Should Massa stay at Ferrari? (Poll)

Posted on | Author Keith Collantine

These are tough times for Felipe Massa.

His return from injury this year has seen him more often than not struggling for pace compared to new team mate Fernando Alonso. And he’s already suffered a racing driver’s ultimate indignity – being told to get out of his team mate’s way.

He signed a fresh two-year deal with the Scuderia earlier this year. But can he really stand another two years like this one?


It’s hard to make a case for any driver leaving a top team when there are so few race-winning seats available in Formula 1.

Massa only likely alternative might be at Renault alongside Robert Kubica – so that could just be a case of exchanging one devastatingly fast team mate for another.

He should stay put and hope next year’s change to Pirelli tyres works in his favour – much like Schumacher is. And he should keep in mind how the switch from Michelin to Bridgestone unsettled Alonso in 2007.


Massa is no stranger to having a world champion as a team mate. Before Alonso showed up his last three team mates were Jacques Villeneuve, Michael Schumacher and Kimi R??ikk??nen.

Villeneuve gave him little trouble, Schumacher provided valuable learning opportunities and he and R??ikk??nen were well-matched in their two-and-a-half years together. But Alonso has beaten him on pace and relegated him to a supporting role.

Massa’s situation now looks a lot like Jarno Trull’si in 2004. It’s time to do what Trulli did: find a new home and let someone else help Alonso win his championships.

I say

Some say that after his awful crash last year Massa will never be the same driver again and his performances this year are evidence of that. Only he can know that for sure.

My interest in this matter is entirely selfish – I want to see the top seats in F1 occupied by drivers who are going to fight to win races. Looking at Massa’s performance at Suzuka and Hockenheim this year, I’m not convinced that’s the case.

In the run-up to Suzuka Massa denied he had made a comment about not wanting to become a new Rubens Barrichello. He may not have said it, but I suspect that’s exactly what will happen to him if he stays at Ferrari.

You say

Do you think Massa should stay at Ferrari? Why? And what do his supporters think? Cast your vote and have your say below.

Should Massa stay at Ferrari?

  • Yes (39%)
  • No (61%)

Total Voters: 3,209

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289 comments on “Should Massa stay at Ferrari? (Poll)”

  1. I am an anti Alonso and anti Ferrari person, but I like Massa as a driver and if Ferrari were to win a race I would like it to be with Massa.

    With that established I would hate to see Massa become a ‘Rubens’ too Alonso, and I personally don’t believe he has the skill to match Alonso so I would like him to move to a different team were he still is able to compete for podiums and not be smashed by his team mate (kubica and Renault is then not such a good idea) so maybe Williams pairing alongside the Hulk.

    1. I forgot to mention that I remember reading somewhere Sam Michaels quoted something along the lines of “Next years car will be completely different to the FW32”, so maybe that could be Massa’s big break?

      1. And Nico Hulkenberg might loose his seat obviously so Williams could be a ex-ferrari 2nd drivers team :D

        1. Maybe Williams would keep the Hulk in a tester role instead if they could get Massa.
          Rubens might help him have the best chance at managing the new tyres well with his setup skills and Massa would have a shot at taking the next Williams win.

          Does not sound too bad. An exchange with Webber might be a nice one if/when Webber falls out with RBR management for rather pushing to keep Vettel on his tail instead of giving him the best shot at the WDC this year.

          1. “Maybe Williams would keep the Hulk in a tester role instead if they could get Massa.”

            That would be a complete waste of Hulkenberg’s talents though due to the lack of testing. Williams also need cash apparently so if they get shot of him it should be for money. Hulkenberg is the future.

            I think Massa’s best chance at Williams would be if Rubens left but Williams love him and he loves F1 still. Nice idea though.

    2. I think Force India could be a great seat for him, the team have the money and drive to do ‘the Red Bull’, and at the moment are struggling to find that next step to take them to fighting for wins and podiums on a regular basis and a driver with Massa’s experience could be a brilliant match.

      I would love to see him in a Williams but its been confirmed that Rubens is there next season and its Hulk’s seat that is possibly up for grabs and I can’t see Williams taking two expensive older drivers.

      1. Not sure about that, I get the feeling Force India is on the decline. They’ve lost quite a lot of key personnel and don’t seem to be great at developing the car based on this year’s trend line.

        I wouldn’t be surprised if Lotus and maybe Sauber as well jumps ahead of them next year

    3. Agree 100%. I don’t think Massa has *any* chance now, if he ever had (which I doubt), of competing on a level playing field with Alonso. I agree his pace has let him down this year, and this may well have to do with last year’s crash, but he has shown an ability to grow and fight back over his career. But he won’t get the chance at Ferrari.

      In return (revenge!) I want to see Alonso against Kubica. I mean, badly want to see! It’d be Ham v. Alonso again, only with Kubica even less inclined to cede ground to Alonso’s politicking in the garage and just as determined to beat him on track. So has Alonso the cojones to take on that challenge?

      1. Except that Alonso and Kubica are supposedly good friends off the track, which would make the dynamic very different to Alonso-Hamilton or Alonso-Massa. It would be great to see if that friendship could endure the inevitable battles that would take place within the team.

      2. Kubica is way overated. Heidfeld had his number when they raced together and Heidfeld is an also run. Petrov makes him look way better than he really is. On Massa, you must remember that he had no trouble to outpace Kimi — during the time they raced together he won more races and scored more points than the Finn. It is a bad year for him, but perhaps we could hold our judgement till the end of 2011? I never understood the sort of negative reaction that Massa has among some F1 fans. Is he a bad driver? Well, Hamilton won his 2008 championship over him by a single point that he got in the last curve of the last race of the season in a much more reliable car. If Hamilton is a good driver, Massa cannot be that bad.

        1. You can’t consider the Heidfeld issue. Kubica would’ve been way ahead of Nick in 2009 if he hadn’t had technical issues.

        2. Really I don’t see how you compare Kubica to Heidfeld? But no place to develop more on this.
          However what Kubica did in BMW – worked hard and won strong position in german team – is exactly opposite to Massa – he took it easy until Alonso’s performance relegated him to merely a helper.

        3. Antifia, I certainly agree Massa is a good driver, he indeed came as close as possible to winning the WDC in 2008 and putting aside the final race, lost partly because of Ferrari errors during the season. But cam he compete viably at Ferrari now? As for Kubica, I don’t see him as way overrated, at all. There’s always a small queue for ‘fastest driver,’ but the three current drivers who really push to the limit and beyond are, I’d say, Hamilton, Alonso and Kubica. That’s why any of them in a team pairing would be (was) fascinating and potentially explosive.

          1. 2008 lost because of Ferrari errors? how about his spin off at Sepang & Australia? The only reason he was even close to Kimi was because he had his entire entourage at every race and race engineer rob smedley giving him Kimis information and the Ferrari garage backing him with upgrades and strategy(always qualifed light & last). Anytime, Kimi had better qualifying he owned Massa in 2008. Massa should never have been in a ferrari.

        4. I completely agree with you on Kubica. The only semi-decent team-mate he had for any sustained period of time beat him more often than not.

    4. felipe massa fan
      17th October 2010, 17:24

      massa is a good driver but the only reason he is slower than alonzo is because of the tyres.

      and massa is a team player and has only retired from one gp this season.

      massa WDC 2011
      FERRARI WCC 2011

      1. Sorry I didn’t realize that Massa was the only driver in F1 to be given the slowest tyres in the paddock…………….

        You should help him come up with a better excuse!!! It will help him when he cries…………

        1. Nah, Schumacher’s had them all year as well!

      2. I like him too, but I share a view of those who say he underperforms, compared to the potential of the car he drives.
        I don’t know if for him it is time to consider to leave – next season could turn better for him and he could prove to be equal to Alonso.
        For me he doesn’t perform well enough having such a car. He is just a few points ahead of Rosberg and Kubica who had much more troubles to cope with the entire season and were also unfairly unlucky several times.

    5. ‘It’s hard to make a case for any driver leaving a top team when there are so few race-winning seats available in Formula 1’.

      It’s not so hard when Massa isn’t allowed to win; and otherwise isn’t quick enough with Alonso in the sister car!

      Massa is now Alonso’s poodle. Quite apart from Massa’s justification, that moving over once will forestall it ever happening again, moving over has set a precedent which Ferrari is bound to follow.

      That’s why Massa should leave Ferrari. And Ferrari should get rid of him because he’s too far behind Alonso’s pace to either help him very often or score good points for the WCC. A simple decision for all concerned.

      Re Kirby, Kubica ‘looks’ very good and makes few mistakes because he has a good, much underrated car, and a bad, pay-driver team-mate. This equates to seemingly good results with a pressure free enviromnment.

      But this is the same Kubica who was very often beaten by ”Quick’ Nick’ Heidfeld. To equate Kubica with Hamilton or Alonso, etc., therefore, as Mark Hughes has for the BBC, is unjustifiable.

  2. Yes but only because he has more of a chance at winning the WDC at Ferrari then Renault which as Keith says is his only other option for a competitive drive.

    1. I had to say yes, and I agree with you.

      Unfortunately his best chance at winning the WDC is probably with Ferrari… Maybe he can out stay Alonso?
      Ferrari is a powerful team, and if things go his way next year, things just might pan out in his favour…

      1. I reckon he needs to tough it out for one more year and see how he works with the new tyres & car. If 2011 goes the same way as this year, he’ll have little option but to get out.

        But it’s reckless to leave now just because he’s struggled with the Bridgestone hards pre-Hockenheim and his head’s dropped a little post-Hockenheim. I reckon he still has it in him to fight for another championship, although I wouldn’t be surprised if 2008 turned out to ultimately be his best opportunity.

  3. I like Felipe so much, but it has to be said that he’s become a second league driver, certainly not on par with likes of Alonso, Hamilton, Vettel or Kubica.

    Regarding possible Renault seat – don’t forget that somebody will have to go to Ferrari, so theoretically if Scuderia wants to have too competitive drivers, they may opt for Massa-Kubica exchange. No “devastatingly fast team mate” left in Renault with that scenario.

    1. *two instead of too ;)

    2. Unfortunately the Scuderia’s track record has never suggested that they like having two competitive drivers. So I don’t see a Massa-Kubica exchange ever happening, even if Kubica becomes completely disillusioned with Renault in the next 3 races.

      1. I think it is quite possible, because otherwise I have some diffculty to understand why Felipe managed to stay in that team for so long. Or maybe becasue they knew he is tolerant when driving alongside someone of champion’s ambitions?

  4. Tough question. On the one hand I would like to see more of him (he’s very quiet out there) and perhaps we would see more of him at Renault.

    But then again who knows what next year will bring. Alonso has clearly out-performed him this year but is this a result of missing half of last season and perhaps missing out on some pre-season development for 2010?

    If I was him i’d give it another year at would seem fairer to base your future on that.

    1. Did you read the interview with Sid Watkins in this month’s F1 Racing?

      Watkins thinks it takes two years to recover from a significant brain injury – he thinks Massa came back too quickly. By this standard, I think Massa needs to stick it out and see what happens next season.

      1. Massa had to come back. Any more time lost and he’d have been too slow in his comeback (not to mention he might not have a seat to come back to). If this slight loss of pace is down to his brain injury recuperation, then it was probably the better decision to tough it now and be back at 100% next year.

        1. Agreed – he had to come back. And I’m just looking forward to seeing how he performs next year.

          Could any driver could beat an on-form Alonso using the same equipment?

          1. Hamilton did.

            I think Massa could get much closer to Alonso, possibly ahead depending on Alonso’s error count, but it all depends on how he goes in qualifying, that’s what’s let him down this year the most.

          2. But did Hamilton beat an on-form Alonso?

            He certainly beat Alonso in 2007, albeit only on countback with equal points, but I’m not sure Alonso was at the very top of his game all year. ’07 was the first year of the Bridgestone control tyres, and Alonso, Raikkonen and Kubica (all used to Michelin’s very different tyre) struggled to adapt their driving styles. By contrast, Hamilton struggled with Michelins in testing (destroying a McLaren in a major testing shunt) and was significantly slower than Alonso but felt much more at home once the control Bridgestones became available.

            The season may have panned out very differently had Michelin remained in the sport for another year. The result may not have been much different, as the best drivers always adapt sooner or later. But I don’t think it’s right to say Alonso was fully “in the zone” for at least the first half of the season.

          3. Well, any argument over Alonso’s form is nullified by the fact that Hamilton was a rookie.

          4. A rookie beating the reigning double world champion.

          5. Not really – the point was whether or not Alonso was at the top of his game when he was beaten by the narrowest of margins in ’07.

            The fact that Hamilton was a rookie at the time is irrelevant.

          6. Actually it is relevant, because the fact that Lewis was a rookie suggests that he wasn’t at the top of his game. There’s no point saying “well Alonso wasn’t on form on 07 so that’s why Lewis beat him” and then brush off the claim that Lewis wasn’t as good then as he is now.

          7. yeah but has lewis ever driven as well as those first 10 races. in terms of speed and consistency?

            No is the only answer. that was lewis peak so far.

            and fernando lowest. and they finished equal.

          8. They finished equal because Hamilton was nowhere near as consistent in the second half of the season. And I’d say that throughout 2007 Alonso was driving better than say, 2010 until Monza. So he certainly wasn’t at his worst, not when he was the double reigning champ.

