Lotus optimistic after extra day at Valencia

F1 Fanatic round-up

Lotus have completed their first full day?s testing, after power steering issues blighted the T128 since its maiden run on Tuesday.

Heikki Kovalainen is very positive, saying, ??Valencia was an excellent test for me. Even though we had some issues with the power steering on the first couple of days you have to remember we weren?t even at the first two tests last year.

??One of the most tangible improvements from last year is the lower centre of gravity we have this year. It?s a smaller chassis and…I can turn in without having to constantly correct oversteer or understeer and as the whole rear end has been designed with the Renault engine and Red Bull gearbox in mind, it is aerodynamically much more efficient.??

Links

Top F1 links from the past 24 hours:

Lotus positive after extra Valencia day (Autosport)

??Jarno Trulli and Heikki Kovalainen finally completed a day’s running in the new Lotus T128 at Valencia, after the team stayed on at the Spanish venue for an extra day’s testing having cured the power steering issues that blighted it earlier in the week.??

Tony Fernandes hits back over Lopez? Lotus F1 comments (The Norwich Advertiser)

??The well publicised falling out and ongoing legal dispute over who can use the Lotus name in Formula One is set to be resolved in the High Court towards the end of March.

??Lopez had claimed Fernandes should admit the whole scenario was about money ?ǣ however, Fernandes said yesterday: ??I considered doing a deal, but the one they (Hethel-based Group Lotus) offered me would have bankrupted us. I decided my (??80m) investment and 250 jobs were in jeopardy, so we bought the (Team Lotus) name??I would much rather we remained as Lotus Racing, but??my licence was terminated.???

F1 team orders are wrong even if legal, says Button (Reuters)

??So-called ‘team orders’ are unlikely to tarnish this season’s Formula One title battle despite being made legal by the sport’s governing body, according to McLaren’s Jenson Button.??

Williams see stock market flotation as solution to loss of sponsorship (The Guardian)

??The Williams Formula One team have confirmed they will go public to secure their long-term future as an independent concern. The British team said in a statement today that they expect their shares to start trading on the Frankfurt stock exchange on 2 March.??

Sato, Viso return as driving force (Indycar.com)

??Team co-owners Kevin Kalkhoven and Jimmy Vasser announced that Takuma Sato and E.J. Viso will contest the 2011 IZOD IndyCar Series season for KV Racing Technology-Lotus. ??

Australian GP sticks to 5pm start (Autosport)

??The Australian Grand Prix will stick to its 5pm start time this season, despite the FIA having considered last year that it would bring the race forward because conditions were too dark for the 2010 race.??

David Coulthard urges Paul di Resta F1 debut realism (BBC F1)

??Former McLaren driver David Coulthard says people must not expect too much of fellow Scot Paul di Resta in his debut season on the Formula 1 circuit.??

Mark Webber (@AussieGrit via Twitter)

??First week of testing done, think I pressed all the right buttons!??

Episode 5: Testing (The Flying Lap)

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Comment of the day

McLaren launched their 2011 F1 car in Berlin today. It?s been the subject of much debate but nemo has kindly mocked up some comparisons:

Here you go guys.. Last year?s launch car compared to this. I?ve tried to scale it as best I can. Does this year?s wheelbase looks much longer..?

http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/ad33/NEM087/F1%202011/McLarenMP4compare.png

Here?s a quick pic of the McLaren compared to the Ferrari. Again I?ve tried to scale it as best I can (according to rim size): http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/ad33/NEM087/F1%202011/mp4-26f150compare.png
nemo

From the forum

Ned Flanders asks what are your best F1 jokes?

Happy birthday!

No F1 Fanatic birthdays today. If you want a birthday shout-out tell us when yours is by emailing me, using Twitter or adding to the list here.

On this day in F1

Juan Manuel Fangio won the non-championship Buenos Aires City Grand Prix at the Mendoza circuit in Argentina.

Fangio took pole position in his Lancia-Ferrari and finished 25 seconds ahead of Stirling Moss in a Maserati 250F.

