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> <channel><title>Comments on: Lessons for F1 in NASCAR&#8217;s horror crash</title> <atom:link href="http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/05/01/lessons-for-f1-in-nascars-horror-crash/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" /><link>http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/05/01/lessons-for-f1-in-nascars-horror-crash/</link> <description>F1 Fanatic - The Formula 1 Blog with F1 news, pictures, video, comment and analysis</description> <lastBuildDate>Sat, 20 Mar 2010 17:38:04 +0000</lastBuildDate> <generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.6</generator> <sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod> <sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency> <item><title>By: USF1fan</title><link>http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/05/01/lessons-for-f1-in-nascars-horror-crash/comment-page-1/#comment-257230</link> <dc:creator>USF1fan</dc:creator> <pubDate>Mon, 18 May 2009 06:06:34 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=20540#comment-257230</guid> <description>I don&#039;t understand why the cars were going that fast when it was known that the safety car was coming out.  The other thing to watch is the guy at the end of the pit lane.  You can see him wave the safety car out right as the race leaders are coming up on pit exit.  I would say that even though there were lots of things done wrong, most of the blame should be on the guy that gave the safety car the go ahead at an unsafe time.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t understand why the cars were going that fast when it was known that the safety car was coming out.  The other thing to watch is the guy at the end of the pit lane.  You can see him wave the safety car out right as the race leaders are coming up on pit exit.  I would say that even though there were lots of things done wrong, most of the blame should be on the guy that gave the safety car the go ahead at an unsafe time.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: scunnyman</title><link>http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/05/01/lessons-for-f1-in-nascars-horror-crash/comment-page-1/#comment-257173</link> <dc:creator>scunnyman</dc:creator> <pubDate>Sun, 17 May 2009 15:14:00 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=20540#comment-257173</guid> <description>I reckon it was definitely the safety car drivers fault, but at the same time the drivers would have known it was coming out and where so should have slowed down more.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I reckon it was definitely the safety car drivers fault, but at the same time the drivers would have known it was coming out and where so should have slowed down more.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Chaz</title><link>http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/05/01/lessons-for-f1-in-nascars-horror-crash/comment-page-1/#comment-257163</link> <dc:creator>Chaz</dc:creator> <pubDate>Sun, 17 May 2009 14:01:42 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=20540#comment-257163</guid> <description>Keith.  Not sure where to post this but I was wondering if you saw todays serious safety car crash at the 2nd WTCC race in Pau France.  It was quite dramatic!  I&#039;ve not been able to find video of it just yet but tought you might want to post an entry of this under safety car lessons to be learnt...</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Keith.  Not sure where to post this but I was wondering if you saw todays serious safety car crash at the 2nd WTCC race in Pau France.  It was quite dramatic!  I&#8217;ve not been able to find video of it just yet but tought you might want to post an entry of this under safety car lessons to be learnt&#8230;</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Trey</title><link>http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/05/01/lessons-for-f1-in-nascars-horror-crash/comment-page-1/#comment-254692</link> <dc:creator>Trey</dc:creator> <pubDate>Tue, 05 May 2009 23:47:59 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=20540#comment-254692</guid> <description>heres the  link
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5QT2V-OCXs</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>heres the  link<br
/> <a
href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5QT2V-OCXs" rel="nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5QT2V-OCXs</a></p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Trey</title><link>http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/05/01/lessons-for-f1-in-nascars-horror-crash/comment-page-1/#comment-254691</link> <dc:creator>Trey</dc:creator> <pubDate>Tue, 05 May 2009 23:47:02 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=20540#comment-254691</guid> <description>speaking of the adjustable rear wings. If that rear wing breaks and the driver tries to turn his car even slightly all hell breaks loose. Does anyone remember Catherine Leguie&#039;s crash at road America in 2006. At &quot;The Kink&quot; going 170 mph.here is the video (she wasn&#039;t hurt but the crash looked bad) ...
