and now by the International Court of Appeal. Did the process need to take so long?
Renault are especially aggrieved at the outcome have claimed during the trial that they approached the FIA when they were designing a similar diffuser to judge if their interpretation of the rules was correct. It ceased development after a discussion with the FIA led it to conclude that such an interpretation of the rules would not be allowed. Were Renault misled, or did they just drop the ball?
Nigel Tozzi, the Ferrari lawyer, also made a very strong representation to the FIA. The veteran of the spygate scandal, is quoted by the Press Association as saying: “The position of the FIA is totally baffling. We urge you to save the FIA from itself.”
Ross Brawn appears magnanimous in victory, issuing a statement saying: “We respect the right of our competitors to query any design or concept used on our cars through the channels available to them.” This is in marked contrast to the hammering he took from Tozzi who branded him “arrogant” during the hearing.
The role of FOTA – the F1 teams’ association – has been the subject of much speculation. Some observers have looked at four teams protesting against the work of three other teams and drawn the conclusion that the FIA allowed the diffuser row to go on so long in the hope of eroding their unity.
The seven teams that are not using the diffuser are now expected to try to integrate it into their cars as soon possible. As the next two events are ‘fly away’ races in China and Bahrain, this may take some teams until the Spanish Grand Prix next month. This could include Ferrari, who have said it will have to make “fundamental” changes to its F60 to integrate the new design. But there are also rumours that McLaren will have an updated diffuser even sooner for their troublesome MP4/24.
Brawn maintained that the diffuser was not the only reason why they were so much quicker than the opposition. Their performance advantage over Toyota and Williams supports that claim. But will the other teams now be able to get on terms with the BGP001s?
Read more: FIA to rule on legality of Brawn, Williams and Toyota diffusers (Poll)
Good to hear, I think making them illegal would of caused more problems, especially if they decided to take the points away from the teams. British fans, like myself, would of been horrified.
Go Button!
what about hamilton
What about him?
Who?
What happens next? Simple, Button wins the championship!!!
Has anyone any more info on the Renault case? they maintain that they had a similar device which was deemed illegal, the Renault board could feel strongly about this, they have pulled out before, their loss would be bad news for F1…
We need to get clarity also on how much the new diffusers will impact the ability of the cars to follow closely. The OWG had a specific recommendation to halve the downforce from the diffuser. If this is now not the case, and cars are back to being aero-sensitive while following, will we go backwards with regard to the goal of promoting overtaking?
Not that 2007 & 2008 weren’t exciting. If this year can throw up that kind of stuff, I’ll be pleased.
I agree; the specific rules regarding the diffusers are silly. They should have had an objective measure, such as the amount of turbulence encountered at a range of distance close enough for streamlining.
Within the constraint of this, plus the overall dimension of the cars, plus the need for structural integrity, teams should be able to design their cars anyway they want.
@kurtosis:
I agree; now it seems the OWG’s work has been wasted, and if (I believe) the DDD’s create dirtier air behind them, then all teams will have taken a step backward.
Even though the cars would be able to go faster, I’m not sure that will compensate for the increase in air turbulence behind cars.
I think most of the turbulent air was actually from the rear wing, by making it narrow and taller they got rid of most of the “dirty” wake (along with the aero appendages). The diffuser was more about making them slower in corners for safety (and also more daring outside lane overtaking moves like Trulli).
If OWG recommended to halve the downforce due to diffusers plus the rear wing had to be reduce its width then where the car is gonna get enough grip to keep the rear stick to the track and avoiding oversteering in medium speed corners?
You can not regulate the effect of certain devices by simply putting a box as the limiting volume the device can occupy, the sloppy regs wording is unjustifiable nowadays. IF three teams came up with a good solution to increase downforce without breaking the rules then hats off to them. If what the FIA wants is to keep downforce levels below certain value, good for them but to my knowledge that’s almost impossible to enforce so its useless.