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69 comments on Lotus optimistic after extra day at Valencia

  1. Prisoner Monkeys (@prisoner-monkeys) said on 5th February 2011, 0:15

    “Lopez had claimed Fernandes should admit the whole scenario was about money – however, Fernandes said yesterday: ‘I considered doing a deal, but the one they (Hethel-based Group Lotus) offered me would have bankrupted us. I decided my (£80m) investment and 250 jobs were in jeopardy, so we bought the (Team Lotus) name…I would much rather we remained as Lotus Racing, but…my licence was terminated.’”

    What’s to say that it was Group Lotus’ intention to bankrupt Fernandes? The way he’s telling it, the offer that was made was poisoned honey. Given his behaviour and his attitude so far, I’m willing to bet that it hasn’t so much as crossed Fernandes’ mind that maybe the reason why Group Lotus offered him ten million pounds was because that was all they could afford to offer. He made the right choice in turning the offer down, because it only accounted for 12.5% of their budget, but he seems to think that everything has a malicious agenda to it, designed solely to put him out of business. What was he expecting, that Group Lotus would pay his team their entire budget?

    The sooner the High Court rules in favour of LRGP, the better.

    • where has he said it was offered with malicious intent? He never mentions his thoughts on the reason of the size of the offer. Whatever the reason, it was low enough that it wasn’t viable to take it, which you even admit!

      You’re trying to twist his words to suit your own biases.

      • Prisoner Monkeys (@prisoner-monkeys) said on 5th February 2011, 0:43

        He never mentions his thoughts on the reason of the size of the offer.

        But the first thing he mentions is that it would have bankrupted him. He also suggests that he bought the Team Lotus name to avoid said bankruptcy. So, if the Group Lotus offer would have bankrupted him, how come Fernandes has been able to put together an eighty million-pound budget after turning them down? Surely he could have done the same under a different name.

        • You said yourself he did the right thing in turning it down! The offer, for whatever reason, wasn’t viable to ensure the survival of the team.

          For example – If you’re selling a sponsorship package at 20 million dollars, and someone offers you 10 million dollars for that package, you’ve then got a 10 million budget deficit.

          For whatever reason, the offer from Lotus wasn’t sufficient and for what ever reason may have pushed the team’s survival to the limit. Fernandes, rather than putting the team and the jobs of his workers at risk, turned it down and went chasing money elsewhere. Even you agree that it was the right thing to do!

          Yes he may have done the same under a different name, but who knows. Lotus built up such a following and a reputation during their first year, it was a recognisable brand. Branding is super-important, they built their reputation as Lotus and changing that brand would have made it more difficult.

          • Hamish said on 5th February 2011, 2:02

            Theres pros and cons for both sides.

            Capitalist vs Capitalist – the loser at the end of the day is F1.

          • Bernard said on 5th February 2011, 2:27

            Regarding the source:

            Autosport

          • PM I’m sure Fernandes is no layman either, but step back a moment and look at the situation. Fernandes made a deal with Proton to revive the Lotus name, and he did so, using eighty million of his own dollers to build a completely new F1 team.

            Then because Bahar became involved with Proton and had his own ambitions, he’s puled the rug out from under Tony. No offence mate, but Bahar is the bad guy. He’s adding nothing to the sport except for one hundred dollars, and he’s damaging the Lotus name while he does it. He’s another Luca, I don’t understand how you can think he is a positive force for the sport.

        • Bernard said on 5th February 2011, 1:59

          I am disappointed with it, I think it has become very personal. I have never made it personal – and what have I done wrong?

          I was offered a chance to restart Lotus. Proton agreed, they gave me a five-year deal. I did it in good faith, I spent my own money, I have spent £80 million building this team – and I then had the Lotus Racing contract unceremoniously violated for some T-shirt violations which we were challenging. I was smart enough to go and buy Team Lotus though.

          I love Lotus and I didn’t want all this stuff. I said to the boys in the pits last year, who were very emotional, that we may give up the name because we don’t want to drag Lotus into the mud. A few of them came and said: ‘Don’t do it, I was born in Norfolk, I worked for Lotus so don’t do it.’

          I never wanted to give it up, I put my heart and soul into this, but for the sake of the brand I would do it. Well, Group Lotus offered me £6 million to give them everything, the name, everything – but we have spent £80 million. To accept their offer would have bankrupted the team as we would have lost the FOM money, and I wasn’t going to do that.