          9. yeah but it was certainly lewis peak season. and not alonso’s. that was the question and thats the answer. credit to him for taking on a double champ and nearly beating him and taking the title. but has he ever been as good since? he looked like he had return to that level at the start of season but since mid way has been pretty iffy.

            lewis has now made more mistakes this seasons than fernando. alonso errors were china, monaco practice(tho99% that would not of damaged a chassis) and silverstone. and mis timing spa/malaysia qualy. Melbourne was buttons fault. alonso never changed his line and had michael on the left. button wasnt even alongside and braked along the inside in wet. racing incident but buttons error. that was michael and fernando’s corner 100%

            lets not forget lewis also clipped other drivers on first laps at valencia and silverstone. but got away with it as was the peoples wheels he hit. and of course he has been lucky to escape pens at china and malayasia where he got warnings where others later in season had penalties. unsafe pit release in canada, lucky boy but great save in spa, and of course the mistakes recently. so he is lucky to have the points that he does

            he is great, but what made him so so good in 07 was he ability to know when to back off and get the points and more importantly podiums. and since the day he slid off at china he has never found that consistency again. he may, fernando seemed to have lost it early doors this season. but now seems back to 05-06 form.

          10. The only way Hamilton could keep up with Alonso was because of uncle/dad Ron ;)
            He’s with the team for 10 years now, he’s British driving for a British team. Any other driver, regardsless of being a champion, will always be second to him at McLaren.

          11. That’s obviously not the case or they wouldn’t have let Button take points off him in China, would they? Button himself has said he would quit if he was forced into a number two role so that’s clearly not what is going on there.

          12. @ Keith

            Keith, logic will eventually catch up with you. If Button’s remark

            “Button himself has said he would quit if he was forced into a number two role so that’s clearly not what is going on there.”

            is the ultimate evidence of no #1 and # 2 drivers at McLaren, then the comment from Massa that he is not a second Barrichelo puts an end to the story. There is no #1 and # at Ferrari.

            Unless you put a different value on Jensons and Felipe’s word for whatever reason (nationality, hair colour, height, you name it), that I do not think it is the case, isn’t it?

          13. @Bren- it’s pretty clear that he’s been “iffy” because Mclaren have fallen behind in the development race compared to the other big two teams.

            Slapping a wall at Monaco in Saturday Practice will almost always cause damage that can’t be repaired within the couple of hours before qualifying. You also forgot the Fuji 07 style crash Alonso had when he was nowhere in Spa’s race, and his poor handling of backmarkers which got the Mclarens to mug him in Canada.

            @Astonished- For this season at least, there is a number 1 and 2 driver at Ferrari. Massa’s only saying that to make himself feel better.

            @Kimster- No, just no.

          14. @ David A

            I guess you know Jenson personally so well that you are sure that he is not “only saying that to make himself feel better.” as well..

            Otherwise I think we have different standards for different people.

            I, personally, give very little value to what the drivers say to the press, but, apparently it was not the case for Keith. At least regargding Jenson.

          15. Look at the championship table. Then you’ll see that Jenson has the results and to back up his words.

          16. @David

            If the worth of a driver’s word is how much backed up by the point table they are, then the most trustworthy is Mark “not bad for a #2 driver” Weber, Closely followed by Alonso, Vettel, Hamilton and then Button.

            I doubt that you would respect more what Fernando “SuperEgo” Alonso says over Lewis (now that I know that you are his fan and not Buttons’)…

          17. I don’t have to be a Hamilton fan to appreciate that he defeated Alonso as a newbie in 2007.

            When you’re pointing out that you’re not a number 2 driver, you’ve got to back it up with your actions.

            Button, by being Mr. Consistent, is driving enough like a number 1 driver to back up his actions.

            Webber, who was kidding when he said “not bad for a #2 driver” has clearly demonstrated with his 4 wins that he can be a #1 driver this year.

            Massa on the other hand says he isn’t a #2, but definately drove like one in Suzuka. Alonso is just too good for him.

        2. He couldn’t win really. He must have seen this coming to be fair..but I still feel for him!

      2. That’s interesting Cari. That might be a good background to have a go at it next year with better condition and brand new Pirellis to show he car really do it again after 2008.

        1. I’d definitely recommend picking up a copy. If only for the Senna quotes. Well worth a read.

      3. Hakkinen was doing just fine though.

    2. same goes for JV his best season was his rookie one. tho he won title in 97, he made many more errors in it.

      sometimes it goes like that. actually quite often. a rookie is free from pressure and expectation. sadly for lewis when pressure comes on he makes errors. 07, 08 and now. its his one and only weakness.

      where as fernando gets stronger under pressure. 05(imola!) turkey(06), monza(07), singapore(10). alonso weakness is making errors with not much pressure. like china this year.

      1. I will reply to some general comments relating to Lewis and Alonso.

        Allegation 1: Lewis’s first year was his best.

        I don’t think that Lewis’s first year was clearly his best year. It was astonishing, yes: to beat his team-mate qua reigning double world champion. Lewis also made some stellar overtaking manoeuvres; and showed wet-weather prowess. He was just a rookie. In 2008, once more, Lewis had the second best car. But this time he became WDC. Despite the fact that the FIA were seemingly out to get him, giving him more penalties in one year than had been given to any other driver in F1 history. Despite the fact that he was racing both Ferrari drivers who were teaming up on him, swapping positions, playing tactics, etc. Despite the fact that his team-mate was too slow to help him. He once again made many masterful overtaking manoeuvres. He also became the first driver since Senna to win a wet race by over a minute (not even Schumi managed this). Lewis also coped with the most extreme pressure to win the world championship on the last corner of the last lap of the last race. So, as good as beating Alonso was, perhaps Lewis was even better in 08? Or what about 09? When he achieving some great results in one of the worst cars McLaren have probably ever produced. This was the year he really matured a lot. Or what about ’10, where until Monza Lewis hadn’t made a single mistake all year; in contrast to Alonso, who had made pretty much one a race till then. In short, it’s very difficult to say which was Lewis’s best year: they’re all so good.

        Allegation 2: Fernando gets stronger under pressure!

        Let’s not forget that Alonso first left Renault because he claimed that the team didn’t want him to win the championship and that Fisi wasn’t helping him enough! Alonso then went to McLaren and couldn’t beat Lewis and so demanded no: 1 status by blackmailing the team with the Ferrari data scandal! This is a ridiculous allegation. Especially when Alonso has admitted to his having ‘made many mistakes this year [2010]’. Let’s recap a few: in Bahrain he was out-qualified by the lowly Massa; in Australia he collided with Button; in Malaysia he didn’t overrule the team and thus didn’t set a time early in qualifying before the much anticipated rain fell (McLaren boys guilty here also); in China he jumped the start; in Monaco he crashed in practice and couldn’t qualify; in Valencia he was ‘mugged’ by Kobayashi; etc. Be fair, guys. Alonso has made a huge amount of mistakes this year; mistakes that he attributes to pressure. In contrast, Lewis has made only one real mistake: hitting Massa. Otherwise, he’s been flawless; his car, hopeless.

        Allegation 3: 2007 was not a genuine assessment of Alonso’s talent!?

        It’s said that Alonso found it really difficult to adapt to the new rubber and this is one of the key reasons that Lewis was right with him. Well, as the reigning double-world champion, you should be able to adapt quickly to new circumstances. If you can’t, that can only be a negative in itself. Besides, Lewis had to adapt to the new rubber as well! In fact, Lewis wasn’t familiar with the tyres; an F1 car in general; the various demands of F1 racing; most of the tracks; even the steering wheel settings! Alonso had no such disadvantages. Yet Lewis was right with Alonso from the very first race: even passing him into the first corner before finishing a very respectable 11 seconds back. By the end of the season, Lewis had proven himself to be a better overtaker and wet weather driver; crucially, he finished ahead of Alonso in the WDC. Another objection Alonso fans raise is that their man fell out with Ron. Well, that only happened around Hungary, despite rifts opening in Monaco when McLaren favoured Alonso over Lewis. And, during that first part of the season, Lewis was right with, if not ahead of, Alonso. Moreover, once more, Alonso’s rift with Ron can only be viewed as a negative in itself. For Alonso fell out with Ron by blackmailing the McLaren team after Alonso couldn’t beat Hamilton on the track! That Alonso did this is a further mark against him as a man and a driver. One final point. Look how much rookies improve from their first years. Lewis will have improved considerably, in various different ways, from 2007. Alonso won’t have improved much, if at all. Lewis is some way of his peak! Alonso is probably past his peak now.

        1. Anything Lewis has done wrong or Fernando right? Even by coincidence?

          Im accounting terms “The balance doesn’t balance”, but it is always refreshing to observe a passionate fan.

  5. I like Massa, and I trully dislike Alonso. Even in the Schumacher days, Massa had a respect in that team, and he could give everything he could, however, since the accident’s return, I’m sure he feels like he’s been stabbed in the back.

    And the best thing you can do when you feel that way is leaving.

    1. Great comment aa and I agree with completely, except that I think Massa should stay. Yes he has had an uncompetitive year, yes Alonso has bullied him around, yes next year seems daunting. But where else is there to go. Any true racer with true courage would stick it out another year in a team where they could possibly fight for wins and the championship, rather than run away to a smaller team where they might sneak a podium or two, like a little girl. That’s what Alonso did when he ran back to Renault. I also don’t understand all the bashing Massa receives. No he isn’t a Hamilton of Alonso, but they are the only drivers on the grid I truly rate higher in terms of skill. Would we be saying anything about Webber, Vettel, Button if they hadn’t been blessed with massively superior cars? Massa has had wins in 3 different seasons and none of his cars had the advantages the RB5, RB6 of BGP-001 had over their competition. Maybe Massa doesn’t have that ruthless fire needed to be champion, but with the way he had dominated and risen to the challenges infront of his home crowd, his dignity in defeat, and his return from a near fatal collision are all things we can admire him for. Is he as good as Alonso, Hamilton, Button, Schumacher, Kubica, Vettel, Webber? I don’t know, but one a dozen or so occasions he has beaten them all. And how many people can say that?

  6. Keith, you mentioned that Alonso struggled with the switch from Michelin to Bridgestone tyres in 2007, and that should give Felipe to level the playing turf a little. I don’t remember that happenning in 2007, since he was on the ball from the 1st race onwards.

    From Felipe’s point of view, he should stay at Ferrari, and take the chance to redeem himself. I really do not think he will get a top drive if he leaves Ferrari, especially with the season the lack lustre season he has had. I think if he can match Alonso next season, Ferrari will give him a fair shot at the title. However, I just cannot see Massa consistently matching his teammate.

    From Ferrari’s point of view, if Felipe doesn’t improve by much next season, they can kiss another WCC good bye. But if he improves slightly they should hang on to him.

    1. He also didn’t like McLaren’s brakes, but I think too much can be made of this. In the races he lost out to Ferrari McLaren were just slower. In the races he lost out to Hamilton there were at times reasons beyond mechanical disadvantage (erratic driving in Canada and Hungary, not to mention an emotionally-driven retaliation to Hamilton’s actions in the former). Of course, you would then have to argue that it was good enough for McLaren to be superior in the wet (and thus giving him the win at the Nurburgring) but somehow unfair he liked the tyres and brakes less than Hamilton.

      Also, he and Pedro collaborated together in the later tests of the season to freeze Hamilton getting the maximum out of the new upgrades (ever wonder why he suddenly shot ahead of Hamilton in pace at Spa and Monza? It wasn’t just getting his way with the brakes).

      Together, the “Alonso should have been champion because he was unfairly disadvantaged” argument seems a little null. There were other reasons he didn’t win the championship that year and a few that put him back into contention. But that’s not to say tyres are an irrelevant issue. If he dislikes the Pirelli tyres and Massa likes them, all else being equal they could be the deciding factor between them.

      1. Alonso also took some very strange decisions on set-up: so that Lewis, who often copied him quite a bit due to Lewis’s almost complete inexperience, would struggle relatively more than Alonso. Here, I’m thinking about races such as Silverstone. It was just another example of Alonso’s tactics to try and beat an inherently faster driver: Lewis.

  7. He should stay at least for 2011. Hopefully the team will give him the chance to fight for wins again, even against Alonso. If not it will be time to call it a day and go to another team, no matter how much it was his dream driving for Ferrari.
    Right now it looks like Felipe has formally agreed to help Alonso, but it looks like he has zero interest in actually doing so. That’s understandable, we all now about past ‘incidents’ (Germany 2007) between the two.

    1. felipe massa fan
      18th October 2010, 9:13

      he’s got a contract until the end of 2012!!!
      Hes been there since 2006 he isnt leaving

      why is everyone so harsh about him you have to remember that in 2008 he only lost the wdc by one point due to his bad luck and hamiltons last corner of the season good luck.
      he is also a really good team player and it has been tough this season.
      but he hasnt been winning or getting that many podiums because ferrari didnt develop the car at the start and they were the 3rd/4th best eam

      and who would replace him? fisichella
      or kubica

      1. I agree, Xanathos. I really do feel sorry for him though, because I doubt other teams are looking at him as a desirable asset at the moment unfortunately. But I really like Felipe, and I don’t want him to slip under the radar of prospective recruitment opportunities, especially considering how close he came to taking the title in 2008. So I’d like to see him do at least another year at Ferrari – where he will hopefully improve further. I think we can only really judge his performances at this time next year, because he has basically had to learn all over again after a lengthy absence.