The bottom line here is; FIA must focus on writing and illustrating the regs, keep them simple, clean, no sloppiness. Leave the team engineers to do their job. At the end of the day, variety and good racing is what everyone is looking for.
how come they can use them all cars must be the same thats what the FIA say but yet once again one rule for one and one rule for others.
The FIA need to get to grips as people theses days will loose intrest like they are now.
People are saying its getting boring and i watch it every year and i have to say its is getting boring.
cheers toma
Good decision. I think the regulations will be changed at the end of 2009 to make this type of diffuser illegal explicitly. It was a great piece of engineering to find the loophole but they won’t be allowed to keep it in 2010.
would it be possible for the FIA to require all cars, or perhaps designs, to be ready for inspection by a certain date? this way, the FIA can deem the legality of all ideas, and perhaps allow teams to question other teams’ designs, all before the season begins. i for one, am getting tired of all this horse **** going on throughout the season. if it indeed was the goal of the FIA to drive a wedge between the teams, well then, the whole system stinks. get max and bernie out of there.
Well, now, the other teams must rush their already made designs into test and production and adapt them to their cars, improving them, not slowing them down.
I always bet that this would be their decision, after in 2 GPs the stewards declared the 6 cars legal.
If FIA vote against them now, we will now have a 4 front war – FIA / FOM / FOTA / Stewards (I know they are nominated my FIA, but still they a strong group of individuals…
Now the ‘normal’ 3 way war continues – FIA / FOM / FOTA until (I hope) as Keith saw a few days ago – they open their eyes and backup a FIA presidential candidate, so the teams can have, as it would be NORMAL, more saying in all matters in Formula One!
I think it is great how the diffusers are legal now.
However, if the other teams start to put on diffusers, will that result in a lack of overtaking? or even more?
Im not trying to be negative here but if these diffusers make the cars go faster then surely this is not making the sport any safer.
Anyways, if they make better racing, then i’m all for it!
Great news… it’ll not be long until everyone else in the paddock has their own double-deckers (yum yum) and I guess then we’ll see a turn around in the front runners. I hope Brawn are still up there fighting for the lead though.
Thinking back to the Australian GP, Rubens Barrichello lost his rear diffuser, and damaged his front wing, and yet was still able to stay close to the opposition. I’m wondering, could a significant part of Brawn’s speed be in the chassis? Obviously the new aero rules along with the move back to slick tyres has changed the balance of the cars. It must be said also, the Brawn cars just look better than all the others. I would be quite supprised if all the other teams seem to catch up to Brawn with the new diffuser, I suspect Brawn’s dominance is much deeper.
Personally I’m loving this season so far, visually the cars are following much closer than they have for a long time, and passing much more easily. The long standing dominance of Ferrari and McLaren has been well and truly shaken, and Hamilton has shown that even with an inferior car, he can still drive like a man possessed.
Brawn must be loving it. If the diffusers are legal, his team will be battling mostly Toyota for the world championship (Williams have squandered so many points already, plus they have Nakajima). If the diffusers are illegal, they still have some speed advantage left, and now Toyota and Williams will be splitting the good points with the chasing pack.
Don’t rule out Red Bull yet. If they get a decent DDD on the back of that thing, they’ll be taking the Brawns to the cleaners IMHO.
yeah people here and in f1 teams have a hard tme realising it’s not just the diffusers that make the difference.
Michel S. – The diffusers are legal.
John H – Spot on. Red Bull already have the second fastest car in my opinion, and it’s (once again) absolutely mega in the wet. A beneficial Dx3 will see them pull right alongside the Brawns. Plus, surely they can develop faster than Brawn, even though they can’t match the big spenders.
Don’t put Button’s name on the Cup just yet! Messrs. Vettel and Webber may have something to say about that.