          We have 250 jobs here, we put our own money in, and so we are going to carry on. And I feel good about it. I was reluctant to discuss that offer – but there was a lot of pressure on us.

          Tony Fernandes

          • Prisoner Monkeys (@prisoner-monkeys) said on 5th February 2011, 2:05

            My reference says ten million, but it didn’t specify a currency. Maybe exchange rates mean ten million dollars is six million pounds or something.

            The point is that in reading Fernandes’ comments, he seems to be making out that there is a massive conspiracy against him. Reading some of his other statements and the way the team have presented themselves – like Gascoyne saying they wanted to embarrass other teams – it’s certainly in character.

          • Hamish said on 5th February 2011, 2:19

            And your reference is? Just curious.

          • Bernard said on 5th February 2011, 2:20

            I know what you’re saying PM but it seems pretty obvious that they and the public have been manipulated by Proton/Group Lotus and now Lopez and for what?

            It’s no wonder really that they feel the need to give everyone the finger – I would too if I legally owned Team Lotus. ;-p

          • Prisoner Monkeys (@prisoner-monkeys) said on 5th February 2011, 2:53

            And your reference is? Just curious.

            This: http://www.motorsport.com/news/article.asp?ID=399228&FS=F1

            it seems pretty obvious that they and the public have been manipulated by Proton/Group Lotus and now Lopez

            If there has been any manipulation going on, it has been done by both sides. Tony Fernandes keeps portraying himself as some righteous underdog valiantly trying to slay the dragon that is Dany Bahar. A lot of the stuff they have put out has been very aggressive, and borders on Cold War rhetoric at times.It’s fairly obvious that Tony Fernandes isn’t the innocent babe that Dany Dahar is trying to take advantage of, whatever Fernandes may make out.

          • Hamish said on 5th February 2011, 3:00

            Cheers. Was not doubting you, more looking for additonal stories on it.

          • Macca (@macca) said on 5th February 2011, 3:56

            The point is that in reading Fernandes’ comments, he seems to be making out that there is a massive conspiracy against him.

            He at no point said that it was a conspiracy. He simply stated that selling for 6 million after spending 80 million was not financially feasible, and I have to say, I kind of see his point. After all, F1 is business as much as sport.

          • I am disappointed with it, I think it has become very personal. I have never made it personal – and what have I done wrong?

            I was offered a chance to restart Lotus. Proton agreed, they gave me a five-year deal. I did it in good faith, I spent my own money, I have spent £80 million building this team – and I then had the Lotus Racing contract unceremoniously violated for some T-shirt violations which we were challenging. I was smart enough to go and buy Team Lotus though.

            I love Lotus and I didn’t want all this stuff. I said to the boys in the pits last year, who were very emotional, that we may give up the name because we don’t want to drag Lotus into the mud. A few of them came and said: ‘Don’t do it, I was born in Norfolk, I worked for Lotus so don’t do it.’

            I never wanted to give it up, I put my heart and soul into this, but for the sake of the brand I would do it. Well, Group Lotus offered me £6 million to give them everything, the name, everything – but we have spent £80 million. To accept their offer would have bankrupted the team as we would have lost the FOM money, and I wasn’t going to do that.

            We have 250 jobs here, we put our own money in, and so we are going to carry on. And I feel good about it. I was reluctant to discuss that offer – but there was a lot of pressure on us.

          • Prisoner Monkeys (@prisoner-monkeys) said on 5th February 2011, 7:19

            He at no point said that it was a conspiracy. He simply stated that selling for 6 million after spending 80 million was not financially feasible, and I have to say, I kind of see his point. After all, F1 is business as much as sport.

            Oh, I know what he said and what he didn’t say. But don’t just focus on this statement – look at all of them. He still doesn’t say it’s a conspiracy, but he does a lot to make his team out to be a poor, defenceless virgin while Dany Bahar is a hungry, slavering beast demanding satisfaction.

        • BasCB said on 5th February 2011, 13:08

          I think I read a tweet or something on this where Fernandez mentioned Group Lotus offering $ 6 million (that equalls what the Chapman family received when selling the Team Lotus, possibly that is one of the reasons for offering this sum).