        I seem to remember a certain period at the end of 2002 where Felipe had all but disappeared and accepted he was only going to be a test driver for Ferrari. Then he returned to Sauber, where I don’t think he made much more of an impression (apart from maybe Canada ’05). It was when he joined Ferrari we saw him mature and become the driver he was before his crash. My point is that it took such a long time to develop Felipe as a championship contender, so I don’t think one year will be enough for him to show his true pace. I feel the same with Michael Schumacher, and expect dramatically improved results if Mercedes can provide him with the machinery.

        So, at the end of 2011, if a similar article appears on here, I will vote no – he should find himself a team that values both drivers equally, because I don’t believe anyone would have enjoyed the way he was treated this year. This is of course if he hasn’t improved to the point at which he is able to fight with Alonso (contract permitting, of course) for regular wins, because I refuse to believe we have seen the best of Felipe Massa and that he is on his way out of the sport.

        By the way; I voted yes – he should stay at Ferrari, but I don’t want him to stay there if the same thing happens next year. Come on Felipe! :)

  8. So hard to choose.

    Ferrari have been a disgrace to Massa. But Massa knew what he was getting into; if you are a Ferrari driver, you have to roll over for the good of the team. Never mind he was shown love and affection and then had a win taken away on an important anniversary, through trickery by his own team to engineer the situation that triggered the team orders – if you go to Ferrari you know the #1 priority is having a Ferrari driver be champion and damn all else. Feelings hurt? Then leave. I feel incredibly sorry for Massa but he knew if anyone was going to do that to him, it would have been Ferrari. I naively didn’t, but they have and will do it again if needs be. Morality does not exist in F1 and if it did and Massa held any store by it, Ferrari would only be the strangest choice amongst the top teams who have all done dodgy stuff in the recent past. So it’s no reason for him to leave.

    Where would he go? Ferrari itself provides Massa’s best opportunity to show this year was a one-off and he can compete with Alonso. And if things go well it will be Alonso moving over for him instead. Even Schumacher had to support Irvine for the championship in 1999 – if Alonso thinks any differently he’d better hope the situation never arises.

    Massa should only leave if a faster car or one more suiting to his style is open. But that goes for every F1 driver.

    1. I couldn’t have said it better Icthyes!

  9. massa days are gone in ferrari

  10. No. Massa is a talented driver who doesn’t serve to be strong-armed into doing whatever Ferrari wants.

    1. Probably the best comment on this whole article. Agree fully!

  11. I think he should leave because ever since the accident he and Ferrari have changed. When Ferrari announced they would give him another contract for 2010 while he was recovering, it felt like it was just because they felt sorry to let him go while recovering and didn’t want the press to think they let mass a go because of the uncertainty of the accident

  12. lets not forget that Massa was hired to be a support driver. That is just how Ferrari work. The last they they want is their drivers competing against each other (and for logical reasons).

    Now you might think this is bad and so so. But what do you know? Its their tradition and I don’t think anyone has the right to tell them otherwise.

  13. my point of view here is “quitting ferrari is accepting defeat”

    and i dont like that idea too much.

    He needs to stay and prove his detractors wrong..

    he needs a year to redeem himself…he matched raikkonnen last year and given the switch to pirelli next year ..he has a good chance to redeem i dont think any other team will give him a shot at the WDC or winning races for that matter..

    1. Redeeming himself is not in Ferrari’s intrest. Supporting Alonso is, so, if he stay he does so with the full understanding that he can only support Alonso.

      1. it should not be taken for granted that ferrari will only support alonso.

        remember 2007 massa had to play second fiddle to kimi

        and kimi was asked to support massa the year later..

        If only Massa can manage to get ahead of alonso towards the end of the season..Alonso will be asked to do what massa is doing now..and therein lies massa’s redemption.

        1. To see Alonso’s face when told to pull over!

          1. Yes..that would be a sight to savour indeed..


          2. Alonso, like all other top drivers, would most certainly ignore said ‘instruction’. Second rate drivers, however…

  14. Kubica joining Ferrari is just a matter of time, so if Massa wants to have a future in F1, he’s got to stay in Ferrari at least one more year and during this time find a new home. Of course he is slipping to the role of next Barrichello, but I think that was obvious to happen since Alonso joined the team.

    1. Kubica will never accept being No 2 so he will never go to Ferrari as long as Alonso is there.

      1. Nonsense. A top driver’s seat for Robert Kubica is long overdue, and I’m sure he won’t hesitate to sign up for Ferrari if/when he gets the offer.

        The same misconception about Ferrari comes up all the time. Yes, the Scuderia plays as a team and they make no bones about it. But nobody signs up as a #1 or a #2 driver there. The one who is doing best gets the #1 treatment when the need for it arrives. Felipe Massa got the stick only after a string of poor results got him so far behind that he had no realistic options for the WDC. It could of course have been the other way around, and if Massa stays at Ferrari he will eventually get the #1 status, provided that he consistently outperforms Fernando Alonso (if he can overcome his own despondency, I might add). And if Felipe Massa exits and Robert Kubica comes in, well FA and RK will have to race for the #1 status, it will not be given a priori to neither.

        1. That is absolutely right on the money mate!!! Ferrari supported Raikkonen in ’07 cause he was kicking ass and Massa played the supporting role. In ’08, Raikkonen was off form and Massa was on form and as such Ferrari supported him.

          This year, Alonso is on form and Ferrari are supporting him. If Massa stays put and outperforms Alonso next year then Ferrari will back him.

          It’s just that the chances of Massa being faster/more consistent than Alonso are slim to none!!

    2. Personally I’d like to see Kubica in the Red Bull after Webber retires as champ. I’d be very interested in seeing he and Vettel in the same car.

  15. It’s a no brainer, he should stay.

    As you said there are so few race winning seats out there at the moment that it would be foolish to switch teams. Add that to the fact that Massa has a histroy of beating/matching more highly rated team mates and the teams loyalty to him and I think its just a matter of time before he is on the top step of the podium again.

    1. I agree GeeMac, and who knows, he could reach that top step again in Brazil where he has done so well in the past. That would be a great way to redeem himself and put one heck of a stamp onto the end of his season.

    2. voted stay
      ferrari need a number 2 driver, that can be up there wit the front runners. Massa is perfect for them
      If he leaves it will be to a slower car, so Ferrari is best for him

    3. HounslowBusGarage
      17th October 2010, 22:15

      I agree. While it must be galling for him to accept the demands of the team, where else would he go for next year?
      Question about your article, Keith ” I want to see the top seats in F1 occupied by drivers who are going to fight to win races. Looking at Massa’s performance at Suzuka and Hockenheim this year, I’m not convinced that’s the case.” I agree about Suzuka, but I thought Massa’s performance at Hockers was fine, it was Scuderia Ferrari’s performance that was disgusting.
      Massa needs to stay put to see how the new tyers and diffuser rules affect ALO, then make enquiries at one of 2011’s successful teams for 2012 if necessary.

      1. I agree about Suzuka, but I thought Massa’s performance at Hockers was fine, it was Scuderia Ferrari’s performance that was disgusting.

        Still we can’t forget it was Massa who pulled over. Would Vettel, Hamilton, Webber or Button have done the same?

        1. In Hockenheim Massa showed he’s disciplined, unlike those hot heads. Button would obey – he did it already! – in Turkey after Hamilton overtook him (“fuel is low”).

          In Italian culture team spirit, loyalty and discipline is a paramount since – hm – roman legions?

          1. Button would obey – he did it already! – in Turkey after Hamilton overtook him (“fuel is low”).

            Are you saying that in the few seconds Button had the lead someone got on the radio to him and blurted out “fuel is low” and that’s why Hamilton passed him at the next corner?

          2. @Keith, (sorry there is no reply button on your post)

            Button did not try to overtake again, and he just had showed he was in condition to do so…

            Oh, I forgot, that is “hold station” that even being legal they decided to code up…

            Give us a break, please.

  16. Hi Keith,

    I’m not sure i understood your final statements. Massa has clearly proved that he can win races. Maybe not championships (but you never know. Maybe now that Briatore is out of the way…) but definitely races. And as long as you don’t think his accident left an indelible scar on his skills (which i really think it’s not the case) there is no reason to think he can’t win again (Hockenheim pretty much tells that). So as long as you don’t want the x top-driver being in the x top-seats, Massa meets your “requirements”.

    If Ferrari WANTS to have a Barrichello (and they pretty much always had one in their winning years, whether it’s Irvine, Barrichello, Massa, Raikkonen, Massa again) then it’s pointless who He is. Massa worths any other one. Replacing him it’s pointless from Ferrari perspective.
    You can’t do anything about it. The important thing it’s there is ***nothing stopping Alonso from being the next Barrichello, except performances***. If that’s not the case, Massa should leave Ferrari. And Massa knows that, i can read this in every statement he made ever since after Hockenheim’s “sorry”.

    1. Massa has clearly proved that he can win races.

      This year, was my point.

  17. Massa should stay and finish next year until he is replaced by Kubica. He has had a difficult year against a much better driver. I can’t agree with the big bad Ferrari comments as the policy and history of the team has never changed since the start of the championship in 1950. What happened in Germany was not right even for many ‘true’ fans but has shown that for the team and possible outcome this season it may well turn out to be. I don’t think that Massa would be in contention with another 7 points. We fans may have romantic ideas of what happens in this sport but no team does. The tyre change may help him but I can’t see him beating Alonso at any point and if this turns out to be the case he has to support his team mate. This is about whether Massa stays and not how much you dislike Ferrari and Alonso.

    1. It doesn’t matter if they’ve been doing it since Year Dot, morally they’re still the Big Bad (who’d have thought I would ever use a Buffy the Vampire Slayer reference here?). But, as you say, morality is not how it works. It’s like magic (here comes a The Prestige reference) – people want to be fooled. So they go for McLaren or Renault or whomever.

      1. The biggest mistake was made by Dyer in his delivery,not the team. To suggest no other team has used orders is just too far off the mark to justify comment

        1. To suggest that “other people might have done it too” is somehow a worthwile defence is shocking.

  18. I’d like him to stay for equally selfish reasons:

    I loathe the way Ferrari goes racing, and always have. Even their fans have been unsettled at the way they’ve treated Massa, and only the joy of winning in the subsequent races made them ignore it.

    The Hockenheim incident, like the ones before it, show the Scuderia’s massive arrogance, sense of entitlement, and lack of sportsmanship on the racetrack. Their treatment of a driver who has loved and lived the team with all his heart, on the anniversary of a near-fatal accident, when he was winning the race and his “faster” teammate couldn’t get by him or catch him without having an unfair engine advantage, was disgusting, but entirely typical. Their press releases over the past year have shown a total lack of respect for the fans, for their competitors, and the sport, have been rude, childish, peevish and most worryingly of all, generally incorrect. In LdM, they have a boss who is a poisonous influence both on his own team, his drivers, and the sport, much as Ron Dennis was towards the end of his tenure. For a team with such pride in their “unparalleled” success, their records are not that impressive when taken into context that they’ve been in the sport 20 years more than McLaren and 30 years more than Williams. Even the famed Ferrari Red was copied from the Alfa Romeo team that Enzo defected from.

    They are the least genuine, deserving racing team on the grid and I hope that Massa stays next year, because I can guarantee that the way they behave will continue in this vein if he does. That, I think, will show even fans of the Scuderia that there are elements of their team that are reprehensible and incompatible with modern sporting endeavour. From “one rule for us, another rule for them” in 2004, to “bonus success money”, to “being a faster driver doesn’t mean you get to win”, there’s been no shortage of evidence in the past, but I think Massa is so genuinely well liked (albeit not in Brazil any more) that it would be impossible for sections of their supporters to ignore.

    Last year, with Massa’s accident, Kimi’s return to form, the team’s struggles with an uncompetitive car, and Stefano Domenicali’s more affable, open and decent management, Ferrari had a lot of sympathy even from their detractors (like me). This year, they’ve sluiced all that away and proven that the negative things said about them are true.

    1. What’s this got to do with a ‘should Massa stay’ poll. There are more than enough places to rant about teams you don’t like.

      1. I think that’s pretty clear at the top of my post:

        If Massa stays I think the abusive treatment of him would continue next year, and that’s something that I think is good in exposing the team and LdM for who and what they are. If you’re a fan of the team, you may not agree with/like that. That’s fine.

        1. I agree with rampante, that your post was just a “hating” post. Doesn’t contribute too much… it’s just a chance to express your hate for a team.

          1. I stated at the top of the post my reasons for wanting Massa to stay aren’t based on racing, or Massa’s best interests.

            If I were to say “What’s in Massa’s best interest” it would be “run for the door and don’t stretch your legs helping Alonso out on the way”.