For once I agree with a decision the FIA have made, although their handling of the whole affair could have been a lot better. Some work colleagues who only follow F1 with what they see on the main news said they don’t know of another sport with so many controversies and court room goings on etc, this has defiantly not done anything to help F1’s image.
When do next years technical regulations need to be finalised, because I wonder if the FIA will decide to rewrite the rules to close this loophole and the ones which allow those side pod deflectors and barge boards.
I think these are the sort of areas where the rules will differ if the FIA introduce their budget cap for more technical freedom idea.
Even with the resources the big teams have, I can’t see them managing to get a new diffuser fully developed and integrated with the rest of their car for quite a few races, especially with the testing ban. Unless Brawn suffer reliability problems or just bad luck they should be able to build a commanding lead in both championships before other teams can match them in terms of performance.
I’m thankful for his decision. The 3 teams in question having their cars deemed illegal after two Grand Prix would NOT have helped Formula One’s public image, which we all know has already been tarnished enough by scandal.
Its the best thing that could have happened to f1. Now we’ve got 2 races.ontrack & offtrack.i.e.all the vastly funded teams like ferrari,mclaren,bmw will be pushing their design teams to the limit. Now that the diffusers have been declared legal, the team that is good at damage limitation is most likely to catch up with brawn mercedes in the latter half of the season. This desicision has imo played into the hands of mclaren. I expect them to be winning races in the latter half. As for ferrari:better luck next time. Italian cry babe.
Good news: a clear ruling has been made.
Bad news: it took far longer than it should have.
Can you really imagine this in any other sport? Is there another regulating body in all of sport that would have allowed a season to begin when there were obvious disputes on fundamental sections of the regulations?
Nigel Tozzi, in all HIS arrogance, was nevertheless right that the FIA needs saving from itself. This a beautiful sport that is being pushed towards ridicule by guys sitting around in a boardroom. This sad saga is all the proof I need to know that if they really go ahead with a budget-based, two-tiered technical regulations system for next year, it will be recipe for nothing but continual litigation and we will see a season decided at hearing, after hearing, after hearing…
Is there another sport that is like Formula 1? No. So imagining this applied to any other sport is utterly irrelevant.
If you want a totally fixed formula then look elsewhere.
Great News.
now i think that there will be a few challenges opening up this season.
wich othe the other two of the original diffuser gang catch up to brawn and challenge them.
which of the non-diffuser teams will be the first to implement the modification.
which of the non diffuser teams will match the original diffuser gang’s performance at the top first after having made the modification.
will Brawn stay ahead now that all the teams can actively pursue development of the diffuser that are said to make them gain so much of an advantage.
a lot of questions, and this season’s racing looks excellent so far. lets just hope that this modification doesn’t distance the cars as much. but i have a feeling that they wont….
can’t wait to see what happens….
Well at least we all know where we are going now. There are some more questions that need answering from this:
If the Brawn cars are still fastest after everyone else fits the DDD, will there be more appeals?
Renault have said that to include the DDD into the car will require a major rework of the whole aero package, they might be able to afford such a thing, but what about Force India? Are the poorer teams going to be penalised just for being poorer?
Is the FIA going to send inspectors to the factories to check how much wind tunnel and test-track time is used to develop the DDDs?
F.India might be able to get one from McLaren (similar to how Sauber once ran a complete Ferrari backend, IIRC?); they are already using the engine and gearbox after all.
Mind you, that’s not as much an advantage as it would normally be, given how much they’re struggling so far.
I think ultimately this is the best result for the “face” of F1, though I wonder what diffusers (double/triple/quadruple etc etc) we’ll see on the back of these cars in the coming races. In the end anyway I don’t see them using them for long, in that the FIA will close the loophole in the regulations for coming years.
As for Renault, we don’t know what exact diffuser design they came up with, in the detail their diffuser may well have been illegal… we don’t know, and obviously Renault are not going to be open about that.