          Hardly a fair offer, especially as you surely know, Fernandez would have lost the money from FOM had he changed the chassis name from Lotus to something else (ignoring the very unlikely case all teams would agree with such a move, at least HRT would never go for that one).
          And who knows, how the few external sponsors would have reacted to that late change of name.

    • Icthyes said on 5th February 2011, 8:15

      PM, I can understand withholding support from Teal Lotus because of Fernandes’ squandering of his position by his moral superiority clap-trap (as I do), but to actively support Group Lotus is frankly ridiculous.

      Fernandes did all the hard work, raised the money, run a team to bring the Lotus name back into F1 (for better or worse; I’m still uneasy with the idea). Bahar and GL just want a slice of that pie they did nothing to create.

      AirMalaysia took on the Lotus name and became “a” Lotus. They feel like a Lotus, down to the mechanics. Renault have never wanted to be Lotus, only the owners who want to make a return on their investment do and even they probably couldn’t care less what they are called, so long as it has value. The personnel though, I bet, have no wish to be Lotus. As Renault, they beat both Adrian Newey and Michael Schumacher, the two giants of the past 20 years of F1. I seriously doubt they want to trade on anyone else’s heritage but their own.

      The sooner Team Lotus wins and a ban on Renault styling themselves as anything else in interviews (they should be allowed to keep the sponsorship on the car, just not claim to be Lotus, which they are so far from being it’s a joke), the better.

      • Prisoner Monkeys (@prisoner-monkeys) said on 5th February 2011, 8:40

        Bahar and GL just want a slice of that pie they did nothing to create.

        Actually, they made Team Lotus. When Fernandes started his team, he wasnted it to be caled Lotus – but David Hunt wasn’t interested in selling the rights to the Team Lotus name. Their only other option was to go to Bahar and ask for permission to use the Lotuc Cars name. Since Bahar and Lotus Cars wanted to be involved in the sport – their sponsoring of several teams across multiple disciplines of motorsport is testament to that – they agreed. By all accounts, they were happy with Fernandes and the work he was doing, right up until the moment they felt Fernandes violated the licencing agreement to use the Lotus Cars name. This was apparrently a dispute over merchandising; it seems that the licencing agreement prohibited Fernandes from using the Lotus name for anything outside the team. Group Lotus evidently feel that he did just that, and decided that they did not want to be associated with Fernandes anymore, especially if he was going to misuse their name. They’re not “trying to grab a slice of the pie” – they’re trying to preserve their own name, which they have every right to do if Fernandes misused it. They don’t trust him with it, and evidently feel their fortunes are better with Renault. They’re not the ones trying to pass themselves off as Team Lotus. They’re not the ones claiming that Team Lotus’ history is their own. All they did was split from Fernandes and make a black and gold livery.

        If the High Court rules in favour of Group Lotus, Fernandes will not be able to use the Lotus name. That’s what they’re arguing: that by running as Team Lotus, with a name similar to their own, Fernandes is effectively trading on their name since there is nothing to separate the two teams. If the High Court rules in favour of Fernandes, then it’s likely Group Lotus will have to pay him for breaking the contract, but they will still be entitled to use the Lotus name.

        • Icthyes said on 5th February 2011, 10:23

          That’s a tad selective. I do believe that Fernandes is not totally innocent. But Group Lotus’ case is untenable. The only name whose name Fernandes has sought to trade off is that of the original Team Lotus; the team has been at pains to style themselves as a continuation of them and explicitly not the entry of the totally separate Lotus Cars into motor racing’s top competition. Now Group Lotus is finally doing so, they find there’s already a Lotus in the sport with a legitimate right to the name that doesn’t come from them. So they’re trying to discredit them in order to fulfil their own ambitions. It just so happens to help that someone else has put all the money into stirring up interest into the re-entry of the Lotus name into F1.

        • LuvinF1 said on 5th February 2011, 16:54

          I believe you need to check the time line you have just described. I don’t think Bahar was in Group Lotus when Fernandes received the license to call the Team “Lotus Racing”. If I remember correctly, Bahar moved to Lotus Cars in 2009. Much too late to be the one who agreed to the Fernandes license – much less the one who made Team Lotus.

          And as an avid fan of Chapman’s Lotus, and having seen them race for the first time at the Glen in 1970 – I can tell you that I think the three of them (TF, DB, GL) should each receive a swift kick up the backside for the collateral damage they’re currently causing to the Lotus name.