          2. @Hairs, well depending on what do you understand to be “Massa’s best interests”. At ferrari he’s making a lot of money. Can’t remember the number, but something like 15 million € a year. Any other team (maybe except McLaren) will pay less than that. So, I think that it’s on Massa’s best interests to stay at Ferrari…

    2. For a team with such pride in their “unparalleled” success, their records are not that impressive when taken into context that they’ve been in the sport 20 years more than McLaren and 30 years more than Williams.

      Let me look at the records:

      Race Wins/Races Competed:
      Ferrari 214/809 = 26.5%
      Mclaren 169/682 = 24.8%

      Constructors Championships/Years Competed:
      Ferrari 16/60 26.7%
      Mclaren 8/44 18.2%

      Ferrari still ahead.

      1. I didn’t say they didn’t win the statistics race – only that their statistics aren’t as impressive as they like to make them out to be. Certainly not when you consider that McLaren/Williams et al didn’t have the benefit of running in the early days, when making relatively modest car improvements could gain significant laptime, the formula was far less restrictive, and individual drivers had more of an effect on laptimes.

        F1 is a much tougher sport to succeed in, particularly in the last 10 – 15 years than it ever was in Ferrari’s first 10-20 years, when teams could compete out of a normal garage. Another irony of Ferrari’s of late – slamming new teams, and small teams for being “garagistes” – when that’s exactly how Ferrari started off themselves.

        1. Besides, McLaren and Williams had to make do without a veto on the FIA regulations and an 80 million a year bonus from FOM.

    3. “One rule for us, one rule for them” – I assume you are refering to the technical veto Ferrari had, are you? If yes, read ahead, else stop here.

      I am not sure you understand what a veto is. It is not a case of two different rules for different sets of teams. It only meant that if Ferrari didn’t approve of a particular rule change, then that change would not be executed. A Ferrari has been subject to the same FIA tests as every other car.

      @Rest: Sorry for dragging out what is obviously, a completely irrelevant post to the topic.

      1. They had a technical veto. They got to see proposed regulations before the rest of the grid. Did any other team have that? No. Did any other team have extra bonus payments if they won, over and above the standard payments from FOM? No. On both counts, “one rule for Ferrari, another rule for the rest of the grid.”

  19. @icthyes So you mean to say that hamilton defeated alonso in the 8 races he finished ahead because of his skill but alonso finished ahead of hamilton in 9 races including spa and italy by conspiring against him? When a driver tests a car he does try to make it suitable to his driving style. Whats wrong with that? Can you give any evidences that alonso and pedro tried to sabotage lewis’s chances by making the car unsuitable to him. And before spa and italy , he also finished miles ahead of lewis in silverstone. It wasnt all of a sudden.please put some better points than these ridiculous conspiracies..alonso admitted himself that he was struggling with brakes and tyres. I am not sure but he had to use a different type of brake to suit his style but the car wasnt best integrated for those brakes and hence he couldnt perform his best.

    1. So you mean to say that hamilton defeated alonso in the 8 races he finished ahead because of his skill but alonso finished ahead of hamilton in 9 races including spa and italy by conspiring against him?


      Can you give any evidences that alonso and pedro tried to sabotage lewis’s chances by making the car unsuitable to him.

      I never said sabotage. I said they worked together to give Alonso an advantage. As for proof, it’s in Mark Hughes’ book on Hamilton.

      And before spa and italy , he also finished miles ahead of lewis in silverstone.

      One race, where I believe there was an issue with tyre pressures. Before then, Alonso hadn’t beaten Hamilton since Monaco and wouldn’t do so again (if you discount the French, European and Turkish races where one or the other suffered a mishap) until Monza.

      I’m not promoting a conspiracy, merely recounting what happened. I believe I’ve put more evidence forward than you have so I don’t get this “put better points” argument.

  20. For him personally it would be better to stay at Ferrari – he isn’t likely to get a top spot anywhere else. Ferrari operates in such way – Alonso is their new Schumacher and they need a number 2 driver to play rear gunman.

    Personally I would love him to lose his seat in Ferrari so a driver who would be able to push to the limit (say for example Webber) and not move over could get the seat. But that is unlikely happen as Ferrari doesn’t want its drivers to fight it out on track.

  21. I think he should stay, since, as people said, there is no better team where he can go. McLaren will not let go Hamilton nor Button, and Red Bull is not going to let go any of their drivers either. So, Ferrari is his only option.

  22. I have another question: shall Ferrari keep Massa?? For me is a clear NO!
    He is not Ferrari material. He has wins races, but anyone within the top ten drivers would win eventualy if you give them a Ferrari. Let’s not forget his “shows” in the rain (Silverstone 08 comes to mind)or more recently his unability to keep with his teamate pace.
    People likes him because of his bad luck (accident and losing the title in the last corner) but he is not good enough for a top team.

    1. That famous last corner at Interlagos 08 was worth only a point, albeit a decisive one. But Felipe lost a lot more points in Singapore 08 8from first to last position), courtesy of the worst pit stop in recent history. And it had nothing to do with Piquet or Briatore, it was simply a mistake of the team.

  23. Yes. A lot of fanatics will know I’m a huge Massa and a complete Ferrari fan but I didn’t have a single doubt aboutb this poll.

    I’ll always say what happened at Hockheinem was wrong and if I thought Massa was better off elsewhere then I would vote for him to go and break up my dream team otherwise it wouldn’t be what I wanted anyway.

    Massa should stay. He’s had a fairly bad year compared to Fernando but he is in a fairly unique situation; he’s came back after serious injury and even Sid Watkins thought he came back too soon, he had eight months out and Brundle commented at Monaco that Felipe was still not as sharp as he was, he’s got the hardest team mate in the world and he hates the tyres. Should he have worked around those problems? Yes, probably but next year he’ll be much better prepared. The tyres will be new and he could love them. The points are back at zero and everything is reset next year with the tyres.

    I do believe the team still adore him. They’re probably a bit miffed at the way Germany was handled but he should mostly trust in Ferrari. He’s been well off Fernando’s pace for the majority of the year (yes, there’s more to racing than speed but bear with me a mo’) and after Valencia Ferrari were saying they needed a win and then the disaster of Silverstone happened and they were again screaming they needed a win. They seemed properly desparate at that point. They probably thought Fernando was their best bet given his speed all year, his better points at that time and switching the order wouldn’t hurt so much. They were wrong and it’s probably hurt Felipe’s confidence and a win could have done so much for him on that day but I still believe that Ferrari would give them a fair crack next year until they felt one of them would deliver the title.

    Felipe is sitll good enough to be a Ferrari driver. He’s shown flashes this year; fastest on the hards in q1 at Monza but then fluffed his q3 strategy, Singaproe was a great recovery and Malaysia he made up as many places as Lewis. Hockheinem he showed he could lead a GP again. Bahrain, Turkey and Spa he outqualified Alonso (more down to Fernando’s errors like in Monaco but he got it right).

    There’s only Renault anyway that could possibly give Felipe a shot at winning and may have a vacancy.

    This is a great timed poll in a way because everyone seems to be debating about him but for me it’s premature. Give him one year to see how the Ferrari situation really is when he’s really had some time to get up to speed and the tyres are new and the score board is back at 0. If he has a bad year or Ferrari are so clearly behind Ferrari then leave. As much as I want him at Ferrari I won’t respect him if he settles for a constant number role 2 there. This year there was at least some logic as terrible as it was and next year it could all change.

    1. Steph, your comment is spot on. It’s nice to know I am not alone in my opinion on this matter :)

    2. My opinion is identical to yours. Maybe my opinion is biased because I support Massa and Ferrari, but here are my ideas.
      It’s only his first year after the crash, and let’s not forget that he was, until Japan, the only driver that had finished all races. Maybe he isn’t so fast but he’s consistent. He was leading the championship after four races, he arrived 2nd in Bahrain, 3rd in Australia. That was a good start to the year. Then other drivers improved and Felipe found himself in trouble. But he still deserves that seat because, regardless of his troubles this year, he nearly won the championship in 2008, he was fastly improving in 2009 like in Germany where he finished 3rd, he beat WDC Raikkonen in qualifying in Spain where the Finn was 16th and he was 4th. He would have won a race in 2009 if it wasn’t for the crash. He deserves another opportunity because Ferrari owe him one after his altruism in many occasions to support the team.

    3. 1st paragraph, we know, we know Steph… :-)

      2nd, 100% Agree

      3rd & 4rd, 90% Agree. I don’t think Massa has been affected so much by the last season injuries. I think he has been affected much more by the fact that he had his opportunity to be nr 1 driver during 2008 and 2009 and now he is returning back to realize he is just a very good driver but not champion material. That has to be hard enough for him.

      5th & 6th, 100% right

      7th, I don’t think there is a point about number 2 driver. He will be a nr 2 driver in every team in which will be: Hamilton, Alonso, Vettel and that’s just because he is not nr 1 when compared to them, but that doesn’t means I approve what happened in Hockheinem.

      1. On the point of his injuries I can’t really say how much if at all they hurt him. I think the time out did hurt as anytime away from an F1 does have an affect.

        I’ll disagree with your last point but Alonso is so much harder for him to beat than Kimi I do accept that. For me, Fernando is the best out there right now.

        1. Yes Steph, I can’t either say much about the injuries. I do not have any degree in medicine. What I was trying to say is that for me massa was very motivated and comfortable with his situation in Ferrari during 2008 and 2009, and for me, this is the biggest change he has had since Alonso joined the team.

          Regarding the last point, don’t get me wrong, when I said nr 2 I’m not talking about status or official position. For me (IMHO) Massa can beat ALO, HAM, VET in one race… but he will not be able to beat any of them in the long run, simply because he is in other different category (IMHO).

          He had his best opportunity in 2008 and unfortunately he don’t succeed. Maybe in the future he will have another good opportunity and he will take it. See Button (and maybe Webber this year), he has had to wait a long time before become WDC and many people were not giving any coin for him (me included).

    4. Well said.

      Obviously Japan was Felipe’s worst weekend of the year, but I think people are jumping on the bandwagon a bit here. It reminds me of the reaction to Sepang 2008, and we know what happened after that.

      Felipe has been unlucky this year, but hopefully with a complete off season, he can come back next year and be right up there – which I am confident he can do.

  24. I never really understood why Massa is in Ferrari. Never will.

    But i hope he stayes because then my favorite team MERCEDES has better chance to compete against El Banco Santander Scuderia.

    I dont buy the injury thing. Against Kimi he just was always on fumes at Q and had the number one strategy at race.
    Now he is struggling when other front runners are also on fumes, and now its not Massa who gets better strategy for race…its F Santader.

    1. The “injury thing” was actually pointed out by Professor Sid Watkins, who said that it takes about two years to fully recover from the kind of accident Felipe Massa suffered. I think he knows a bit more about this sort of thing than you or me.

  25. Surely, yes. Alonso and Kubica are two excellent drivers, but thats not the way Ferrari work. They need 1st and 2nd driver! Neither Fernando or Robert would like to be 2nd.

  26. Massa was stabbed in the back by being asked to defer to Alonso in a race that he should have won.If i were Massa,i wouldn’t be too keen on working too hard for the team after that.
    He should go,maybe swap with Webber.

    1. If he went to RBR I wouldn’t be very sad because, even as a Ferrari and Massa fan, Ferrari don’t treat Felipe well and RBR is a championship contender and that would mean a chanche of being WDC for Felipe. I preferred if he stayed at Ferrari but RBR is a better choice than Renault.

      1. I forgot to add that I don’t see it possible to happen that Webber goes to Ferrari. If Massa was out of the team Ferrari would get Vettel or Kubica.

  27. He should stay and prove himself! We never know whats the car like in 2011.

  28. Massa’s situation now looks a lot like Jarno Trull’si [sic] in 2004. It’s time to do what Trulli did: find a new home and let someone else help Alonso win his championships.

    And how did that work out for Trulli, exactly? I don’t recall him troubling the top step of the podium since his departure from Renault.

    Massa needs to stay at Ferrari because in a years’ time the situation could be exactly reversed. He helped Raikkonen to the championship in 2007, and a year later it was Raikkonen helping him. If he can beat Alonso on merit – and he will be given the opportunity to do so, just as he was earlier in the year – he will be given every chance of winning the title. This is how it works at Ferrari, and how it always has.

    Granted, it will be harder for Massa to beat Alonso than it was Raikkonen, since Alonso doesn’t look like slowing down any time soon and is a better driver than Raikkonen was anyway, but it is nonetheless the best chance Felipe has.

  29. I personally think that massa should stay this year has been tough for him. But its already possible that Ferrari have been developing the car to favour Alonso??.
    If big teams need to look for new drivers then it should be Mclaren. I personally think that Jenson Button hasn’t performed to the potential of his car Out of the 5 championship contenders he is number 5 in the standings and he has only won races on pure luck. People make a big hype about him but in my opinion he plays it to safe. I rate Massa higher than him.

    1. Totally agree. I really liked the fact that Mark Webber said that earlier this week, very clearly outspoken (the pure luck thing).

      I rate Massa higher too.

    2. Well there was a rumour earlier in the year that McLaren offered Massa the drive alongside Hamilton this year. I have no idea how much truth there was behind it though.

    3. I personally think that Jenson Button hasn’t performed to the potential of his car Out of the 5 championship contenders he is number 5 in the standings and he has only won races on pure luck.