As for if this season is more exciting with the aero changes etc… damn right it is. With the intro of KERS being used to attack and defend, and the wheel to wheel racing we’ve seen so far, this promises to be a good season for some decent racing!
Roll on the weekend!
Don’t forget that Brawn are still not running KERS. Their advantage will be chipped away race by race. I agree this may play into the hands of renault and Mclaren. Let’s hope the FIA wants to avoid more trouble and doesn’t penalize Mclaren and Hamilton. Could Mclaren survive another constructor’s ban ?
McLaren won’t get penalised if they don’t do something wrong. Thats the easy solution. They do bring this upon themselves.
I am happy about the outcome, but this issue shows there is a huge problem with the FIA, certainly if Renaults claim that they were told it wasn’t legal while others were told it was (But as Dougie points out, it could have been slightly different, enough to make it illegal). If anything, however, the FIA should be charged with bringing the sport into disrepute over this and the Hamilton saga.
Also, I think Ferrari should be embarrassed of the behavior of their lawyer Nigel Tozzi. Brawn acted like a grown up, and Ferrari continues to act like a bunch of children. As upset as they may be, both sides had valid points in this situation, there was no reason for name calling, certainly from someone in the sport as insignificant as a lawyer.
I think Ferrari are annoyed as a statement from them on the FOM site says that they also consulted the FIA during development and were told that their DDD was illegal.
As per the comment about Renault’s argument, it may well be that Ferrari didn’t make it compliant, but we will never know.
I wonder if all the teams consulted the same FIA technical person about this, since thay all seemed to get different answers, or if the legality of a car being designed and built is down to the interpretation of the rules by the local FIA representative?
Great News !!
I think it will be interesting to see if the FIA moves to change the rules on the diffusers for next year.
As Keith has already pointed out that the cars with these D.D.D’s are almost or as fast as last year, so with another year of development these cars are going to be even quicker and more dangerous.
If the FIA moves to change the rules on the diffusers it will prove that they have failed to manage the situation and have made this decision to reflect better on them than the good of the sport – eeek I am starting to sound like the Ferrari lawyer!:)
I hope the FIA come out and explain exactly why they are legal so we all can see where Brawn, Toyota and Williams where correct and why the others were wrong.
As an optimist, I don’t think this ruling will create less overtaking once all the teams have fitted their new diffusers. We’ve already seen the diffuser cars running just as closely as the non-diffuser cars in the first 2 races. Rosberg vs Barrichello vs Raikkonen in Melbourne comes to mind.
I don’t think this is a case of the FIA drawing out the process. This is just the system of appeal. It is of no fault of the FIA if they say “That diffuser is legal”, and the other teams say “could you say that again louder please?”
@iBlaze,
You may be right. You have to remember though that RAI was on fast-degrading softer compound tires – so that particular example (ROS, BAR, RAI) isn’t much to go by if we’re trying to estimate the impact on overtaking.
“its not a huge surprise that yet again the FIA support anything predominately british based. the fact that the diffuser does not comply with the rules is irrelevant”
This was a comment I just read on another site. The ridiculousness annoys me quite a bit. Someone who is very obviously bitter towards Britain ignores the fact that one of teams involved was Japanese, one was Japanese owned onaly last year, one of the opposing teams was British and nationality doesn’t matter that much anyway, as quite a lot of F1 parts/expertise/r&d/etc. seem to come from Britain regardless of where the teams’ headquarters are.
And the diffuser clearly did comply, otherwise it wouldn’t have been ruled as legal and teams opposing it wouldn’t have started making their own versions weeks ago. That shows that those teams knew it was legal, their only problem with it was that they failed to spot the loophole themselves and as a result have damaged pride in their engineering capability and lost performance at the beginning of the season.
Yeah, it’s a bit rich considering all the help Ferrari were given by the FIA to beat Hamilton (Brit) & Mclaren (Brit team!) last year…
@ matt
I knew the moment I read that quote who wrote it and on what website….don’t let that guy get to you,he is very anti-brit and ignorant.Stay on Keith’s website if you want intelligent conversation and posts.