&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5QT2V-OCXs&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>speaking of the adjustable rear wings. If that rear wing breaks and the driver tries to turn his car even slightly all hell breaks loose. Does anyone remember Catherine Leguie&#8217;s crash at road America in 2006. At &#8220;The Kink&#8221; going 170 mph.</p><p>here is the video (she wasn&#8217;t hurt but the crash looked bad) &#8230;<br
/> <a
href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5QT2V-OCXs" rel="nofollow"></a></p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Chaz</title><link>http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/05/01/lessons-for-f1-in-nascars-horror-crash/comment-page-1/#comment-254623</link> <dc:creator>Chaz</dc:creator> <pubDate>Tue, 05 May 2009 15:55:03 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=20540#comment-254623</guid> <description>I hope Nascar don&#039;t have a knee jerk reaction to this and instead spend their time and money and energy in reinforcing the barriers, period...</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I hope Nascar don&#8217;t have a knee jerk reaction to this and instead spend their time and money and energy in reinforcing the barriers, period&#8230;</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Mark Z</title><link>http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/05/01/lessons-for-f1-in-nascars-horror-crash/comment-page-1/#comment-254478</link> <dc:creator>Mark Z</dc:creator> <pubDate>Mon, 04 May 2009 19:05:36 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=20540#comment-254478</guid> <description>I wouldn&#039;t call the plates mere window dressing--the cars would surely be hitting 240 mph in the draft without them, and since kinetic energy increases proportionally to the square of velocity, 195 mph represents over a one-third decrease in the energies of the cars.Also, I&#039;m no aerodynamicist, but I wonder if the 200 mph mark or thereabouts represents the beginning of a regime where the characteristics of the airflow change and become more unstable or something to that effect, so that the risk of getting airborne begins to increase exponentially.  I&#039;m really just kind of waving my hands here, and I&#039;m sure someone could put me right, but I do recall Darrell Waltrip saying something to that effect on the broadcast last week--I think he called 200 mph and above &quot;no man&#039;s land&quot;.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I wouldn&#8217;t call the plates mere window dressing&#8211;the cars would surely be hitting 240 mph in the draft without them, and since kinetic energy increases proportionally to the square of velocity, 195 mph represents over a one-third decrease in the energies of the cars.</p><p>Also, I&#8217;m no aerodynamicist, but I wonder if the 200 mph mark or thereabouts represents the beginning of a regime where the characteristics of the airflow change and become more unstable or something to that effect, so that the risk of getting airborne begins to increase exponentially.  I&#8217;m really just kind of waving my hands here, and I&#8217;m sure someone could put me right, but I do recall Darrell Waltrip saying something to that effect on the broadcast last week&#8211;I think he called 200 mph and above &#8220;no man&#8217;s land&#8221;.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: theRoswellite</title><link>http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/05/01/lessons-for-f1-in-nascars-horror-crash/comment-page-1/#comment-254470</link> <dc:creator>theRoswellite</dc:creator> <pubDate>Mon, 04 May 2009 18:23:27 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=20540#comment-254470</guid> <description>This near catastrophe is not about:...which driver was at fault
...how the cars are configured
...fate, luck, or inevitabilityIt is simply about track layout, car speed, and the configuration of safety barriers separating spectators from objects entering their area at speed.Nascar and Indycar tracks are based on layouts in which spectators surround the track...EVEN IN CORNERS. They can&#039;t change these tracks without there being a real alteration in the nature of their sport.A car, at speed, entering a spectator area could be the event which will bring about such a change.Anyone designing these tracks today would put the spectators to the inside of the ovals and have the cars, pits and all related support staff outside the track....doesn&#039;t work very well for viewing does it!How does F1 stand?Next time you watch a race, mentally project a car&#039;s path at an unaltered speed in...any direction...that it is capable of moving.  If the results might be a spectator related catastrophe, then this is a real possibility. One which should not be ignored.2009 almost entered racing history the way 1955 did, and believe me, NASCAR is very aware of their &quot;near miss&quot;.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This near catastrophe is not about:</p><p>&#8230;which driver was at fault<br
