Webber and Vettel lose one-two finish for Red Bull after collision (Poll)

Vettel spins off after colliding with team mate Webber

Vettel spins off after colliding with team mate Webber

Red Bull threw away a potential one-two finish in the Turkish Grand Prix after their drivers collided while leading.

Sebastian Vettel had pulled alongside team mate Mark Webber on the straight approaching turn 12 when the two made contact.

The collision put Vettel out on the spot. Mark Webber continued but had to pit to replace a damaged front wing and eventually finished third.

The pair were under pressure from Lewis Hamilton’s McLaren when they hit each other, and the accident let Hamilton by into the lead.

Vettel went down the inside of Webber as they blasted from turn 11 to turn 12. As Vettel drew past he moved towards Webber and the pair made contact. Vettel spun off with a burst tyre.

Afterwards Vettel said:

I was able to go quicker the two or three laps before. I had the corner on the left and was just trying to focus on braking point and all of a sudden I lost the car. You can see on the television we made contact.

I’m not kind of guy that pushes all the fault to one guy we are a team.
Sebastian Vettel

Webber explained what happened in the press conference:

Seb had big top speed advantage, he went down the inside and we were side by side for a while.

The he turned pretty quick right and we made contact. It happened very, very fast. It’s a shame for the team, it’s obviously not an ideal day.

There was long way to go in race, it wasn’t a guaranteed victory. But but it was an interesting few metres and in the end it wasn’t the result either of us want.
Mark Webber

Team boss Christian Horner said he was “disappointed” by the collision, adding “we handed 43 points to McLaren on a plate.”

Afterwards Lewis Hamilton said Vettel’s move on Webber was the same as one Vettel made on him when he tried to pass Vettel at the same place earlier in the race.

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416 comments on Webber and Vettel lose one-two finish for Red Bull after collision (Poll)

  1. F1NATIC said on 30th May 2010, 19:47

    I guess I voted wrong, but it seemed to me (after a close inspection, Webber touched Vettel first on the side-pod causing Vettels car to swerve and make contact with the back wheels. Hope this doesn’t happen again between them, but what really enraged me more was handing the victory to Mclaren. Although I would have loved to see Button and Hamilton take each other out in those maneuvers that followed after the Red Bull self-destruction

  2. Ben Curly said on 30th May 2010, 19:55

    Helmut Marko is a weird guy, basically he says: “we do not favour Vettel, but Mark should let him by”.

    No, the guy who initiates the manoeuvre must plan ahead a little bit. His explanation was, that obviously Vettel had to turn into Webber, after all “he cannot brake on the dirt because for sure he knows what happens”. Yeah, “for sure” he knows.

    Vettel “for sure” knew that this overtaking attempt would put him on the dirt side of the track. That was the risk he was taking. Mark gave him enough room on track. Yes, it was the dirty side, but there was a plenty of room and Seb “for sure” didn’t have to crash into Webber.

    • there was lots of room if you watch the stuff unravel from a normal side view (in replay)… what was he thinking…. and he never apoligises.. very unsportsmanlike, noone will like him on the paddock

  3. Gusto said on 30th May 2010, 20:05

    Good old Redbull. Laugh, I nearly got the Beers In.

  4. Gusto said on 30th May 2010, 20:25

    Seriously though, It was Webbers fault, Vettel was through an on to Him, To squeeze another car is one thing but to do it to your team mate is unforgiveable. Theres a word Iam looking for an it ryhmes with cat.

  5. to sum up,as those guys on TimesOnline said:

    T H wrote:
    “Vettel was alongside Webber when he took him out.
    Webber held position whilst Vettel drifted to the right.
    …”

    and

    Some Guy wrote:
    “Nice work Button glad to see someone trying to keep the fans happy.. Lewis held firm and gave him as good as he got. Well done guys.. Unlucky webber.. You desereved the race.”

  6. DaveW said on 30th May 2010, 20:43

    I won’t wait for Keith to post the headline: RedBull Been Caught. Since Spain, it has been clear that McLaren had the race pace to keep RBR honest, and here we saw Webber holding Hamilton up from the beginning. It was wishful thinking to imagine that this team could be hauled in, etc. Let’s remember that last year, Turkey was Button’s last win, and it was the end of Brawn dominance. So it is again.

    RBR lost the titles due to persistent bungling last year. This time, they are the quarry. Only now, they have squandered their speed coming in to this inflection point and built no points advantages, despite taking each pole position, and their bungling shows now sign of ending. Stick a fork in RBR. They have to hope VMM self-destruct as their drivers clash.

  7. RubinhoFan said on 30th May 2010, 20:51

    Vettel is clearly Red Bulls Darling.

    I think Christian Horner was expecting Webber to give away the position to Vettel.

    Webber held his line. Otherwise he would have lost the lead and would have come under from Hamilton for straying off course. I quite like Red Bull but the way Horner was siding with Vettel, I have lost respect for him. If Mark was in Vettels position at the time of the incident and came to the pitwall I dont think he would get the same treatment as Vettel. Vettel was at fault by not treating Webber with enough respect. Vettels Fault

  8. RubinhoFan said on 30th May 2010, 20:53

    *sorry meant to add “Pressure” between under and from.

  9. Ricardo said on 30th May 2010, 20:57

    I am sorry for Red Bull F1 racing team and members, sorry Webber and specially for Adrian Newey whom provided one the best design of F1 cars of 009 and 2010. The presion on Seb was huge and the error was even bigger!!
    I am not on favor of team orders but someone must put some directions within Red Bull team.
    In the old days (10 for 1st …) 1 point was around 1.000.000 euros so …
    Red Bull could have 45 points and McL just 25 but McL got 45 and RB just 15 … 50 points lost over the table.
    Seb … that not the way to do it!!