Glad this diffuser thing is sorted….now on to “liargate” and maybe after that,some RACING!
yeah liargate will be even more fun I expect. Can’t wait. I hope that will be it for the rest of the season. Probably just wishful thinking. Oh well, on to China!
Apparently Ferrari and Redbull will have alot of trouble with a new diffuser because of the arrangement of main parts near the rear of the car, which they will have to completly rearrange and move them around to achieve a “double decker” diffuser
BMW on the other hand are already very far in development of their diffuser.
In my opinion it will make the racing even more competitive
I’m not totally convinced that the diffusers are the be all end all of Brawn’s (et al) speed. I’m sure it’s helping, but dont forget, Red Bull, sans conplex diffuser, aren’t exactly that far of the pace.
Why dont we hear anything on this from McLaren? Have they started devloping a new diffuser.
Suppose they are just keeping quiet and low profile for the time being. Afraid to say anything.
I should hope so to..
…or Barrichello…
I’m going to stick my neck out and say this gives Hamilton (and maybe Alonso) a good chance of fighting for the WDC, presuming, as seems likely, that McLaren (and Renault) have a diffuser lined up and McLaren don’t get utterly pasted by FIA at the mega-lie, punishable-by-whipping, scandal hearings. If they strike lucky, their own diffusers should push them close enough to Brawn to make the KERS bonus count. Should be interesting. As for Ferrari, their own KERS problems plus the need to develop a diffuser, plus internal mayhem, could be difficult to surmount. BMW will be up there too I guess.
Mclaren’s diffuser had gaffer tape holding a blanking plate (presumably to cover a rear facing hole (a la brawn) during the first two GP’s. Expect a hole in the MP4-24 this weekend at least…there’s a reason why they didn’t speak at the hearing…
Matt – Yep, I’m half-expecting an immediate surprise package from McLaren too.
I’m sure we’ll some serious speed,serious injuries,serious deaths. I would caution vettel & webber against racing, that red bull looks overly radical. Not to mention the presence of Dr death adrian newey. Its going to be a repeat of 1994 i’m dead sure,we’ll see some horrific deaths. The cars are not safe enough thats all i can say. If i were to be the parent of one of these drivers, i would immediately withdraw their superlicences. I’ve a feeling that silverstone could witness its 1st death in decades. I just hope it does’nt happen. Plz ban diffusers. Max u r a idiot.
You are aware all the cars have diffusers, right? What we’re talking about is some cars having different diffusers to other cars.
Red Bull don’t have the double decker diffusers, so your comments about Newey are ignorant, as well as cruel and verging on libellous.
I don’t think a technology that gives a potential speed advantage estimated at 0.5-1 second per lap merits anything like this sort of hysterical over-reaction. Even with double-decker diffusers the cars are barely any quicker than they were last year: 2009 F1 cars quicker than in 2008
You’re a very serious young man aren’t you Keith..
I’m an ardent Mclaren fanatic & i’m quite sure the team is working hard at its workshop to catch up with the brawn fellas. I trust & know they have been quitely developing replacement diffusers for the MP4. It might not be so soon but will definately be a sure thing when F1 comes to europe. Watch out!!
Yes, but if the FiA sees McLaren have their car developed so they have a crack at the championship, they will probably disqualify the whole team for 2009. This is the crap that McLaren have to work with. Should they delay their development until after 29/4/09 and risk losing more points or go for it. Whatever happens, McLaren will be penalised. I so wish McLaren were one of the diffuser teams as the diffusers would surely be banned by now if that were the case.
Quite in agreement Huges. I believe the FiA picks easily at Mclaren on every litle wrong (?) step. But who blames them…Da Mc are simply the team of envy! I just miss so much of Dennis…i have this innate feeling the team feels so much unsecured with him not around!
