Comments on: Renault and Ferrari re-state their threat not to compete in 2010 http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/06/10/renault-and-ferrari-re-state-their-threat-not-to-compete-in-2010/ F1 Fanatic - The Formula 1 Blog with F1 news, pictures, video, comment and analysis Mon, 22 Mar 2010 06:33:10 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.6 hourly 1 By: guille2306http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/06/10/renault-and-ferrari-re-state-their-threat-not-to-compete-in-2010/comment-page-1/#comment-262543 guille2306 Fri, 12 Jun 2009 00:45:57 +0000 http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=21585#comment-262543 Yeah, but we should not underestimate that most of the casual fans DO think that. And Max is willing to show BrawnGP as an example of how an efficient and small team can beat the big corporations that spend billions, making look the constructors as the source of all the bad the F1 has... Yeah, but we should not underestimate that most of the casual fans DO think that. And Max is willing to show BrawnGP as an example of how an efficient and small team can beat the big corporations that spend billions, making look the constructors as the source of all the bad the F1 has…

]]> By: scunnymanhttp://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/06/10/renault-and-ferrari-re-state-their-threat-not-to-compete-in-2010/comment-page-1/#comment-262540 scunnyman Fri, 12 Jun 2009 00:28:28 +0000 http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=21585#comment-262540 BrawnGP is not running on a "shoestring" budget. At least not this season. BrawnGP is not running on a “shoestring” budget. At least not this season.

]]> By: The Limithttp://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/06/10/renault-and-ferrari-re-state-their-threat-not-to-compete-in-2010/comment-page-1/#comment-262533 The Limit Fri, 12 Jun 2009 00:03:05 +0000 http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=21585#comment-262533 The underlying problem for Bernard Ecclestone is that a rival series may prove more popular and better run than his own. The root cause of this so called 'war' is pure greed, and reaches far further than just the teams and the FIA. When we look back over the last half dozen years at all of the circuits 'priced out' of Formula One by Ecclestone and his bean counters, it is not difficult to see that this standoff has been a long time coming. It is no secret that the teams strongly disliked the decision to not have any North American races, as well as their sponsors. A new series, with world famous brand names behind them, could quite easily return to pastures previously 'dumped' by Bernie Ecclestone, in Europe and overseas. Ecclestone has for years harboured ambitions to break heavily into the Asian marketplace, leaving behind core audiences in Europe and elsewhere behind. It is not difficult to imagine that the teams and sponsors maybe not so excited as Ecclestone as to race in South Korea as opposed to France, San Marino, and possibly Great Britain. The overwhelming scary thing about a split is the fatal damage that was inflicted to American openwheel racing when the IRL was carved up fourteen years ago. It just goes to show how bad things have become in Formula One if the teams are willing to take such a risk. The sport is really being run into the ground, and has been for many many years. There are way too many political figures in F1, and far too many bad decisions during races from officials that have put too many noses out of joint. In many ways, the loss of Honda F1 opened many eyes. Here was an organisation that had spent billions of dollars in F1 for limited return to say the least. Not alone are companies such as Honda, and BMW, who have invested simular amounts of money for very little reward. To add insult to injury, along comes Ross Brawn, with a restricted 'shoestring' budget, to dominate a season that was meant to be the most competitive season in decades. It is not difficult to imagine how badly aggrieved these teams are, knowing that things will get worse next year when more teams arrive on the scene. The rules have to be decided, and set in stone. If the FIA are incapable of coming up with rules that make sense, and are governable properly and fairly, then they are no longer relavent as an organisation. They are just a ten pound weight, dragging the sport under. If all Bernie Ecclestone can do is issue threats, then it seems to me that FOTA have less to lose than they thought. These are smart men, who for years have made billions from Formula One, but have become blinded by greed and self interest. The president of the FIA has done nothing to ease the tensions, and deserves nothing less than a P45. I would gladly watch a breakaway series, as I am so distraught at the way F1 is being lead. Its time to shut Ecclestone down, once and for all. The underlying problem for Bernard Ecclestone is that a rival series may prove more popular and better run than his own. The root cause of this so called ‘war’ is pure greed, and reaches far further than just the teams and the FIA.
When we look back over the last half dozen years at all of the circuits ‘priced out’ of Formula One by Ecclestone and his bean counters, it is not difficult to see that this standoff has been a long time coming.
It is no secret that the teams strongly disliked the decision to not have any North American races, as well as their sponsors. A new series, with world famous brand names behind them, could quite easily return to pastures previously ‘dumped’ by Bernie Ecclestone, in Europe and overseas.
Ecclestone has for years harboured ambitions to break heavily into the Asian marketplace, leaving behind core audiences in Europe and elsewhere behind. It is not difficult to imagine that the teams and sponsors maybe not so excited as Ecclestone as to race in South Korea as opposed to France, San Marino, and possibly Great Britain.
The overwhelming scary thing about a split is the fatal damage that was inflicted to American openwheel racing when the IRL was carved up fourteen years ago.
It just goes to show how bad things have become in Formula One if the teams are willing to take such a risk. The sport is really being run into the ground, and has been for many many years. There are way too many political figures in F1, and far too many bad decisions during races from officials that have put too many noses out of joint.
In many ways, the loss of Honda F1 opened many eyes. Here was an organisation that had spent billions of dollars in F1 for limited return to say the least. Not alone are companies such as Honda, and BMW, who have invested simular amounts of money for very little reward.
To add insult to injury, along comes Ross Brawn, with a restricted ’shoestring’ budget, to dominate a season that was meant to be the most competitive season in decades. It is not difficult to imagine how badly aggrieved these teams are, knowing that things will get worse next year when more teams arrive on the scene.
The rules have to be decided, and set in stone. If the FIA are incapable of coming up with rules that make sense, and are governable properly and fairly, then they are no longer relavent as an organisation.
They are just a ten pound weight, dragging the sport under. If all Bernie Ecclestone can do is issue threats, then it seems to me that FOTA have less to lose than they thought.
These are smart men, who for years have made billions from Formula One, but have become blinded by greed and self interest. The president of the FIA has done nothing to ease the tensions, and deserves nothing less than a P45.
I would gladly watch a breakaway series, as I am so distraught at the way F1 is being lead. Its time to shut Ecclestone down, once and for all.