      No, upon realisation that he doesn’t have the raw speed of Hamilton, he pretty much outsmarted the rest in Australia and China with good strategy. Almost worked in Monza too. And Jenson is only three points behind Lewis, so he is doing a good job even though I don’t think he will win the title.

  30. I’ve never rated Massa. Ever. In 2008 and 2009 Ferrari developed the car more towards his liking, which is partly (among motivational issues) lead to Kimi becoming so poor in what was supposed to be, and could have been, a quick car. Massa buckles under pressure to easy, and given that he has had a World Champion as his team mate for much of his F1 career, you would have thought he would be used to it by now!

    Massa needs to move aside and let someone else put in a fight. Maybe a swap with Kubica, or perhaps allow someone like Bianchi to have a pop.

    1. I’ve never rated Massa. Ever. In 2008 and 2009 Ferrari developed the car more towards his liking, which is partly (among motivational issues) lead to Kimi becoming so poor in what was supposed to be, and could have been, a quick car.

      That’s just the old excuse given to not let people acknowledge that Massa was one of the best drivers in those two years.

      1. Dont get me wrong, Massa put in some excellent drives in those races, but I dont rate Massa. To me he’s a “good” driver/racer, but not a great one.

      2. Yeah, Massa suddenly turned into a driving god … and then he lost it again.

        Or maybe he didn’t really change at all and the car was just better?

        Put Massa in the fastest car of the field and “for sure” he can win races. In fact he’s a better qualifier than for instance Raikkonen, so he would be even more likely to win races.

        Put him in a car that could compete for the WDC, but which is not the outright fastest (ie see this year) and he suffers because he’s not a racer. He just cannot overtake.

  31. Massa has no better alternative. Of course he should stay.

    The more relevant question is if Ferrari should keep Massa.

  32. Why should he, Massa knows that Ferrari don’t support him at all ever since they adopted baby Fernando from Renault, all Ferrari want is to adopt from Renault again, personally, if I was Massa, I would walk into Luca di Montezemelo’s office, grab hold of the contract and rip it into atoms. If Massa stays, I’ll be disgusted.

  33. I’m not sure why people are using a comparison to Barichello as an insult. Sure, he wasn’t as good as Schumi and he was disadvantaged at the team, but that happens in every team where there is an obvious drop-off in quality between No. 1 and No. 2. Rubens is still getting more out of a machine than anyone has reason to expect (expect on the starts, sadly).
    Massa has show little or nothing since the first race. Either the crash diminished him as a driver, or Alonso is doing an even better job than I thought.

    1. Six years with his team mate being the world champion instead of him.
      Not at all entirely his fault, but this statistic indeed remain untouched.
      it’s yellin out loud, “You’re not a champion (so you didn’t deserve the chanches you got to be one)” which is implicitely the question this pool arise here, i think.

  34. IMO, Massa is too hotheaded for this sport.

  35. Bring Kubica to Ferrari

  36. If big teams need to look for new drivers then it should be Mclaren. I personally think that Jenson Button hasn’t performed to the potential of his car Out of the 5 championship contenders he is number 5 in the standings and he has only won races on pure luck. People make a big hype about him but in my opinion he plays it to safe. I rate Massa higher than him. Yes he has given some great drives but he only became champion last year because the likes of Alonso,Raikkonen,Massa,Hamilton and Kubica. Did not have cars to challenge him. Yes RBR were contenders in 2009 but the only began catching up in the 2nd part of the season If we had one more race last year Vettel would have taken the title. Also remember that Barrichello began beating Jenson in the 2nd part of the season he was only being outperformed because Rubens got the seat on short notice so the car was not fully developed for him.

    1. Luck? No. He has won races on the basis he has made excellent decisions and been the better driver. Lets not forget it’s Button’s first season in what many regard to be Lewis’s team (although this probably isnt the case). Button is a top driver and I’m sure he’ll win more races next year

      1. Might be biased here, since I’m not too much of a Button fan. But his wins looked like luck to me.

      2. Yes decisions not racing. He made decisions. He did not go out and race to victory he has been playing it safe all season I don’t think he has been a worthy racer. He won races just on luck and decisions. I mean how many times do you see him overtake someone?? JB Is to overrated in my opinion.

        1. All have had their (fair?) share of good and bad luck. However I think that being crashed out by Vettel and let down by their mechanics at Montecarlo, Jenson’s “bad luck share” is in my opinion less atributable to him than it is the case for his rival drivers in the title hunt. Still he is almost on par with Lewis who has been more active bringing his own bad luck…
          He might often not be very exciting, but a 20-odd events’ season is won on consistency and reliability, and Jenson can share some better practice to others.

          1. Mark Webber has been consistent and reliable. No one is praising him???
            Jenson Has won the least races out of all the contenders. What if there was no rain at China or Melbourne. He wouldn’t have won then would he? Yes hes made good decisions but a real racer does not win on rain and asking for wet tires. Jenson is far too overrated. Its our British media always making him out to be a class act but they are quick to pounce on Alonso when he crashes out in Spa. JB hasn’t done anything to make a race exiting how many times do you hear about him going wheel to wheel with other drivers?? Never. Its always Jenson saves tires this and he saves fuel that. Im sorry but these are the things that make races boring if he wants to be smooth he might as well be a chocolatier.

          2. Also, what if the weather predictions would have been accurate?

            Then for instance, all drivers whould have switched to dry tyres earlier in Australia. Not just the ones who couldn’t keep their tyres working, were beaten already and could afford to take a gamble.

  37. Massa will come very strong next season if the Ferrari provide him with a car that he can win with.
    Alonso is no better than Raikkonen and Massa could beat Raikkonen in 2008.

    1. Finally someone who agrees that Alonso is no better than Kimi! I always thought Kimi’s wins and championship were more on merit than Alonso’s. The only reason Fernando was champ in 05 is because Bridgestone ruined Schumacher’s chances, and even more so because reliability destroyed Kimi’s chances. In 06 Mclaren sucked, and were it not for an engine failure my money is that an inspired Schumacher would have beaten Alonso to the crown that year.

      1. Dont forget about the mass damper!

        1. Thanks Anthony!! To true!

  38. I think he should stay for a Ferrari seat and a 2nd place in the championship is the most he can wait for.Since Alonso demands for first pilot status the most he would get as a companion would be the likes of Sutil or maybe Rosberg if Ferrari is willing to have their pilots fight a bit more.

  39. If anyone thinks Kubica replacing him next year or the year after is a good idea, I’d ask them to think again.

    Look how frustrated Alonso got because he couldn’t get past his slower team-mate in two races. Look at how angry he was at McLaren in Indianapolis for not telling Hamilton to move over when Alonso was in a quicker phase of his race. Now imagine what happens when Kubica beats him half the time. Maybe I’m wrong and he’d be mature against a rival he genuinely respected as an equal (not to mention a friend), but if I was Domenicali or Kubica, I wouldn’t want to try just yet.

    With Webber’s seat up for grabs in 2012 Robert would be silly not to go to Red Bull instead and then take over from Alonso when he’s done at Ferrari.

    1. If only Ferrari had the guts to stand up against Alonso as McLaren did at Indianapolis.

      But then maybe Alonso would have had another tantrum and took his Spanish sponsors back to Renault again ;)

      1. So true Ed! Ron Dennis may have made some mistakes at his final years running McLaren, but standing up to Alonso was not one of them. Alonso needs to remember that it’s a Team sport, not Felipe, that arrogant devil.

        1. HounslowBusGarage
          17th October 2010, 22:25

          “Alonso needs to remember that it’s a Team sport . . .”
          But when he reminded Team Ferrari that it was a team sport and got Massa to move over for him (for the long term benefit of the Team), everyone pilloried him and the team for it!
          Massa remembered it was a “team sport”, that’s why he moved over instead of giving two fingers to the pits and taking the win.

      2. Different situation entirely – if I remember rightly, Hamilton was ahead of Alonso in the points before Indy, whereas Massa was some way back in the standings before Germany and not looking like mounting much of a fightback.

        If Ferrari had been desperate to do Alonso’s bidding at the first opportunity they could have done it as early as Melbourne, where a faster Alonso ended up stuck behind the slower Massa. Alonso even radioed the team to say he was faster, yet no team orders…

        1. Exactly. I don’t see any of this “Alonso demands number 1” anywhere. I simply think Ferrari want to win desperately. In the first part of the championship they give equal opportunities. But after that, whoever is a head is given priority. We saw in the Massa/Kimi years, that the scale went both ways depending on who was ahead.

          If Massa were to be a head in the championship, Alonso would have been ordered to move aside.

  40. Roger Carballo AKA Archtrion
    17th October 2010, 12:36

    He shouldn’t leave at all… In fact, he should be fired after German scandal. He forced the team to repeat time after time what they need him to do. Not the fair way Kovalainen stepped apart when Hamilton passed him in Germany 2008.

    And please, take away Rod Smedly with him (yes, the dumb Codemasters F1 2010 engineer). So he will know what the word generosity means

    1. Sound_Of_Madness (@)
      17th October 2010, 14:01

      Umm… yes. You know something? Team orders were still illegal, and what counts more, the majority of F1 fans are against them. So what you propose is that Massa should take part at the team order by masking it, thus letting the designated no1 win???

      Yes, fire him. That should do even better to show how much Alonso’s (and every Alonso’s) team Ferrari would be. To their honor, they did not do it.

      On topic, I think Massa should leave to a mid-team or take a sabbatical, to rebuild his reputation and his psychology. Heidfeld and Raikkonen took sabbaticals, and you see how rumored were they to various returns; one has already.

      1. Roger Carballo AKA Archtrion
        17th October 2010, 14:21

        You should apply that standard to Lewis and Heiki on Hockenheim 2008

        1. Sound_Of_Madness (@)
          17th October 2010, 14:22

          He did, though a year later. And I neither liked that.

    2. Wow Roger. Sure that isn’t AKA: angry? Smedely and Massa have one of the best partnerships in the paddock. Sure he can get annoying on the codemasters game, but in real life he is dynamite, and is partnered with a driver of quality. If you prefer there to be no honor or dignity in your sport that’s fine, but don’t try and take it away from the rest of us, Ferrari is doing a fine enough job of that on their own.

  41. Anything can happen, he might get one up on Alonso in time or Alonso may have an off that gives him his chance. If he leaves he’ll probably just be another Irvine and never get another chance in a good car again. Unless Michael quits and Ross takes him and Smedley in, but can’t see Merc going for that. A couple more years at Ferrari will make him rich(er), give him a few wins and a nice life, why throw it away?

  42. Massa will not forget 2008 and how Alonso’s win in Singapore took a toll on his WDC, I don’t blame him. There’s already bad blood honestly which will not change.

    More importantly is does Ferrari want to keep Massa not the other way around.
    A very difficult and sensitive issue. It’s a harsh world, being a nice guy and being fast are separate issues. In F1, either you are up to speed or you have strong financial support. Ferrari will be a better judge I assume.

    Alonso lost many fans since 2007 but is in demand, that’s why he’s in Ferrari.
    Felipe has not been consitent, but his persona gained many fans.

    Tough stance for Massa but not Ferrari.

    1. Who says Alonso lost many fans ?
      Dont put words into mouth.

      1. I say he has, I was once an Alonso fan, then he lost me as one after 07, got me back as a fan towards the end of 08, crashgate came out, he lost me as a fan, he got me back as a fan the first part of this season, but the issue in Germany is the straw that broke the camel’s back for me. I will never support Alonso again, and if he wins the WDC this year by 7 points or less it will be a farce.

        1. Alonso is lucky to have lost ONE fan :)

          1. Btw Gill, I’m an ardent Alonso fan.

            Gathering from many F1 websites it seems to indicate he has lost many fans.

  43. While Alonso is there Massa will not be given a fair chance.

    Ferrari have once again got their golden boy and every driver that comes in will just be cannon fodder.
    Ferrari and Alonso are a disgrace to F1.

  44. Best teams like they want to win races but it’s really about money, advertising, drivers and strange dependencies on sponsors behind them . If such a team like Ferrari really wanted to win the championship to win the championship regardless of the cost, should hire Kubica and put him in the spotlight. It is obvious that now is the best driver on the grid. Smarter than Hamilton, Vettel and far more emotionally balanced than Alonso, who has the hesitation of moods that translate into results. Kubica’s form is constant, just as his commitment, ability to koncentrate, avoiding mistakes and pushing car to the limit.

    1. are you Polish?

    2. Kubica the best driver on the grid? Heidfeld is better than the best then.

    3. Well, I think Kubica is good. But not sure if he’s the best. I sometimes think it’d be great for all of those top drivers (Alonso, Hamilton, Kubica, and maybe Vettel/Webber) to race with the same car. Let’s see what would happen!

  45. I think the hit he took at Hokenheim might have hit as hard as Rubens spring.

    Weird isn’t it, him saying the he didn’t want to be the next Rubens when it was that Brawns spring that may be the root of his poor performances this season.

    He should go.