Remeber the Renault case? They were forced to remove their diffusers…but i cant remember them loosing no point!
My strong point here is a feeling that the FiA is dying to have a new team (?) win the championship!
Yes Kutigz. That is quite obvious. I don’t think some F1 followers have quite got the hang of how it works yet, because it is so simplistic you see. Anything that McLaren or Lewis touch is to be judged harshly, penalised or disqualified. That’s it, period. This year the FIA want Brawn/Button to win and they probably will looking at how things are going. Last year the FIA did everything they possibly could to get Ferrari/Massa to win, and they just failed on the last corner of the last race. This year, they are going to make sure McLaren/Lewis don’t win from the outset of the championship, so there’s no doubt by the time we reach Abu Dhabi. Simple really!
Guys, if Mclaren hadn’t lied in the first place they would not be in this situations to be judged by the FIA.
If it had been open at the investigation last year in to the Ferrari documents and also told the truth at the stewards meeting on Australia then they would not be meeting the FIA again to be punished.
It’s not as if the FIA are laying this little traps to catch them in – Mclaren are slightly inept at managing the raw competitive nature of their organisation.
I cannot help but think they certainly don’t to anything the help themselves. Why cannot they just keep their heads down and race without getting in to an funny business, then if they lost they would only have themselves to blame and not have any of the paranoia that fills its team and many fans.
Reading up on the various reactions, it’s increasingly looking like Renault and Ferrari in particular are in deep trouble this season. Renault at least have a driver who is excellent at development. Ferrari not so much.
Even so, doing a fundamental redesign with a ban on in-season testing (except straight-line) and a forced reduction in wind-tunnel usage means that the development cycle must slow to an absolute crawl.
In fact, they may be better able to spend efforts on incremental improvements (non-fundamental changes) and get competitive like RBR has done without the DD diffuser. This approach may pay dividends next season if the FIA introduce new regulations to ban this sort of diffuser. So they may want to focus on extracting performance in other areas in spite of having a regular diffuser.
Of course, BrawnGP and the rest will be doing the same _with_ the DD diffuser, so that brings us back to square one.
So it’s game over for Ferrari and maybe Renault as far as this season is concerned. I’ll put my neck out and say Ferrari end the season at the bottom third of the constructors championship.
I support FIA’s decision. Let the whining stop and the racing begin, about time we had the first complete race !
Look out for Barrichello in Shanghai.
Does anyone else feel that if the positions were reversed and it was McLaren/Ferrari/BMW that had come up with the controversial design that they would have been ruled illegal because those teams are so used to having that sort of advantage? Anyway, that being said, LETS RACE! I am excited to see what the other teams come up with now…
no
no
a number of points
1. I think we’ll see McLaren turn up on Friday with the rear of their mark II diffusser cut out!! I’m sure it was designed to be a double deck design in the first place just waiting this decision.
2. As for Ferrari, BMW, Torro Rosso and to a lesser extent Renault, catching up is going to require a new gearbox design.
3. Jon Tomlinsonm (Williams) has admitted he gained knowledge about Honda’s diffusser from an ex Honda employee who joined Williams. Well if my memory serves me correctly Stepney and Coughlan did the same back in 2007. I guess because of the engine supply and the required shape of the gearbox, Williams let this slip to Toyota. Hence 3 DDD’s. Another spygate then.
4. The reason this design is passed as legal is more about the top deck of the difusser being part of the deformable crash structure. Which is what I assume the FIA have confirmed.
Oh dear what a mess Formula 1 gets its self into.
Only ferrari and redbull need new gearbox designs..
Not too fast Del, the Mc team i suspect wont cut-out & replace the MP4’s diffuser just yet…the Mc team have got the lie-gate scandal at hand with the Appeals team. They’d probably be on hold till a more comfortable time…wat ya think?
On Point 3 Del, that is not really like the Stepney and Coughlan situation.