/> &#8230;how the cars are configured<br
/> &#8230;fate, luck, or inevitability</p><p>It is simply about track layout, car speed, and the configuration of safety barriers separating spectators from objects entering their area at speed.</p><p>Nascar and Indycar tracks are based on layouts in which spectators surround the track&#8230;EVEN IN CORNERS. They can&#8217;t change these tracks without there being a real alteration in the nature of their sport.</p><p>A car, at speed, entering a spectator area could be the event which will bring about such a change.</p><p>Anyone designing these tracks today would put the spectators to the inside of the ovals and have the cars, pits and all related support staff outside the track&#8230;.doesn&#8217;t work very well for viewing does it!</p><p>How does F1 stand?</p><p>Next time you watch a race, mentally project a car&#8217;s path at an unaltered speed in&#8230;any direction&#8230;that it is capable of moving.  If the results might be a spectator related catastrophe, then this is a real possibility. One which should not be ignored.</p><p>2009 almost entered racing history the way 1955 did, and believe me, NASCAR is very aware of their &#8220;near miss&#8221;.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: shellback</title><link>http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/05/01/lessons-for-f1-in-nascars-horror-crash/comment-page-1/#comment-254342</link> <dc:creator>shellback</dc:creator> <pubDate>Mon, 04 May 2009 06:02:28 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=20540#comment-254342</guid> <description>The stands for Daytona will then be in Kansas</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The stands for Daytona will then be in Kansas</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: GeorgeK</title><link>http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/05/01/lessons-for-f1-in-nascars-horror-crash/comment-page-1/#comment-254339</link> <dc:creator>GeorgeK</dc:creator> <pubDate>Mon, 04 May 2009 04:27:24 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=20540#comment-254339</guid> <description>Gman, the real solution would be to eliminate Talladega and Daytona from NASCAR racing. We also know that won&#039;t happen as those two tracks are owned by the France family that also happens to own and run the series.You can&#039;t eliminate restrictor plates as the speeds would then rise to 220 mph+.The only other alternative is to further strengthen the catch fences. Even then debris will still scatter through the fence openings like shrapnel, which is the cause of the recent injuries. But better shrapnel then the entire car.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Gman, the real solution would be to eliminate Talladega and Daytona from NASCAR racing. We also know that won&#8217;t happen as those two tracks are owned by the France family that also happens to own and run the series.</p><p>You can&#8217;t eliminate restrictor plates as the speeds would then rise to 220 mph+.</p><p>The only other alternative is to further strengthen the catch fences. Even then debris will still scatter through the fence openings like shrapnel, which is the cause of the recent injuries. But better shrapnel then the entire car.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Gman</title><link>http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/05/01/lessons-for-f1-in-nascars-horror-crash/comment-page-1/#comment-254333</link> <dc:creator>Gman</dc:creator> <pubDate>Mon, 04 May 2009 01:48:31 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=20540#comment-254333</guid> <description>Great discussion everyone- it is good to see that  serious events in the realm of American Motorsport are picked up upon the world over.I am not a big fan of NASCAR, but I believe that safety for both drivers and spectators in the series has evolved over time in the same fashion as it has for F1 and other racing series. Sadly, sometimes this is even not enough.The NASCAR fans I am friends with (all of whom are intelligent and competent, for the most part) dislike restricter plate racing, for exactly the reason that it bunches cars together and increases the chance for big wrecks. Those of you who point out the nature of the venues are correct, as both Daytona and Talladega are among the most popular stops for NASCAR each season, just like Monaco for F1. My first preference would be to get rid of the plates and let the 200mph speeds happen, but I am far from an expert and would leave it to more professional sources to offer in on this.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great discussion everyone- it is good to see that  serious events in the realm of American Motorsport are picked up upon the world over.