]]> By: Leonhttp://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/06/10/renault-and-ferrari-re-state-their-threat-not-to-compete-in-2010/comment-page-1/#comment-262501 Leon Thu, 11 Jun 2009 21:42:24 +0000 http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=21585#comment-262501 .....or perhaps they could tell Mr Ecclestone and Mr Mosley exactly what they think of the way F1 is being destroyed by FOM and FIA by calling the new seriesEFF-ORFF ? …..or perhaps they could tell Mr Ecclestone and Mr Mosley exactly what they think of the way F1 is being destroyed by FOM and FIA by calling the new series

EFF-ORFF ?

]]> By: Patricklhttp://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/06/10/renault-and-ferrari-re-state-their-threat-not-to-compete-in-2010/comment-page-1/#comment-262470 Patrickl Thu, 11 Jun 2009 20:13:36 +0000 http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=21585#comment-262470 Yeah and? Yeah and?

]]> By: guille2306http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/06/10/renault-and-ferrari-re-state-their-threat-not-to-compete-in-2010/comment-page-1/#comment-262462 guille2306 Thu, 11 Jun 2009 19:20:20 +0000 http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=21585#comment-262462 As it's ridiculous that Mosley ask the teams to commit to a massive change in the way they work, including laying off much of their personnel, on an equally short notice. And then, the new Concorde Agreement is being discussed since 2005-2006, budget cap only since January of this year... As it’s ridiculous that Mosley ask the teams to commit to a massive change in the way they work, including laying off much of their personnel, on an equally short notice. And then, the new Concorde Agreement is being discussed since 2005-2006, budget cap only since January of this year…

]]> By: Patricklhttp://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/06/10/renault-and-ferrari-re-state-their-threat-not-to-compete-in-2010/comment-page-1/#comment-262456 Patrickl Thu, 11 Jun 2009 19:12:58 +0000 http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=21585#comment-262456 The conditions that FOTA put on their entry were ridiculous. They demanded the signing of their version of a Concorde agreement till 2012. It's no surprise Mosley had no interest in signing that on such short notice. The conditions that FOTA put on their entry were ridiculous. They demanded the signing of their version of a Concorde agreement till 2012. It’s no surprise Mosley had no interest in signing that on such short notice.