Both were being paid by rival teams at the time. Key personnel move from team to team all the time and key personnel’s market value to other teams in considered in what knowledge they can bring from other teams.
For example, does that mean Adrian Newey could not work for Mclaren after working for Williams – after all, he would have known a lot about what made that team successful. It just isn’t the same in my opinion.
Engineering loop holes are as much a part of racing as spying and team orders. If i could have one wish it would be that F1 could go back to being a (comparative) minority interest sport. The FIA find it hard to be autocratic these days and the reason is the overwhelming public interest.
Watching the racing clips on the Jackie Stewart documentary the other night i realised how far we still have to go before the racing is anything like it should be but it is much much better. Carry on FIA, an impossible job.
Delboy, again the details are scarce, but I’d imagine regarding your point3 that the employees in question used knowledge gained from memory rather than printing out, photocopying, and passing on the full schematics of the Honda design in question.
Anyway, having read this Autosport report I wonder why the teams haven’t yet learned to stop clarifying things with someone who obviously is not in a position of authority or of detailed enough knowledge.
They’re legal. Really no suprise. Score one for innovative engineering and rule reading/interp. Now let’s see how long it takes for the others to adapt.
How does the Double Diffuser make the cars dangerous?
With the tracks being built lately having run off areas as wide as a small county, the drivers are more in danger of hitting a bird in flight or an errant dog.
I hear lots of arguments for banning the diffuser, that it makes the cars faster, and I’m talking about readers on here. If the FIA wants the cars to go slower let them run with F3 specs, engine and all. I guess that would satisfy the hunger for slow speed.
By the way Keith, I am seriously concerned about the competency of Charlie Whiting. It seems both during races and regarding technical clarifications, he often seems to say one thing and goes on to implement something else.
First the Spa thing and now this, doesn’t look very good at all does it?
What I want to know is, when Brawn and the other teams asked if their interpretations were legal, who did they ask? Was it Whiting? If so…
‘diffusers legal”, now there is a shocker folks, who would have predicted that decision ehh!
Wasn’t this whole thing with ‘rule changes’ supposed to even up the filed a bit and allow for more overtaking.
I would like to play devils advocate, and here is what i think the broad message that Bernie’s maFIA are sending out these days:
In my opinion all this rule changing has done is promote 3 teams to the top, where overtaking is almost impossible amongst them, because, ironically enough, of the ‘diffuser’! at the same time creating a pace differential between the diffused and non-diffused cars, farther reducing overtaking opportunities between the top 3 and the rest.
The only exciting racing and overtaking we’ve seen was amongst the BMWs, Red Bulls, Mclarens, Renaults and Ferraris etc… all the teams that complied with letter of the maFIA rule changes…. the diffuser lot are romping away at the front almost unchallenged and not passing each other either.
So to remedy this Bernie’s maFIA, rule diffusers legal, thus trumping their own reasons for introducing the rule changes in the 1st place, closer racing and more overtaking, because now the other teams will get diffusers and no one will be able to follow anyone else’s slip stream because the diffusers will not allow this aerodynamically!!!
Go Figure!
More importantly, I think, they’ve sent out a message to the teams saying ‘you can work hard over many decades building highly skilled well managed and innovative racing organisations, but unless you have a mate on Bernie and Max’s maFIA who can set you early on in the game down the right path and with a ‘nod and wink’ bend the rules in your favour whilst making your opponents life an utter misery, then you haven’t snow ball’s chance in hell of competing on a level field in this sport’!!
F1 is most certainly ‘not cricket ol’boy’
well, as far as I remember, so far this season the only driver to complain about aero difficulty in overtaking was Glock after being “stuck” behind Alonso in Australia – which kind of suggests the opposite of what you claim…
SYM – Didn’t Rosberg overtake a Brawn and a Toyota at the last race? Trulli and Glock both passed Rosberg in Australia, as did Barrichello. Barrichello passed Trulli and Glock in Malaysia too, I think. That sounds to me like a fair bit of overtaking in one and a half races, don’t you think? It seems the only cars that are hard to pass are the ones running KERS, and I’m guessing you support one of these teams, right?