</p><p>I am not a big fan of NASCAR, but I believe that safety for both drivers and spectators in the series has evolved over time in the same fashion as it has for F1 and other racing series. Sadly, sometimes this is even not enough.</p><p>The NASCAR fans I am friends with (all of whom are intelligent and competent, for the most part) dislike restricter plate racing, for exactly the reason that it bunches cars together and increases the chance for big wrecks. Those of you who point out the nature of the venues are correct, as both Daytona and Talladega are among the most popular stops for NASCAR each season, just like Monaco for F1. My first preference would be to get rid of the plates and let the 200mph speeds happen, but I am far from an expert and would leave it to more professional sources to offer in on this.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Gman</title><link>http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/05/01/lessons-for-f1-in-nascars-horror-crash/comment-page-1/#comment-254332</link> <dc:creator>Gman</dc:creator> <pubDate>Mon, 04 May 2009 01:41:58 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=20540#comment-254332</guid> <description>I remember he got a great deal of flak for still using the open-face helmet. It would have been positive for NASCAR to follow the F1 lead in introducing HANS, btu sometimes it takes a bad accident to force home the point.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I remember he got a great deal of flak for still using the open-face helmet. It would have been positive for NASCAR to follow the F1 lead in introducing HANS, btu sometimes it takes a bad accident to force home the point.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Gman</title><link>http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/05/01/lessons-for-f1-in-nascars-horror-crash/comment-page-1/#comment-254331</link> <dc:creator>Gman</dc:creator> <pubDate>Mon, 04 May 2009 01:37:39 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=20540#comment-254331</guid> <description>Indeed, I mentioned the Michigan crash earlier, before I realized you wrote about it here.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Indeed, I mentioned the Michigan crash earlier, before I realized you wrote about it here.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Gman</title><link>http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/05/01/lessons-for-f1-in-nascars-horror-crash/comment-page-1/#comment-254330</link> <dc:creator>Gman</dc:creator> <pubDate>Mon, 04 May 2009 01:36:38 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=20540#comment-254330</guid> <description>Great responses guys.Sean, I believe you are correct in that F1 can learn a great deal from NASCAR in many respects. However, I think you are a bit off target in some areas. Indeed, almost all crashes in NASCAR result in little or no injuries, but some incidents do happen- Earnhardt hopefully being the last. As for popularity, NASCAR dose rule the American motorsport scene, but I believe it dose lag behind Major League Baseball, the NBA, and especially the NFL in terms of overall popularity.As for the governing rules and regs, NASCAR dose get many things correct- myself and several other readers brought this up in the aftermath of the Australian GP fiasco. But they also have some shortcomings, and the issue of restrictor plates is one that comes up every year.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great responses guys.</p><p>Sean, I believe you are correct in that F1 can learn a great deal from NASCAR in many respects. However, I think you are a bit off target in some areas. Indeed, almost all crashes in NASCAR result in little or no injuries, but some incidents do happen- Earnhardt hopefully being the last. As for popularity, NASCAR dose rule the American motorsport scene, but I believe it dose lag behind Major League Baseball, the NBA, and especially the NFL in terms of overall popularity.</p><p>As for the governing rules and regs, NASCAR dose get many things correct- myself and several other readers brought this up in the aftermath of the Australian GP fiasco. But they also have some shortcomings, and the issue of restrictor plates is one that comes up every year.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Gman</title><link>http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/05/01/lessons-for-f1-in-nascars-horror-crash/comment-page-1/#comment-254329</link> <dc:creator>Gman</dc:creator> <pubDate>Mon, 04 May 2009 01:30:18 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=20540#comment-254329</guid> <description>Good comparison at the end.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good comparison at the end.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Gman</title><link>http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/05/01/lessons-for-f1-in-nascars-horror-crash/comment-page-1/#comment-254328</link> <dc:creator>Gman</dc:creator> <pubDate>Mon, 04 May 2009 01:28:47 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=20540#comment-254328</guid> <description>Well, I believe F1 has the same doctor (employed by the FIA, if I am correct) that supervises medical care and facilities at each event. However, I believe all the marshals are locals.