        • Bahar was not yet CEO when Group Lotus made the arrangement with Fernandes. He joined in September 2010.

        • You need to get your facts right, ‘Actually they made Team Lotus’ – seriously, lay of the crack mate!
          Team Lotus was formed by Colin Chapman, it ran totally separately from Lotus Cars. When Team Lotus folded, Hunt bought the rights to use the name Team Lotus, quite legally, That has now been bought by Fernandes, quite legally- so he has the right to use it, Bahar tried to buy the rights from Hunt, but failed- case closed. Lotus Renault GP is Renault, who aren’t even Renault, they are Genii, who have been given 100mil from Group Lotus- IN SPONSORSHIP. Mmmm makes them the real Lotus team dosen’t it. No.

          • bertie said on 6th February 2011, 0:54

            There has been many things written about both TF and Renault. It is great shame it is has come to this bitter end. Why are we has it come to this? TF has done a fantastic job, their car may not be a front runner but I cant feel in simple terms he was there first. This has sadly come to play ground rules. If Renault were there at the same time then I can see the argument. But they knew what controversy it would cause. In a media sense perhaps the column inches was their goal, which they definitely have succeeded in. If lotus had a joke entry similar to HRT then perhaps there is merit to doing this. But fundamentally no matter how you slice it Renault knew what problems it would cause. They were already an established team and they didn’t the name. It is only a name and to a serious team it is irrelevant to start-up who is fighting for recognition it means so much more. Now perhaps everything will come done to who had a faster car. Lotus coming back to F1 should be an exciting thing and it is so now tainted. Noone wins from this

          • bertie said on 6th February 2011, 0:57

            I wrote the above drunk so insert appropriate word necessary.

          • bertie said on 6th February 2011, 0:58

            “As” being being one from the above

          • bertie said on 6th February 2011, 0:59

            Perhaps OMG is need now but jeeze this is just embarrassing.

    • Cyclops_PL (@cyclops_pl) said on 5th February 2011, 8:55

      I think the proper compensation would be equal to money from FOM eventually lost due to name change. That would be entirely fair. And won’t happen. I think Tony would turned it down too claiming that there are some “other” revenues he was deprived of because of that evil Group Lotus.

      • *YaaaaAAAaaawwWWWWWwwwwnnnnNNNnnnnnnn*…

        You still talking about this stuff? I’m like, sooOOoo over it.

        • RIISE (@riise) said on 5th February 2011, 9:19

          I think PM has basically gone over the same thing in about 5 posts. Jeez give it a rest, we know you love Group Lotus and their sick bag livery, no need to disguise it.

      • Prisoner Monkeys (@prisoner-monkeys) said on 5th February 2011, 9:35

        I think the proper compensation would be equal to money from FOM eventually lost due to name change.

        Fernandes will only lose the money if he’s forced to change his name. He can only be forced to change his name by the courts. The only way the courts can force him to change the name is if they rule in favour of Group Lotus. If they rule in favour of Group Lotus, it means Fernandes violated the licencing agreement. If he violated the licencing agreement, he is not entitled to compensation.

        On the other hand, if the courts rule in favour of Fernandes and he is forced to change his name, he stands to lose $36 million from FOM. However, Group Lotus can only be forced to pay this much if it’s specifically stated in the licencing agreement that in the event Group Lotus break the contract, they will pay Fernandes money equal to the amount Fernandes would lose from FOM if he would be forced to change his name. It is incredibly unlikely that Tony Fernandes would have signed such a contract, but there was a chance that Lotus Racing would not place inside the top ten in the 2011 World Constructors’ Championship. If they placed 11th or 12th, they would not receive any money from FOM and Group Lotus could break the contract without penalty.

        • 2 things PM.