  46. I think Massa will stay at Ferrari, even if the environment is as toxic as it appears to be. There’s simply nowhere else for him to go – sure, Renault could always make space for him, but from a marketability perspective, Vitaly Petrov has way more potential than Massa. The influx of Russian sponsors plus the Russian Grand Prix make Petrov worth his weight in gold to Renault (assuming they know how to use it), and Massa simply doesn’t have that. Which is a shame, because he always come across as a nice guy and Brazil 2008 gave us one of the best displays of sportsmanship the world has ever seen. It would be cruel if Massa’s only claim to a World Championship was those fifteen seconds, and right now it’s looking unlikely he’ll get it again at Ferrari – but there’s nowhere else that could give it to him, either.

    1. Well said PM, very well said.

    2. Shahriar Ahsan
      18th October 2010, 6:50

      Vitaly Petrov has way more potential than Massa.
      — Totally agree,

  47. IMO there things that can happen if he stays

    Either,the tires work great for him and he is much much closer to Alonso beating him more often than now (I still believe there is no way he can outscore Alonso no matter what kind of tires Pirelli bring)

    Or,the tires arent that big an improvement and he is totally outclassed again.In this case,his reputation will fall even further and that renault seat that looks possible now may not be vacant for him in 2012

    Personally,i would like him to stay for another year,probably because im an Alonso fan.

    What would be really interesting is if filipe and barrichello team up at williams and they have a championship winning capable car and a situation arises where the team will have to decide to back one of them.

  48. I vote no. but to be honest i don’t see any empty seat anywhere for him next season if he decides to leave ferrari; unless ferrari and renault agree to swap driver.

    There’s a rumours that maldonado has signed with williams for next season. really looking forward for confirmation on that rumours.

  49. @ichtyes so your evidence is a book by a man who thinks he can judge a 7 times world champ by watching him how he takes a particular corner??some mate, but biggest joke of the year.
    Now since you elimated 3 gps between monaco and monza i would like to elimate hungary. That leaves canada which i agree was a disaster for alonso. And in USA alonso was faster but beaten. So beaten in just two Gp doesnt prove your point that suddenly alonso became faster “suddenly” by whatever way u and mark hughes believe he did.
    And Btw whats the point in testing if you are not allowed to improved the car to your liking?
    And regarding alonso’s trouble with brakes, if you dont believe that he didnt have trouble then why was using different sets to lewis?
    And alonso’s statement about tyres also proved that he had trouble in those rubber.
    Hence the whole year he year he was struggling to heat up the tyres. So you will notice if you watch the stats that Lewis’s 1st outlap on new tyres in the race was more often quicker. For the same reason in qualy lewis had advantage. And Alonso was trying to solve his problems. Whats wrong with that?

    I believe this much info will be enough.

    1. My evidence is a book by a well-respected F1 journalist who knows more about F1 than everyone on this site put together. He’s not always accurate, but we’re not talking about an opinion here, but facts gleaned from proper research.

      However it seems quite clear that you just want to rubbish anything that doesn’t fit in what you think happened, so we’ll end it here if you don’t mind.

  50. I haven’t had time to read through all of the other comments, but I simply think the team isn’t backing him sufficiently and they’re clinging on to him merely due to ’emotional’ strings..and that’s good to see though, it reminds me of Alesi’s situation (despite Alesi being a much better driver, but that’s not the point)

  51. Stay. It’s the only way to show everybody that you’re really good material.

    As a fan of Schumi, I find it only fair to give Schumi and Massa the benefit of the ‘tyre doubt’.

    So, if he’s not beating Alonso or at least equalling him, then he should go.

    This struggle and the outcome of the new tyres and how this will develop, to me is just as interesting as putting another top driver next to alonso. Although maybe Rosberg would be interesting…

    Oh these choices!

  52. it was all over the media after Hockenheim, that Massa might move on for the next year, and during the waiting time for the Suzuka qualificiaton BBC presented a nice show with some rumours, with Massa possibly leaving Ferrari at the end of the year, despite having a contract for another two years.

    eariler i thought, that Massa might retire from Ferrari one day. they obviously encouraged the Ferrari powered (Peter) Sauber to sign him for 2002 (as they possibly did with Räikkönen a year earlier, to ensure themselves a future “substitution bench” after the Schumacher-Barrichello era), they tutored him through 2003, put back to Sauber for two years, and finally signed in 2006.
    if you are beaten by another driver, you will possibly end up forced to leave the team. Massa was always paired up with theoretically stronger, but at least more experienced drivers, but he was never outperformed so badly, and proved to be fast, and if needed, a teamplayer. from 2002, he was in the long term plans of Ferrari, learned what he had to, developed himself, and when the great Kimi Räikkönen failed to come to terms with the car (or tyres, or whatever), he took the lead, and stepped in as Ferraris title contender, and if he would have won the 2008 championship, noone could have said a wrong word about it.
    it’s a shame he couldn’t continue his campaign in 2009, with a weak car struggling in the mid sections, but it was definetley him, that took up the car developing role, and also the results came, Massa and the Ferrari fought themselves back to the top, and the highlights of the season for him was obviously the podium finish in Germany.
    then came Hungary, the accident, and some things have changed, related to Massa, and related to Ferrari.
    the thing that Ferrari was counting with Massa, despite the uncertainty of the (racing) future of the Brazilian was very smyphatic.
    but after that the behaviour of the Ferrari top-management was absolutley unacceptable for me. they treated their legend Michael Schumacher absolutley inappropriate earlier that year, considering removing him from the position he occupies at Ferrari, and then suddenly calling him to step in the place of Massa… was it a neck injury, or the lack of pace of the car that demotivated Schumacher, but it’s sure that the attitude of current Ferrari management played a role of deciding not to return then.
    then putting poor Luca Badoer into their race car, and then removing him just after races, destroying his decades-long reputation with this decision… then signing Fisichella, and letting him and Räikkönen drive a car that hasn’t been updated since Hungary, and despite this, expecting them to achieve 3rd in constructors championship, knowing that none of them will drive for Ferrari next year, also wasn’t fair. and Räikkönens replacement was also a strange decision. okay, Alonso performs better now, as Räikkönen could have been this year, but firing a world champion instead of trying to solve his problem is a bit like questionable. not to mention the disadvantegous material aspect of this.

    the long and short of it is, whether Massa could ever get a chance at a team like Ferrari to be their nr1 again. and comments from di Montezemolo regarding this don’t mean anything. the case is, that Ferrari is sticked so much to Massa, is rather practical, they want him as a nr2 “under” anyone, and 2008 was only an exceptional situation (for Ferrari, but not for Massa). Ferrari always prefered to have a nr1, which used to pay off in the WDC, and i think it will be the same this year as well, so i can’t blame them for this. and to quite honestly say, Massa wasn’t able to put himself into a position, that he would be the one to be supported by the other Ferrari driver. the “why’s” of this are of course open.

    Renault could be a realistic chance for him. and doesn’t really matter if he “swaps” a fast teammate to another fast one, as this would be the first time, that he is the more experienced and successful driver, and not his teammate. of course their recent performance put Kubica ahead of him, but Kubica is also a hot contender for Massa’s place at Ferrari, so maybe he has to beat a Petrov or a Heidfeld or a Sutil next year at Renault. but as long as Ferrari counts with him as a “current Barrichello”, and they do, he shouldn’t stay there, if he wants to be ever a world champion, or at least to regain his reputation…

  53. Peugeot 905 '93 Le Mans Winner
    17th October 2010, 15:18

    Massa’s situation now looks a lot like Jarno Trull’si in 2004.

    Isn’t it “Trulli’s” ?

  54. I don’t think anyone other than those involved in the team and with Felipe Massa can truly understand why he should stay or go. All I know is I think he’d perform a lot better in a team he knows that’s fully behind him, and at the minute that isn’t the case – he’s got to be behind Alonso.

  55. Massa has always been a #2 driver. You say: “Villeneuve gave him little trouble”. I say … that’s only because Peter Sauber didn’t tell FM to move over (remember the crash in Monaco). Massa would be a fool to walk away from his seat at Ferrari. This is the best he can do.

    1. No, Villeneuve gave him little trouble because Massa outqualified him 13-6.

      1. You may recall that after many races where JV was stuck driving the dog of a car that Massa had a hand in developing, the engineers started setting the car up to JV’s driving style. Better results soon came. Peter Sauber would have been very smart to treat the one time champion as the #1 driver (IMHO).

        1. And Villeneuve finished in the points once in the second half of the season, achieving only 2 top tens. Massa still outscored him when the car was set up to Villeneuve’s preferences.

          Villeneuve was an embarrassment between 2003-2006. Get over it.

          1. David A … You should never let some silly stats get in the way of common sense. Besides, JV would never move over for a teammate … unless, of course, his car was puking oil. Now, that’s a driver!

  56. Looking at Robert Kubica’s performance over the season I think it would actually do Massa a world of good to get into a Renault car where the attention wont be so much on him. It would be like Alonso returning to Renault after his McLaren mis-adventure.

    1. Like Rubens said: “I was happier in a sh** Honda than at Ferrari.”

  57. I say no, get out of there. I think if not in 2011, then 2012. He does have an extension on his contract and like you said: few competitive seats open. So perhaps wait for one year and then get the hell out. Honestly, if I were treated like he’s been treated by a team, I would turn my back on them. Because he’s been there for YEARS now and suddenly gets shafted at what might have been the most triumphant moment in his career up to that point? It’s one thing if it’s being screwed by another team’s decision, it’s another if it’s a decision made by your own. I think it shows how much they actually care about him.

  58. Massa is clearly not even close to his better years, and even then he was just a tad above mediocre. Sure, he almost won the WDC, but then again worse drivers than him, Button as one, DID win the WDC (and Webber, an another, might win it this year).

    Ferrari cannot win the constructors’ title w/ Massa in the lineup. I would try and bring back Kimi, and let him have a go at Fernando.

    1. I’m a bit confused. You want a driver back that mediocre Massa beat? :P even if the excuse is used that Kimi didn’t like the car he still won’t like it with Fernando because like Felipe he prefers understeer and Kimi doesn’t like that. Kimi had his chance at Ferrari and the partnership unfortunately didn’t work out.
      Although it irks me the next most available, competitive driver who has a similar style to Alonso is Kubica and long term I’m not sold on whether he’s worth it anymore than Felipe but that’s just personal opinion.

      1. Raikkonen won the WDC. Massa didn’t.

        1. But over their three years together Massa beat him two years.

  59. Massa should leave Ferrari……………….. and go HOME. One less cry baby in F1 will not do the sport any harm, will not be missed and will not sadden me AT ALL.

    I’m not a Ferrari nor an Alonso fun, but I like Alonso 100 times more than Massa. And for the record, I only supported Kimi in Ferrari, while he was there…..NOT the TEAM and not the cry baby….

  60. I voted that he should leave the team. Because I think that f he won’t be able to beat Alonso, he will enter into Ferrari’s game, where his career as a pilot will be destroyed just like Barichello’s. That guy is talented, he has the guts and the talent to win races and championships, but he never will as long as he is Alonso’s teammate. And another problem if his situation goes on for some time : he will loose confidence in himself, and people will loose confidence in him…

  61. I voted No because Massa is wasting one of Ferrari’s seats, when they could have a better driver (e.g. Kubica) getting points for Ferrari. I am not a great Ferrari fan at the moment but they need to get a better driver in that seat because Massa is past his sell by date at Ferrari. He needs to be a number one seat to drive well, oterwise he just cries like a crybaby when he doesn’t get his way, or loses.

    However, what I don’t want to see is a great driver like Kubica move to Ferrari as he will suffer because unless he outdrives Alonso, Kubica will end up in the same position as Massa.

    1. I love Kubica, think he has a good head on his shoulders and enormous potential, but I am sick of people looking at him as if he is the second coming. He isn’t. He is a good driver, who is making a Renault which is far better than it is perceived, look quite good. Because he is doing a good job, but also as mentioned earlier, because he has full team support, and a rookie team mate. So every weekend he goes out hunting and gets a few scalps from the bigger squads. When in reality, Renault is a big squad again, faster than Mercedes and at times faster than McLaren and Ferrari this year.

      Like I said, I love Kubica, but he only just matched Heidfeld in their BMW years, and his one win, is only because Heidfeld moved over for him, and only because Massa had car trouble, Heikki was hopeless, and Hamilton conveniently took himself and Kimi out of the race.

      Kubica is good, but he isn’t better than Massa, so stop giving him the Ferrari seat prematurely.

      1. Kubica is good, but he isn’t better than Massa

        You really think so? I’d take Kubica over Massa any day. Put him in Massa’s car and I expect he’d give Alonso a lot of grief.

        1. “Giving Alonso grief” – Precisely why Ferrari are choosing Felipe over Kubica.

          Alonso is like a high-maintenance celebrity girl-friend. You know she is the best girl and you would want to be seen with her, but keeping hold of such a girl means buying her gifts, keeping her happy all the time. With Felipe, Ferrari have a very good no.2, Robert unfortunately can’t be that.

        2. Tifiamo Insieme
          17th October 2010, 23:43

          I’d like to see Kubica and Alonso in Ferrari next year getting plenty of 1-2 for the Scuderia (in whatever order), and I’m not convinced that it would give Alonso any grief whatsoever. At present Massa is a liability for the team, he should stop whining and begin scoring solid points that are going to Ferrari’s rivals.