]]> By: tombissethttp://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/06/10/renault-and-ferrari-re-state-their-threat-not-to-compete-in-2010/comment-page-1/#comment-262451 tombisset Thu, 11 Jun 2009 18:56:18 +0000 http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=21585#comment-262451 Reason for Ferrari and Renault quitting:t they haven't been performing as well as expected this year.Reason for Bernie sueing some of the teams:He needs to make up quickly for his losses in his recent divorce Reason for Ferrari and Renault quitting:t
they haven’t been performing as well as expected this year.

Reason for Bernie sueing some of the teams:

He needs to make up quickly for his losses in his recent divorce

]]> By: HounslowBusGaragehttp://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/06/10/renault-and-ferrari-re-state-their-threat-not-to-compete-in-2010/comment-page-1/#comment-262450 HounslowBusGarage Thu, 11 Jun 2009 18:53:23 +0000 http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=21585#comment-262450 Do I believe this, do I not believe this? <blockquote>Fernando Alonso and Luca di Montezemolo have apparently scheduled a meeting at the Circuit de la Sarthe where the famous 24 Heures du Mans will take place this weekend. The purpose of this meeting? It is whispered that the future of the Spanish driver at Ferrari will be on the agenda of this meeting! In fact, the President of Ferrari, Luca di Montezemolo who will be at Le Mans for the race to see Audi and Peugeot battle for victory, wants to meet Fernando Alonso and discuss his future. Meanwhile, the Renault F1 Team driver who will be there for pleasure did not decline this invitation.The rumour is that this secret meeting was to be explained as the two men are talking about the future of Formula 1, which has been shaken to its core following a fight between FOTA (Manufacturers Association) and the FIA. Whereas the real reason for the meeting, it is whispered, is that if a breakaway championship <strong>was</strong> to emerge next year, Ferrari would enter three cars in this new series with Felipe Massa, Kimi Raikkonen and Fernando Alonso on board. </blockquote> Do I believe this, do I not believe this?

Fernando Alonso and Luca di Montezemolo have apparently scheduled a meeting at the Circuit de la Sarthe where the famous 24 Heures du Mans will take place this weekend. The purpose of this meeting? It is whispered that the future of the Spanish driver at Ferrari will be on the agenda of this meeting!
In fact, the President of Ferrari, Luca di Montezemolo who will be at Le Mans for the race to see Audi and Peugeot battle for victory, wants to meet Fernando Alonso and discuss his future. Meanwhile, the Renault F1 Team driver who will be there for pleasure did not decline this invitation.

The rumour is that this secret meeting was to be explained as the two men are talking about the future of Formula 1, which has been shaken to its core following a fight between FOTA (Manufacturers Association) and the FIA. Whereas the real reason for the meeting, it is whispered, is that if a breakaway championship was to emerge next year, Ferrari would enter three cars in this new series with Felipe Massa, Kimi Raikkonen and Fernando Alonso on board.

]]> By: JChttp://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/06/10/renault-and-ferrari-re-state-their-threat-not-to-compete-in-2010/comment-page-1/#comment-262435 JC Thu, 11 Jun 2009 16:34:15 +0000 http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=21585#comment-262435 Then why do Bernie and co take half the money out of F1 each year? Is that seriously a fair price for the privilege of using two letters? Then why do Bernie and co take half the money out of F1 each year?
Is that seriously a fair price for the privilege of using two letters?

]]> By: Navshttp://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/06/10/renault-and-ferrari-re-state-their-threat-not-to-compete-in-2010/comment-page-1/#comment-262434 Navs Thu, 11 Jun 2009 16:28:53 +0000 http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=21585#comment-262434 Ferrari will take a branding hit if they show up with a minimal or C-team because if they do that, they'll always show up at the bottom of the charts in the WDC and WCC. The die-hard fans will know what's going on, but definitely not a casual fan.Me thinks, if they run they'll run with a reasonable team and presence. Ferrari will take a branding hit if they show up with a minimal or C-team because if they do that, they’ll always show up at the bottom of the charts in the WDC and WCC. The die-hard fans will know what’s going on, but definitely not a casual fan.

Me thinks, if they run they’ll run with a reasonable team and presence.