          1) Firstly you said that Fernandes was calling it a conspriacy or something of the sort. NO. If I am selling muffins and you come along and want one for 1 dollar that isn’t you trying to ruin me, that is just because that is what you have in your pocket at that stage, if I wanted to sell them for 3 dollars then I can chose not to deal with you. THat is what fernandes is saying, he isn’t saying that they want to ruin him, he just is saying that it wasn’t tennable for him to take the deal.
          Also 6 million pounds is roughly depending on exchange rates and such 10 million US… at some stage (it’s fluctuating madly)

          2) There are so many parts to the case. And within each result there are several solutions.
          Did GL have the rights to cut the whole contract on the basis of the T-Shirts?
          Did GL cause problems financially (sponsor wise) and also brand wise for Fernandes entering 2011 given that Fernandes was already in F1 and had aquired the rights to use the TL name in F1 before they had decided to rebrand Renault? What was the timing of this?
          Do the rights Hunt sold Fernandes actually contain ther ights to use Team Lotus?
          If they do in f1, then do these rights given the historical nature have priority over an outside brand of Lotus in F1?
          Fernandes was Lotus in F1 as of 2009, GL was as of late 2010. Does Fernandes have the first call on it given he had the Lotus brand in F1 (just as if ferrari something else sponsored McLaren, Ferrari f1 team would have the rights over other ferrari brand from china)?
          There also might be one or two other questions raised in court cases between the two.

          In short, trying to predict the if X win, Y and if A in B is totaly rediculos

        • BasCB said on 5th February 2011, 13:23

          I do not understand your argument here PM. Certainly if Fernandez were to win the court case, that means Lotus Cars had no right to retract the licence to use “Lotus Racing”.
          Why on earth would he be forced to change his team name then?
          You even say as much in the first paragraph of your post above.
          Also, even if GL wins the case about terminating the “Lotus Racing” licence, they still have to convince the courts that what the Chapman family sold for 6 million over 15 years ago (the Team Lotus+badge) now gives Fernandez no rights to that name. Something Proton has so far not been succesfull at since buying GL.

          If Fernandez is shown to have every right to use both Team Lotus+LOGO and “Lotus Racing” then the only thing GL can do is persuade him to give up those rights if they offer him enough for it (certainly that would be more than the 36 million).
          Even then he has no obligation to take the deal.
          And he could even have a try at making them stop using Team Lotus history to decorate the Proton and Lotus Cars buildings or push for damages!

    • 1) Fernandes hadto point out that by following Group Lotus and giving up would bankrupt him, if not there would be no reason for him to reject it.

      2) He was in the brink of giving up the name, but his British staff from Hethel all told him not too. He did it for the team and the people.

      3) Money will always play a role in this. I don’t understand why Lopez is saying it like he made a major discovery. Tony has brains, he has invested £80m, why on earth would he just let it go, it makes no sense at all for anyone to do such a thing.

    • Oliver said on 5th February 2011, 15:15

      @Prison Monkeys
      Theoretically your argument makes sense, if it was based on the abstract.
      Realistically, when you look at the real numbers you will find out your argument is deficient.

      This isn’t about team budget or percentage of team budget.

      1: He had a 5year agreement that was unceremoniously taken away. In real life, only drug dealers and the Mafia, conduct business in that fashion.

      2: His business model was on being able to use the Lotus name for 5 years. So any investments he made now will be based on a minimum 5year plan as Lotus not Proton or 1 Malaysia.

      3:Sauber in 2010, raced as BMW Sauber Ferrari. Not because they loved the name, but because if they had changed, they will have lost their TV money due them, a few tens of millions is not an insubstantial amount.

      As a minimum, Proton should have been willing to compensate Fernandez with the TV money and any other costs associated with having to change the name of his team, including branding materials, uniforms, letter heads, team trucks, re-registrations and any legal costs.

      Spending $8million to secure perhaps $20 or $30 million and much more in subsequent years is more than worth it.

    • The sooner the High Court rules in favour of LRGP, the better.

      It’s that cut-and-dried is it?

      It just seems to me that this whole thing is about Group Lotus wanting everything now, rather than waiting for Team Lotus to develop a front running car.

      They’ve even had the nerve to enter a green and yellow ‘Lotus’ in the Indy car series ferchrisakes!

      • The sooner the High Court rules in favour of LRGP, the better.

        It’s that cut-and-dried is it?

        It just seems to me that this whole thing is about Group Lotus wanting everything now, rather than waiting for Team Lotus to develop a front running car.

        They’ve even had the nerve to enter a green and yellow ‘Lotus’ in the Indy car series ferchrisakes!