        3. Very much agree.

        4. I agree that he would give Alonso a lot of grief, but that is because this season we are seeing Kubica at his highest level so far, at his best, and while that is good, it is not as good as Massa was at his best. While it remains to be seen if Massa can return to that level, I have a feeling he can.

  62. The bottom line is that if Massa’s best is what we have seen from him in the past, and whilst still in one of the best seats in F1 he is now only able to run in the mid-field then what is the point in him continuing in F1.

    If who his other team mate is enough to throw off his game then that is another reason he shouldn’t be in F1.

    Move over let some new talent in at the bottom of the grid, and let some of the similarly experienced drivers with more hunger, currently languishing in the cheap seats, move up.

  63. Tough call – I voted yes, but by mistake. Anyhoo, if he values his career as a racing driver he should probably leave and have a go at respectability with a weaker team. If he does well, who knows who might be interested after that. The flip side is that he might want to stay expressly because he thinks he can beat Alonso on pace and will want to prove it to everyone. He was certainly coming along well before his accident, so let’s hope that whichever way his career plays out he’ll still be able to go out with more than a whimper.

    As an aside, I really don’t get arguments that start with “move over and let the younger guys have a go”. I mean I don’t understand them period, but I particularily don’t understand them in reference to Massa who after all is only 29, which is hardly long in the tooth.

  64. He is not quick enough, anymore, so the arguement is irrelevant

  65. I am not sure why people are saying that Ferrri always deploy team orders. For your referecnce, In 2008, Kim dint drive too well after his win in Spain but then too Ferrari dint ask Kimi to play th supportig role to Massa’s title bid but they allowed Kimi to fight equally for the win in Spa which Kimi incidently didn’t win.
    The reason for that was that in 2008, Ferrari was fighting only with Mclarn and that year wasnt as tough as this year where there are 4-5 equal teams competing.
    This yer, Ferrai lost out to Red Bull and Mclaren in dev race pre Germany and hence wanted to give the drive who is fast and ahead with a proper chance of competing and practically speaking, it was the right thing to do (Though i felt ba for Felipe in Gemany and I am an Alonso fan).
    He should be in Ferrari as long as Ferrari wants him. AS sie as that.

    1. but they did rightly get kimi out of 2nd place at china.

      as mclaren did for lewis at germany too.

      but strangely no one cared?

      1. because not all “team orders” are illegal. Those weren’t.

  66. He will never be quick enough because Ferrari will continue to develope the car around Alonso. Massa will have to make the major adjustments. Watch the testing of the new tires and the 2011 car to see who struggles. Observe Ferrari’s response to Alonso’s concerns as opposed to Massa’s during winter testing. I think the inference will be quite clear by mid-Feburary.
    There is no way Massa can match Alonso’s pace under those sercumstances. I simply hope Ferrari has made this clear to him so he is under no illusions about where he stands on that team.

    1. How can we observe that response? I don’t think the teams make any of that information public, do they?

  67. Massa should stay. He has little chance in going to either Red Bull or Mcclaren and that is about it to challenge Ferrari. He had a shot at the title and he lost out. There is no reason he can not have a shot at it again. I can see Alonso ever being Shumi status.

  68. I voted No,as I feel Massa is wasting his time with Ferrari.Alonso will be with them for years,so Massa has no chance as his frame of mind and posture says it all > I am the number 2 driver.
    He should try for Williams.

  69. The only comment I have actually heard this year about team preferences did not come from Massa, but from another driver (“Not bad for a number two driver”). But, apparently you can outperfomr your mate even under unfair treatment.

    However there are suggestions here for Felipe to move to Red Bull to be treated in a fairer manner….

    The way to success might be for Ferrari to leave Maranello for Milton-Keynes, Woking, Perhaps even Enstone would buy them some mercy.

    On a more serious note, if Felipe cannot make it to WDC in Ferrari (during so many years) there is little hope anywhere else (statistically, at least), so why leaving?

  70. I’ve never really rated Massa. His problem is he isn’t quick enough. He is in a car quick enough to win the championship, but he’s not even close. Moving to a different team won’t hide this fact. You can lay the blame on the accident or on the tyres if you want, but currently Massa doesn’t deserve a race-winning car. Give it to Kubica.

  71. more of a question of should ferrari get rid of him.

    yes germany was not pretty and handled badly, but he cut the corner to take the lead. and when alonso got a nose ahead massa threw a wild one on him at the hairpin. if massa was fighting for the title id say all is fair well done massa. but he wasnt and isnt. he should of been smart. like hekki had to at same corner same track. and also did at silverstone.

    you cant just perform one day out of 19. ferrari are trying to win the title with the slowest of the 3 cars. they needed to get alonso into the lead. yes alonso could of tried to properly race him, but they would of looked dumb if emotional massa did to him what he did to lewis in fuji 08. massa cant race like lewis/fernando/kimi you got the impression that day that alonso going past would of ended in a double DNF. and then we would of had had a 2 horse title race of red bulls only

    his performance and lack of racing skills have been shocking in the last 2 races. ok qualy wasnt his fault at singapore, but he didnt overtake anyone all day. and in that car that is not good enough.

    1. yes germany was not pretty and handled badly, but he cut the corner to take the lead.

      No he didn’t, he ran wide after getting a far better start than Alonso and Vettel.

      when alonso got a nose ahead massa threw a wild one on him at the hairpin.

      Do you know what defending your position is? No one saw anything wrong with his driving. Massa just defended his position as he was entitled to.

      if massa was fighting for the title id say all is fair well done massa. but he wasnt and isnt.

      Absolutely not. At the time, Felipe still had a mathematical chance of the title, and as a result, he had the right to attempt to win his first race of the season. Perhaps that one win (on such a special day) could have buoyed him up to win more. We’ll never know now. A true racer goes out to win races or fight for the best position possible, which just made it all the more disapointing that he did eventually pull over.

      he should of been smart. like hekki had to at same corner same track. and also did at silverstone.

      In Silverstone he simply gave up lke a wimp, and in Hockenheim he was “smart” because on one he knew his teammate was on a different strategy.

      1. they were not on different strategy they were racing to end of race at that point after SC. the only strategy they were different on was lewis was fighting for title and kova wasnt. so get that out of your head. it was the same. anyone can see that. sorry but it is. neither is pretty but at least ferrari dont hide it. does that make it better?no of course not.

        i know what defending a positions but like i said which u didnt read clearly as team mates and a team mate well out of the title race, which he was (stop deluding yourself that he wasnt) it was a bit risky. as racers it was fine. if anything fernando gave him way to much room. but massa has a history of just hitting other drivers in wheel to wheel combat for no apparent reason. like he did in fuji. and oddly last weekend too.

        We all want them to race bulls out, but that dont happen with team mates. mclaren gave the order to ‘save fuel’ in turkey to stop them racing when only lewis had to save fuel, and they have not been wheel to wheel since. button had 10lap fresher tyres in germany and just sat there. isnt that same thing? webber was quite clear that ‘he knew what the rules were’ last weekend

        running wide into turn 1. something that has been discussed every year at germany and usually threatened with a pen. like kimi should of got at spa. had he not done that he would of been slow on exit and not infront of vettel and alonso by turn 2. he gained alot of speed doing it. fair play he got away with it. like at spa with his grid slot. but it wasnt right

        1. they were not on different strategy they were racing to end of race at that point after SC. the only strategy they were different on was lewis was fighting for title and kova wasnt.

          Hamilton was just making up the positions he lost by pitting under normal racing conditions. He was on newer, fresher rubber because he didn’t come in under the safety car. So yes, that counts as a different strategy (making up for a strategy blunder).

          it was the same. anyone can see that. sorry but it is. neither is pretty but at least ferrari dont hide it. does that make it better?no of course not.

          Mclaren didn’t play around with their drivers engine setings. Hamilton didn’t whinge over the radio. Massa wasn’t lapping two seconds slower than Alonso. Definately not the same.

          i know what defending a positions but like i said which u didnt read clearly as team mates and a team mate well out of the title race, which he was (stop deluding yourself that he wasnt) it was a bit risky.

          He was 31 points behind Alonso, who was well in the title race. Without team orders, it would have been down to 24, less than a race win. And honestly, far more unpredictable things have happened in F1 than Massa finding his confidence and winning races.

          We all want them to race bulls out, but that dont happen with team mates. mclaren gave the order to ‘save fuel’ in turkey to stop them racing when only lewis had to save fuel, and they have not been wheel to wheel since. button had 10lap fresher tyres in germany and just sat there. isnt that same thing? webber was quite clear that ‘he knew what the rules were’ last weekend

          All of those “hold station” instances are cancelled out by Monaco 2007, where the FIA insisted that it was standard procedure to not let them take additional risk letting their cars race. Swapping your cars around like at Hockenheim is supposed to be still illegal.

  72. I don’t think he has much choice, this is his best opportunity to win. Unfortunately he his not as good as Fernando. To everyone saying he is not allowed to win at Ferrari that is total crap, he never had the speed this year, thats it, therefore he supports Fernando.

    If he had won more races and being up there with the other guys then he would not have had to bow to Alonso, and they would have had a shot at the constructors title.

    So basically when he stays next year he needs to up his game big time otherwise the same as this year will happen and i think that’s exactly what will happen.

  73. He should stay, but only if he mans it up. Racing is about winning by beating every other driver on the grid including, and most importantly, your teammate. He might as well quit racing and start synchronised swimming.

    Based on his current levels of performance, apart from the new teams, I don’t see why any other team would want Massa as a driver. Better risk on a rookie than go for a jaded performer as he seems to be now.

    So for me, he should stay and pick up his game next season with the tyre and other changes coming. If he gets some self-confidence and performance back he should look to move on then, because it’s never going to be a happy relationship with Alonso. If he doesn’t look any better next season then frankly he should quit.

    1. Based on his current levels of performance, apart from the new teams, I don’t see why any other team would want Massa as a driver. Better risk on a rookie than go for a jaded performer as he seems to be now.

      Spot on.

      I think he should stay, give it a go next year, maybe the new tyres might help, if not, save a few millions and retire at the end of the season.

      If Ferrari is not happy with his performance or think it’s waste of a good seat with a weak driver, they should just fire him.

  74. Massa has alot of heart and loves the Ferrari fans just as much as Schumi loves winning WDC’s, so he would most likely stick it out, for now.

    Maybe he should stay with Ferrari just to close the gap on ability with Alonso so he isn’t stamped with the; “yes he is experienced, but he isn’t faster then alonso, so why should we back him?, we need a driver who can beat alonso…”

    Or he should go to Force india, i’m sure Vijay would be quite chuffed having a driver like Massa driving for him and within two to three years they should get podiums more often since they would develop the car around him.

  75. Felipe had a time where Ferrari supported him as a potential #1, I think. But that time is gone. Ferrari are a very focussed team: I can’t blame them for that.

    Is Mas a good driver? Hell, yes. He needs–like any other driver–the full support and belief of the team. Scuderia are behind Alonso, so he must go elsewhere to find it.

    1. spot on. he had all the support in 08 of kimi. so he cant complain now.

    2. Do you think he was happier with MSC,they are still great friends?

  76. Ultimately it’s Massa’s decision whether he wants to be the NUMBER 2 driver for another two years or whether he wants to join somewhere else to prove that he is a worthy WC.

    If I was Massa I would have talk with the Renault for 2011 or with Red Bull for 2012,but I think he will be better in Ferrari for his own good other then move somewhere else.

  77. no offence Keith but the question and the poll is no sense
    In 60 years of F1 I never heard of a driver choosing the team.
    Is always the team that select the driver so I think the question should be “Should Ferrari keep Massa”
    My opinion is no. why? he doesn’t worth 10 million a year. 10 million dollar are to much for a driver that can’t shut up and do his job
    so if massa is able to find another team ready to pay him 10 million a year he can leave right away but I don’t think so. Massa might not be a high class driver but he is not stupid and he knows very vell he can’t find a better pay in circuit. They are at least 24 other drivers that would kill to have his place at Ferrari

    1. When you say that at least 24 drivers would kill for Massa’s place at Ferrari, are you referring to drivers on the current F1 grid? If so, I would like to know the basis for your assumption.

    2. In 60 years of F1 I never heard of a driver choosing the team.

      Decent drivers might have a contract with the team they’re currently racing for, and be offered a seat in another car. So they obviously can get to choose.

      1. exactly as you say ” and be offered” so it is still the team that offers not the driver

  78. ok as well not 24 let say 50

  79. I want Massa to stay and out perform Alonso next year without team orders.

    1. like with kimi he will have that chance. but alonso is a different beast to kimi, tho kimi was probably a faster driver. just not complete package.

      1. Yeah Kimi’s package lacked the ego and the whining.

  80. If Ferrari had ever had the same confidence in Massa that they do in Alonso, they would have offered Alonso’s seat to Jarno Trull or Timo Glock and saved a boat load of cash. Massa is a good driver and missed the 2008 title by a mouse fart, but he should leave and hope someone else can deliver him a title-worthy car. He will never beat Alonso over the course of a season in the same car. The best case scenario for everyone (except Alonso, perhaps) would be for Massa to swap seats with Kubica on the hope that Renault can put together a race-winning car for 2011.

  81. Probably you can get Fisichella a seat – they have been teammates before. Massa will do good in Williams or Force India. Too bad he’s not performing that well after the ’09 crash. Not the Massa we’ve known before.