  10. David Johnson said on 30th May 2010, 21:07

    Really dissapointed with Red bull management seeming to blame Webber for not letting the faster Vettel through…people watch f1 primarly to watch racers race…loads of respect to the efforts the teams put in…but when a driver can be cold and calculating over whats best for the team when racing wheel to wheel with his main rival for the championship at 180 mph…is when robots take over the world and when I stop watching f1…

    p.s. Can Vettel consistently make a proper pass stick on a relatively fast car ? Or is he just a very quick time trialer.

  11. Martin said on 30th May 2010, 21:12

    Well i guess we’ll never know where vettel saved his fuel. But you have to wonder….

    He was slow for the first stint, and Webber was holding back hamilton on his own. As a result Vettel is able to take back second position due to hamilton’s slow pit stop.

    Nice team strategy for Vettel to use the extra power to take on Webber.

  12. Horacio said on 30th May 2010, 22:28

    For what it worth, and I don’t know if someone else did mention it, but watching the video through Vettel’s onboard camera, it is possible to see that he approached Webber and first he tried to overtake on the right side, but suddently choose the left one, where there was enough place to go…

  13. Captain Caveman said on 30th May 2010, 22:29

    I think we may be missing a trick here, as the fact that the incident is not being investigated by the stewards indicates that no driver operated outside of the rules and thus it is just a racing incident.

    The issue now is due to it being an internal team investigation as to how they lost 45 odd points to Mclaren. and from their (RBR) perspective both driver are genuinely at equal fault.

    One driver got the jump on the other, and was partially ahead. other driver applied pressure which could be regarded as futile and only going to lead to an incident. ( crashing or both cars missing the apex)

    i am content that both drivers know they could both have backed out and are claiming innocents as per the FIA rules….. which is true they are……

    BUT BUT, They both know they screeeeweeed up as far as team tactics are concerned. RBR see the constructors as priority and then drivers and secondary…..

    • Sandman said on 30th May 2010, 23:03

      Its 44 points, actually.

      Also, it clearly WAS a racing incident. None of the drivers made a deliberate move to crash into another, and while Vettel was the one ahead, he was also the one to hit Webber, not vice versa.

      I fail to see what kind of pressure did Webber apply. He was driving in a straight line. If you watch replays closely, its Vettel who moves his steering wheel.

      Gotta agree though, they failed bigtime. When you’re heading for 1-2, you do not drive like this without 100% certainty you will be able to back down.

  14. Palle said on 30th May 2010, 22:41

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CniP2hpXx7Y&feature=related
    This link shows the racing line Webber should have followed or would have followed had Vettel not been there. Other race simulations by other drivers also show that Webber did not follow his racing line, but drove defensively against Vettel.
    Clearly Webber did not move over towards the right side of the track as Vettel would have expected him to do. Instead he was leaving Vettel less and less room to brake but on the dirty side and enter the turn correctly.
    And as RB indicated that they had instructed their drivers to give each other room, the incident was mostly Webbers fault.
    Also if your team mate is half a car in front of You, probably You should give him room.

  15. Captain Caveman said on 30th May 2010, 22:55

    excellent vid, especially as webber states on turn 12 there is an opportunity to overtake on the inside :-) ……

    i believe the incident happened on turn 12… but may be wrong

    • Palle said on 30th May 2010, 23:12

      Yes, it happened exactly there, where Webber says it is possible to overtake on the inside, and You can see that he dosen’t follow the race line, but squeezes Vettel to the right instead:
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YiIc-A–iNU
      Only by comparing the two videos, can we get rid of the widespread misunderstanding that Webber just “held his line” – he did not. If the other car had not been a team-mate, then maybee OK, but in this case I fully agree with Horner: Move!

      • djdaveyp said on 30th May 2010, 23:38

        Webber did hold his line.His i]line at this particular time just happened to be a defensive one. he is perfectly within his rights to defend his position. He has defended much harder in the past (Abu Dhabi 2009) without crashing because the driver following him (Jenson Button) was talented enough to know how to race! Mark Webber is brilliant defensively, probably his strongest attribute.

        Vettel messed it up by trying to intimidate somebody who can’t be intimidated!

      • David said on 31st May 2010, 2:54

        good grief, Palle. You’re clueless. “Holding your line” doesn’t just mean the racing line. It means staying in the same spot on the track, relative to the edges of the road. And that’s what Webber did. Vettel turned right, Webber had his wheel straight and even turned right himself to try and avoid the accident.

        • Palle said on 31st May 2010, 10:07

          If You were paying the two gentlemens sallery You would probably not see it that way. They are teammates, Vettel is faster in this situation, Webber should have given him space to avoid the dirtiest area and then tried to overtake him, when and if Vettel would overshoot at the turn. As the team clearly has told the drivers to give each other space, Webber is at fault in this case – if you are a teamboss, and not a Webber fan.
          Case Vettel vs Kubica it was clearly Vettels fault – just to state that I’m not taking Vettels side in any case.
          I’m sure the two McLaren drivers also knew they were up for a serious talk with their boss, which is why the 3 didn’t nook overly happy at the podium.

          • MouseNightshirt said on 1st June 2010, 0:15

            No he should not have just given way.

            Mark had track position. The pass is not complete until Car B has completely passed Car A. So what if Vettel was “faster” (which he wasn’t until the whole fuel thing happened) – that’s no reason to let someone by.

            They’re racing to become world champions, not be everyone’s best mate.

            Mark was perfectly within his rights to hold that line. It’s Vettel’s responsibility to be sensible. Nothing was stopping him from braking on the line he was already on rather than trying to barge across.

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