]]> By: 24Man'shttp://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/06/10/renault-and-ferrari-re-state-their-threat-not-to-compete-in-2010/comment-page-1/#comment-262430 24Man's Thu, 11 Jun 2009 16:03:32 +0000 http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=21585#comment-262430 What ?http://www.fanaticf1.com/formule1/8536-Alonso-Ferrari-Transferts.html What ?

http://www.fanaticf1.com/formule1/8536-Alonso-Ferrari-Transferts.html

]]> By: mp4-19http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/06/10/renault-and-ferrari-re-state-their-threat-not-to-compete-in-2010/comment-page-1/#comment-262424 mp4-19 Thu, 11 Jun 2009 15:16:31 +0000 http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=21585#comment-262424 ok guys i’m sorry about this post as its completely off topic. but i’m desperate & had no other choice, hope keith won’t mind. i guess there are some rfactor modders here. so i need some help & advice from them. i’ve some good experience in converting rfactor tracks to f1c, but my problem is the other way round conversion i.e. conversion of cars from f1c to rfactor. someone might say why convert from an old game to a new one, but i have my reasons for it. we all know that rfactor uses .gmt instead of a .mts format for the physical model & uses dds instead of bmp for images. i’m sucessfully able to convert from mts to gmt & bmp to dds & repack it into a .mas file using gmotor. now arises the problem part, i’m having problems with the .gen file (vehicle generator) which is a notepad file. how should i organize it? for example in f1c the car suspension is a single model but in rfac its split into 4 differtent parts i.e front left sus,front right,rear left & rear right. should i split the suspension using zmodeler or is there any way round? my next important question is what happens to the dds images? is repacking then it into a .mas file sufficient? will the dds file automatically associate itself with .gmt files? or is it to be done manually? if manually, how? in f1c for example the instance name for suspension is mgsuspa in rfac its called debris. so is renaming necessary for each & every .gmt file in the .gen notepad file? or will the f1c instance name suffice? i would be very grateful if someone helps me out with a tutorial. so ppl thanx in advance. i thank keith for letting me use his blog.deeply appreciate any help from anyone. plz ok guys i’m sorry about this post as its completely off topic. but i’m desperate & had no other choice, hope keith won’t mind. i guess there are some rfactor modders here. so i need some help & advice from them. i’ve some good experience in converting rfactor tracks to f1c, but my problem is the other way round conversion i.e. conversion of cars from f1c to rfactor. someone might say why convert from an old game to a new one, but i have my reasons for it. we all know that rfactor uses .gmt instead of a .mts format for the physical model & uses dds instead of bmp for images. i’m sucessfully able to convert from mts to gmt & bmp to dds & repack it into a .mas file using gmotor. now arises the problem part, i’m having problems with the .gen file (vehicle generator) which is a notepad file. how should i organize it? for example in f1c the car suspension is a single model but in rfac its split into 4 differtent parts i.e front left sus,front right,rear left & rear right. should i split the suspension using zmodeler or is there any way round? my next important question is what happens to the dds images? is repacking then it into a .mas file sufficient? will the dds file automatically associate itself with .gmt files? or is it to be done manually? if manually, how? in f1c for example the instance name for suspension is mgsuspa in rfac its called debris. so is renaming necessary for each & every .gmt file in the .gen notepad file? or will the f1c instance name suffice? i would be very grateful if someone helps me out with a tutorial. so ppl thanx in advance. i thank keith for letting me use his blog.

deeply appreciate any help from anyone. plz

]]> By: persemprehttp://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/06/10/renault-and-ferrari-re-state-their-threat-not-to-compete-in-2010/comment-page-1/#comment-262414 persempre Thu, 11 Jun 2009 14:26:56 +0000 http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=21585#comment-262414 but not necessarily as FIA Championships with regualtions made by the FIA. The many International Series that run (for instance A1GP, GP2, Porshe Supercup, DTM, Le Mans etc.) make their own regs. There`s a big difference. The list of <a href="http://www.fia.com/en-GB/sport/championships/Pages/Championships.aspx" rel="nofollow">actual FIA Championships is here</a> but not necessarily as FIA Championships with regualtions made by the FIA.
The many International Series that run (for instance A1GP, GP2, Porshe Supercup, DTM, Le Mans etc.) make their own regs.
There`s a big difference.
The list of actual FIA Championships is here