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, I believe F1 has the same doctor (employed by the FIA, if I am correct) that supervises medical care and facilities at each event. However, I believe all the marshals are locals.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Gman</title><link>http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/05/01/lessons-for-f1-in-nascars-horror-crash/comment-page-1/#comment-254326</link> <dc:creator>Gman</dc:creator> <pubDate>Mon, 04 May 2009 01:25:47 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=20540#comment-254326</guid> <description>Well, if you go back to the IRL/Champ Car days, I believe several fans were killed at Michigan during the U.S. 500 race in the mid-90&#039;s.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, if you go back to the IRL/Champ Car days, I believe several fans were killed at Michigan during the U.S. 500 race in the mid-90&#8217;s.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: HounslowBusGarage</title><link>http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/05/01/lessons-for-f1-in-nascars-horror-crash/comment-page-1/#comment-254286</link> <dc:creator>HounslowBusGarage</dc:creator> <pubDate>Sun, 03 May 2009 20:56:12 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=20540#comment-254286</guid> <description>I think that was his year in CART or Indycar. I seem to remember it was at Phoenix Raceway, out in the desert . . . That would have been 1993.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think that was his year in CART or Indycar. I seem to remember it was at Phoenix Raceway, out in the desert . . . That would have been 1993.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: alan</title><link>http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/05/01/lessons-for-f1-in-nascars-horror-crash/comment-page-1/#comment-254260</link> <dc:creator>alan</dc:creator> <pubDate>Sun, 03 May 2009 17:45:05 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=20540#comment-254260</guid> <description>Well before Nascar - there was a incident where a Mercedes flew into the crowd and killed several spectators and caused  Mecededes withdrawel from racing for decades - a great loss - but it was a racing incident - hence the disclaier on all racing tickets - legal or not - it is accepted as such? - no one has sued Max/Fia to check if legal - hopefully no one is in such a position - really no one can cover every eventuality</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well before Nascar &#8211; there was a incident where a Mercedes flew into the crowd and killed several spectators and caused  Mecededes withdrawel from racing for decades &#8211; a great loss &#8211; but it was a racing incident &#8211; hence the disclaier on all racing tickets &#8211; legal or not &#8211; it is accepted as such? &#8211; no one has sued Max/Fia to check if legal &#8211; hopefully no one is in such a position &#8211; really no one can cover every eventuality</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: GeorgeK</title><link>http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/05/01/lessons-for-f1-in-nascars-horror-crash/comment-page-1/#comment-254250</link> <dc:creator>GeorgeK</dc:creator> <pubDate>Sun, 03 May 2009 14:19:19 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=20540#comment-254250</guid> <description>Keith and The Limit:Respectfully i think fluke is absolutely the correct term. You can&#039;t tell me when the last time a car grabbed big air and hit the catch fence, can you? Yes, restrictor plate racing forces close car racing and the inevitable &quot;Big one&quot;.But when you consider the number of laps run over the years and the incidence of cars getting airborne I think &quot;fluke&quot; is the proper description.That&#039;s not to say the sport should be complacent on safety. Improve it where ever you can but without destroying the nature and uniqueness of the series.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Keith and The Limit:</p><p>Respectfully i think fluke is absolutely the correct term. You can&#8217;t tell me when the last time a car grabbed big air and hit the catch fence, can you? Yes, restrictor plate racing forces close car racing and the inevitable &#8220;Big one&#8221;.</p><p>But when you consider the number of laps run over the years and the incidence of cars getting airborne I think &#8220;fluke&#8221; is the proper description.</p><p>That&#8217;s not to say the sport should be complacent on safety. Improve it where ever you can but without destroying the nature and uniqueness of the series.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> </channel> </rss>
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