  82. as i have already mentioned
    i have to blame ferrari for this situation of massa lacking points to alonso….bcoz of lack of good strategies from team…they are not able to handle critical situations…
    compare maclaren….although button slower than hamilton…in points they are almost equal

    1. Or maybe Massa can not make a strategy work?

      The only strategy that works for Massa is to get on pole (or gain P1 at the start) and win from there.

      1. Exactly. Which is why his self proclaimed favourite track is the processional Valencia.

        Massa’s only other strategy appears to be to thrash around on the grid like a lunatic, forcing other drivers to avoid his potential accident. This last race was the logical extension of that desperate attempt to steal places at the only place in the race he can.

        1. disagree with you in a lot of ways , Stephen , thinking back on some passes Massa has made on Hamilton , etc. but that’s on his “good days” , which he has lots of , but also has too many bad ones in between. So I think all in all , Massa’s biggest problem comes down to lack of consistency

  83. Shahriar Ahsan
    18th October 2010, 6:48

    I never really though he was a good driver… lacks overtaking capability and he can only perform whent the car is reallly good. Its guys like ALO, RUB, VET, HAM amuses me to see that they get most out of the car.

  84. He should stay simply because he’s the perfect Number 2 for Alonso. Beaten in the head, beaten on track and offering little challenge to Fernando’s ego.

  85. Ultimately it doesn’t make sense to say that Massa will always play second fiddle to Alonso. Should there be a polarisation in form then it makes sense to back the best driver does it not? If Massa stays as number two at Ferrari than I would say it’s more down to his performance gap to Alonso than pure favouritism.

  86. I reckon massa deserves another chance he has had a bit of pressure on him this season etc Alonso as team mate. Red Bull having very dominant cars Mclarens regaining form from last season

  87. I think Massa should quit the sport, he is not special anyway, and after the accident he has become a bit slower than before, he wont be missed. My main problem with Massa is that his staying in F1 has made the two last great F1 drivers quit the sport. First MSC and then Kimi.
    I don’t think Alonso is that good either, but he is in good mental shape, and I know Ferrari would prefer to let Massa go than to see Alonso leave (at least in this WDC, just like the first year with Kimi). And about Keith’s premise about liking drivers who can won races, Massa like the other 21 drivers can win races in the best car, the only guy that can do it (without weather or another odd situation involved) in not the best car would be Schumi (like he did in 1993, 1996,1997,1998, 1999 and 2006) and he is a bit old now, maybe also Raikkonen (like he did in spa last year with that dog ferrari) but he is out.
    Top seats in F1 right now ? just one, the guy with the red helmet at Mercedes, the other guys can be replaced by GP2 guys and it would be the same championship: guys driving the red bull at the top, Ferrari second, Mclaren third, etc…. to be fair the second Mercedes would have 50 points more than Schumi but you were talking about top seats, and apart from Schumi, the F1 top seats have died or are retired.

    1. PS: I like Massa, but I think after the accident something is missing now.

  88. “My interest in this matter is entirely selfish – I want to see the top seats in F1 occupied by drivers who are going to fight to win races.”

    I know most people would want Felipe to be not another Rubens. But if he leaves, Ferrari will find someone who can be like Rubens and Felipe thus far. When was the last time Ferrari had two potential world champions in their team? The closest in the recent years is Kimi & Felipe.

    I haven’t followed F1 for a long time, but have Ferrari had two world champions driving in their team?

  89. Hope I’m wrong , because he comes across as a nice sort of bloke , but I think Massa has had his best chances in F1 already. Let’s face it , he will not beat Alonso at Ferrari ,simply because Alonso is slightly better , so the team get behind him and that makes all the difference . So , while leaving Ferrari may leave him worse off , it would be a chance worth taking – maybe a stroke of luck he ends up like Button did with Brawn , and wins a WDC – would be a deserving one after all his bad luck.

  90. “It’s time to do what Trulli did: find a new home and let someone else help Alonso win his championships”.

    Come on Keith, can’t you be a bit more neutral in your articles?:>)
    At least it was Alonsos team mate that was ordered to let him past and not some back marker in a toyota on the last corner of the last grand prix (interlagos 2008 ring a bell)? :>)

    1. I’ve never promised to be ‘neutral’. At any rate, you seem to have overlooked that I was putting the cases for and against – I never said that was what I thought.

      And did you not notice Glock actually gained a position by gambling to stay on dry weather tyres at the end of that race?

      1. mmm I’m sure he could have just held on for 1 last corner come on… :>)

          1. I think we’ll always disagree on that one..anyway can I say that I really like all the work that u r doing and I absolutely love the mixture of Mclaren-Ferrari and Red Bull fans expressing their views on here. Just one thing I dont know if its me but the comments don’t appear to be in time sequence? Plus I’ve never had the chance to ask u personally, who do u think will win the title and laslty who do u support?

  91. I think Massa is a lovely guy and was cruely ROBBED of the world title in 2008 which was clearly his and not Hamiltons. Having said that all the best and richest teams want and need the best drivers just like in football, in order to win the big prizes, and I think that unfortunately for whatever reason Massa is not performing at all well. I think Ferrari should let him go and recruit some1 who is outperforming their car like Kubica or Kobayashi (how exiting would that be!) A straight swap him for Kubica at Renault would be just fine. As for the “fast team mate, slow team mate” argument, I don’t buy it at all, no matter who the team mate is the driver should be trying to outperform him, and actually having a fast team mate should be spurring the driver on more.. As for Massa even before the Hockenheim incident he couldnt hold a candle to Alonso and could not help the team at all with points and therefore its justified why Ferrari were forced to back Fernando..

    1. Alonso would never permit Kubica to sit in the other car. (An extremely quick guy who does not preen and complain at all times would cause untold angst in that team.) And that’s the whole problem here, isn’t it? Ferrari want a very special type of second driver: someone good enough for the Scuderia, but who will wear with quiet pride Alonso’s boot-prints on his back. There are not 24 current drivers with this special trait. Right now there may not be any at all.

      1. I think any except the big Ego ones like Hamilton or Vetel would happily take the seat.

        1. Not if they have a desire to win. Besides, Ferrari don’t like internal drama and Alonso can’t handle it.

  92. kenneth Ntulume
    18th October 2010, 15:25

    Alonso and Ferrari is a dream match.
    In terms of character, thinking, personality, arrogance.
    Let Massa move on…..that’s if he doesn’t want to be a 2nd support driver…
    Brazilian’s and Ferrari don’t match

  93. So much discussion over so little choice. Why does anyone believe he will be be better off on ANY other team then Ferrari? STAY AND FIGHT AS OPPOSED TO TURNING TAIL AND RUNNING.

    If Massa is half the competitor his fans believe he is he should get on with proving his place on the team and outperform Alonso whenever he can.

    Maybe, just maybe, he can push himself into a championship leading competitor in 2011, then Ferrari will have no choice but to treat both drivers equally. In spite of Alonso’s ego and back stabbing politiking.

  94. jose arellano
    18th October 2010, 18:23

    i think everybody makes comments on the basis that all drivers have a fixed amount of talent. and they dont.. it fluctuates.. so probably massa is on a down and alonso on a high.. probably lewis was on a high in 07 etc. etc…

    but i still think alonso on top form is the best on the grid

    1. I don’t necessarily agree with your view of how drivers’ performances have changed (I think Hamilton is driving better this year than he has in any other season) but you’re dead right about drivers’ performance levels fluctuating. I mean, just look at Schumacher…

      1. Fluctuacting because of rules and driving styles of drivers. For example wider tires and were better for Shumi, so he suffers now.

  95. I would love to see Jacques Villeneuve as Alonso’s team mate…they both drive the same way…setting up the Ferrari would be a lock an load.

    1. J. Villeneuve would be doing as badly as Massa, if not worse.

      1. Proven in fact, by Villeneuve actually being Alonso’s team mate for a while in 2004.

  96. When I first heard the message to Massa to move aside at Hockenheim it made my skin crawl, and thats from a non Ferrari fan!. For a team to welcome back and then throw away a driver is totally despicable, whether the Team thought He was unable to do the job even though there were the points avaliable or they had put there eggs in one basket with Alonso is irrelevent, what Ferrari have done is Down right Dirty. Oh…. the original question…….Massa should walk from there with He`s head held high knowing He gave His best.

  97. Long time lurker, first time poster. I like Massa and I think that’s the problem. A lot of people put feelings before logic. He is not getting doing good in qualifying, not doing good in races, and is not living up to the car. Just like my old boss once told me, all these salesmen have the same tools, they are all nice guys, but at the end I look at that spreadsheet and it doesn’t lie. Same thing here. Let’s agree that Ferrari don’t allow him to be competitive with his teammate, well then why not finish just a couple places behind instead of sometimes seeming like he’s running for Force India?

  98. im a huge hamilton fan and id love him to move to redbull and let massa be teammates with button at mclaren

  99. He can’t voluntary give up Ferrari and go to another smaller team. If he is thinking that another driver would drive that car better he just have to retire.

    But he won’t give up, I think he will try to make it different next year.

    The only chance I see to have another driver alongside Alonso is if Ferrari fires Massa.

  100. Ron in Michigan
    19th October 2010, 10:09

    He should have resigned after Hungary 2010. Phuck Ferrari and Alonso! Go home and make babies with that beautiful wife.

  101. Agreed, should Massa stay at Ferrari, his chances of beating Alonso are slim. But what are his chances of beating him should he move to another team? Well, unless that other team is RBR or McLaren, I would probably say that they are non-existing. There is no point in slipping further back on the grid. Sticking to Ferrari and hoping for the occasional Alonso slip-up is his best choise. After all, if you want evidence that a slower driver (and, maybe, less supported by his team) can give his more illustrious team mate a run for his money, look no further than Webber and Button…

  102. Massa to do everything he can to help Alonso win the WDC?

    I was debating whether to link this article… but it has quotation marks and everything. So I doubt even Planet F1 could screw this one up.

  103. Massa needs to hang in there. Alonso will shoot himself in the foot (again) and Massa will be there to capitalise. He’s having an off year. People do. He’ll be back and he has dealt with WDC’s before.

  104. Most people are bragging about how felipe is being treated as a no.2. Remember in 08 kimi was faster, and after leadig the championship after france was very unlucky, same issues with qualy as massa has now. Kimi relegated himself to #2 and help massa try and win the tittle, he moved over for massa just as massa did to alonso and to kimi in 07, thats the way it goes at ferrari, massa should shut up and drive and see what he can do next year.

  105. He is lucky to be at ferrari this year and next, cause really he is not better than raikkonen, kimi’s first year at sauber was better than massa, kimis first year in a top car (macca) was better than massas first at ferrari, kimi has fought tight for 3 championships, massa only one. kimis first year at ferrari was champion, massa struggled for most of the year. And remember in 08 kimi was leading the championship, had more fastest laps massa, as well as demonstrated on real driving circuits like monaco, silverstone and spa, that he was a faster driver, and in 09 before the accident same thing, massa had more points but kimi was extracting more from the car, would massa have given them a win at spa on that awful 09 ferrari?.. i doubt it

    1. Massa was on pole at Monaco. The rest (apart from all you say about 2009 of course) is pretty accurate.

  106. Younger Hamilton
    19th October 2010, 17:55

    I think Felipe Has had it rough since he first joined Ferrari,with struggling at the beginning of the season to adapt to the new organisation in 2006 and been team-mate to Seven time champ Michael,but picked up three wins.Getting destroyed by Kimi in 07 and losing the championship to Lewis by one point some parts which were pure bad luck but beat Kimi at the same time.09,was doing a good job until that horrible and scary incident in Hungary i think if werent for that incident, Felipe would have definetely at least one Race for Ferrari that year and 10 obviously getting dismantled and treated 2nd best to Fernando,a two time champion.I Dont think Felipe should help Fernando at all i think he should be independant and focus on himself thats my opinion but i know Felipe as a Good Team player so i really respect his decision.

  107. Paycheck. Future test driver. Third reason to stay: there must be one.

  108. I think best pair to see would be Rosberg and Kubica together. Put them in any top team and they will stand out greatly from the rest. Coulthard drove redbull car few weeks ago in England and he was amazed how much down force it has! Put in todays redbull car Nico and Robert and they would have been miles ahead of all the rest. there are no better drivers than them now.

    1. Rosberg and Kubica? There are no better drivers than them now? PLEASE!!!!

  109. I am suprised that 61% of the voters said he should go, but then that is their opinion which is much respected, I voted for him to stay. As mentioned above, he has partnered other world champions before but none as selfish as Alonso, for those that say, “What about Schumacher?”, remember he was very instrumental in teaching Massa what he knows today, including the outright speed of last year. What Massa needs to do is not change teams, but change his attitude in the team. How do all of us handle people at work or on social occasions? You try and go down or up to their level, most times sticking to your “guns” of no change works against you. He should become more forceful in his demands from the team, and easier said than done, rekindle his 2009 speed. Alonso will be rattled and falter, remember his stay at McLaren. Hamilton showed him didn’t he?

  110. I wonder which way the poll would have gone if it had shown a picture of a ‘smiling’ Massa in a Ferrari suit.

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