]]> By: Mouse Nightshirthttp://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/06/10/renault-and-ferrari-re-state-their-threat-not-to-compete-in-2010/comment-page-1/#comment-262404 Mouse Nightshirt Thu, 11 Jun 2009 13:44:10 +0000 http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=21585#comment-262404 I suspect we'll see a list that has Williams, Force India, Ferrari and the new teams on it to start. After that, I reckon the FIA will not allow Renault in to prove a point, because at the end of the day, as much as we love seeing historic teams, the public don't care enough about the midfield. I suspect we’ll see a list that has Williams, Force India, Ferrari and the new teams on it to start. After that, I reckon the FIA will not allow Renault in to prove a point, because at the end of the day, as much as we love seeing historic teams, the public don’t care enough about the midfield.

]]> By: persemprehttp://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/06/10/renault-and-ferrari-re-state-their-threat-not-to-compete-in-2010/comment-page-1/#comment-262399 persempre Thu, 11 Jun 2009 12:50:53 +0000 http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=21585#comment-262399 Meanwhile.... http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/76013It looks like this is an 'OK get on with it but we want the world to know you`vegot absolutely nothing to do with us' to me. Meanwhile….
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/76013

It looks like this is an ‘OK get on with it but we want the world to know you`vegot absolutely nothing to do with us’ to me.

]]> By: DGR-F1http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/06/10/renault-and-ferrari-re-state-their-threat-not-to-compete-in-2010/comment-page-1/#comment-262397 DGR-F1 Thu, 11 Jun 2009 12:12:55 +0000 http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=21585#comment-262397 Max has said at least twice that if the FOTA group want to set up a new series, they will have support from the FIA. Surely this is a barbed gesture, since FOTA are trying to get away from FIA control. Or maybe Max really does take everyone for fools..... Max has said at least twice that if the FOTA group want to set up a new series, they will have support from the FIA.
Surely this is a barbed gesture, since FOTA are trying to get away from FIA control.
Or maybe Max really does take everyone for fools…..

]]> By: persemprehttp://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/06/10/renault-and-ferrari-re-state-their-threat-not-to-compete-in-2010/comment-page-1/#comment-262391 persempre Thu, 11 Jun 2009 11:43:55 +0000 http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=21585#comment-262391 Mosley is meeting the teams in London today. Mosley is meeting the teams in London today.

]]> By: Ronmanhttp://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/06/10/renault-and-ferrari-re-state-their-threat-not-to-compete-in-2010/comment-page-1/#comment-262390 Ronman Thu, 11 Jun 2009 11:37:42 +0000 http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=21585#comment-262390 How many people here will stop accessing F1 Fanatic if Fota Drop out of F1?is it only me that is curious to see what might happen if the split actually happens?For me, personally, i am looking forward to see how a capped F1 will look like, and in case of split, i'm gagging to find out what the teams will come up with as a formula... unlimited revs, derestricted aero.... one tyre, limited fuel, the possibilities are endless, and if they produce racing like we see in DTM... that would be beneficial to all.BUT>>>> wont they need the FIA's approval in order to run a sport? isn't it a world order that any motor sport should run under FIA authority? How many people here will stop accessing F1 Fanatic if Fota Drop out of F1?

is it only me that is curious to see what might happen if the split actually happens?

For me, personally, i am looking forward to see how a capped F1 will look like, and in case of split, i’m gagging to find out what the teams will come up with as a formula… unlimited revs, derestricted aero…. one tyre, limited fuel, the possibilities are endless, and if they produce racing like we see in DTM… that would be beneficial to all.

BUT>>>> wont they need the FIA’s approval in order to run a sport? isn’t it a world order that any motor sport should run under FIA authority?

]]> By: persemprehttp://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/06/10/renault-and-ferrari-re-state-their-threat-not-to-compete-in-2010/comment-page-1/#comment-262387 persempre Thu, 11 Jun 2009 11:11:12 +0000 http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/?p=21585#comment-262387 & now there`s a rumour that Superfund may have been struck off the list for having an unpaid debt relating to motor racing of nearly 4m euros. & now there`s a rumour that Superfund may have been struck off the list for having an unpaid debt relating to motor racing of nearly 4m euros.

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