As I said in a previous comment on this site, possibly the only way that the diffuser ‘enhancements’ could be made illegal is if someone presented evidence that the wake behind the cars with this design made it harder to follow them, and it seems that no conclusive evidence was presented. That makes your argument against these devices inaccurate. I guess we’ll find out more when the full decision is released.
@Maciek
Perhaps the relative riving abilities of the 2 is a factor in this single example and also fuel loads i think may have been another. Where as I would turn your attention to the many battles in the mid-field, where positions were being swapped several times over a single lap eg Hamilton/Webber, Kubica/Vettel and so on
And again, Glock was saying that it was tough to get past Alonso primarily because of KERS.
Glock wasn’t “complaining” about aero difficulties, he was noting that ALO used KERS every time he (Glock) got ALO lined up for a pass.
We can’t really draw a conclusion on the impact on overtaking just yet. We only know that this goes against _one_ of the OWG’s recommendations.
Ummm, ditto
brilliant news. thank god the FIA actually got something right for once. Halelula! i am now very pleased that Brawn can continue their superb form, although they’ll need to look behind them soon………..
3 teams evolved an FIA approved design of diffuser which is alleged to give them a performance advantage though it is yet to be proved how big that advantage is. Vettel led 5 of the 6 cars so equipped in Australia until Kubica who was also not so equipped but safety car enhanced misjudged his overtaking move.
Ross Brawne says that the diffuser design cannot be held responsible for all of his cars performance. Adrian Neweys Red Bull would appear to confirm that. We have a feast to look forward to.
None of these technical features have any political connotations. It is sad that Ferrari sent a QC along to a technical meeting to contribute his views on Ross Brawne rather than the subject under discussion. Probaly got right up the stewards noses but I would have hoped that Ferrari owed Brawne more loyalty than that for his part in all the years of success and for Todt’s contribution to his leaving Ferrari.
Away to the dustbin with politics and QCs let the teams race and outwit each other if they can.
I think the whole Kubica vs Vettel thing has already been concluded. It was Vettels fault.
Plus its Brawn…
hello 2004. button for pole in every race.
Yes yes and lets have Lewis Hamilton’s and McLaren’s penalties be handed out at least 24 hrs before each race….yippi
Well if I read correctly, RedBull claimed they sought clarification from Whiting a double decker diffuser, similar to the one the 3 teams are running and were told it was illegal. The interesting thing is Williams got on the idea about the diffuser from an ex-Honda staff. Williams must have known it was legal to proceed with it as definitely Honda had already got the go ahead from the FIA.
Is it possible the FIA are trying to keep toyota interested in F1 by allowing them some early results?
How separate are the diffusers from the rear crash structure? Is this what is going to take the time, having to have the car re crash tested? I can fully understand Macca keeping their heads down and going with majority until the ruling then whipping a ddd out of their sleeves almost straight away,
So, since all the confusions about the diffusers are cleared today, it’s time to concentrate on racing again. There will be another race at the factories between seven teams that don’t have DDD and It will be interesting to see who will bring their new car first. But one thing which is obvious is when everybody has DDD and KERS, there will be no difference in overtaking to last year. Cars will have more downforce and corner speeds and all the regulation changes that have been made on behalf of overtaking will be wasted.
@Scott Joslin.
Read what Coulthard says about F1 truth & lies. He says that as a driver, you go into the stewards office only when you get summoned there, and when you’re there your only thought is to limit any damage the stewards can do to you and your team. Truth and lies don’t come into it. You say whatever produces the best result. This rule applies to all drivers, team leaders, mechanics, everybody in the team.
In fact, they behave just like most of the rest of the human race.