    • bertie said on 6th February 2011, 1:06

      Why everyone feels pro LRGP is real shame. Honour is a huge part of sport and is fundamental difference between sport and business. He was there first with that name and to try and take it is underhand. No matter what happened this is such an ugly side to something I love. It is just a name but if another team called themselves Renault for similar reasons than I am sure it would be different.

  2. bananarama said on 5th February 2011, 0:15

    Nice comparisons there. It looks as though the Ferrari is a much ‘smaller’ and cleaner package but I might be mistaken. Lets see how fast the two will go against eachother, can’t wait for the season to start!

  3. Just looking at nemo’s comparison. Ferrari seems to have slightly longer wheelbase so Mclaren may well have a nimbler car. Also from my very limited knowledge of aerodynamics, the u shaped “tunnels” should suck air down to the diffuser and assuming the go with the front exit exhausts that car may well have a monstrous amount of downforce compared to everyone else.

    Even though I recently got off the fence to support Lotus Renault GP, I’m going to stick my neck out there and say Hamilton will win the title.

    • US_Peter (@us_peter) said on 5th February 2011, 1:02

      That seems odd. I was under the impression that McLaren already had one of the longest wheelbases on the grid last year, and surely lengthening it would only ensure that. I thought the Ferrari was more average in length. I could have been mistaken though.

    • i don’t think the images are exactly the same scale. the whole ferrari picture is longer therefore the wheelbase looks longer in comparison. i’m pretty sure mclaren actually have the longer wheelbaase. could cause issues at monaco and singapore etc.

    • John H said on 5th February 2011, 14:04

      I’ve superimposed them here and scaled the cars according to wheel size. They seem to have an almost identical wheelbase.

      The most noticeable thing is the difference in nose height and design.

      • John H said on 5th February 2011, 14:04

        Hmmmm, the last sentence is the link!

      • The McLaren people seemed to go to great lengths to stress that the new car had a longer wheelbase in order to maximize rear end downforce.

      • Cheers for that mate.

        I had just tried to “eyeball” it. They are much closer than I thought.

        Mclaren does have a much more radical design though. Personally though, radical doesn’t always mean good looking but Mclaren or their fans won’t care if they win.

    • Oliver said on 5th February 2011, 14:07

      When you use photographs taken with different cameras and different angles and settings, you can no longer make a direct comparison but a relative comparison. Even if we assume the being used as a reference are identical, they may be filled to different pressures.

      An ideal reference will be the size of the Pirreli logo. Zoom the pictures to perhaps 4times their normal zize then try and measure the length of the logo then use that as a scale. Then correct for perspective.

  4. Argent (@argent) said on 5th February 2011, 1:37

    This can’t be right. According to Autosport, there will be 2,739,383 shares for sale at £0.05 per share in in the IPO which means an initial market cap of £136,969.15… that is nothing to a Formula 1 team, so I guess this really isn’t about the money. Someone please tell me that my math is wrong and the entirety of Williams F1 isn’t worth only £500,000. What the hell is going on here?

    • Dipak T said on 5th February 2011, 1:39

      It thats true Id be more than happy to chip in some dosh to keep Williams going.

      • Skett said on 5th February 2011, 2:13

        Plus at 5p a share I can see them going up in value, may be a profit in there!

        • Bernard said on 5th February 2011, 2:45

          It may be 5p initially (IPO), but as with all share trading, purchases force the price up – sales force it down.

          Should all of those shares sell, the value will become much, much higher.

          • Argent (@argent) said on 5th February 2011, 3:10

            I know that, I’m just surprised that the initial valuation is so low. I can’t imagine that this is a real representation of the value of the company considering their successful foray into the development of a flywheel hybrid system. If it wasn’t for the team’s recent sponsorship from Hugo Chavez, I might consider picking up a few thousand shares to offload after a few months for a quick buck.

            The Wall Street Journal summed up the whole thing fairly well in a rather abrasive manner. Essentially they said that it will only appeal to fans.

    • that could just be the face value of the stock, but bidding process will determine the price discovery.

    • topdowntoedown (@topdowntoedown) said on 5th February 2011, 9:22

      Without going back to my previous explanations, I suspect that the 2.7m shares that will be released to the market will only be a small percentage of the total shares in issue – maybe 5-10%. The rest will continue to be held by FW, Head, etc.

      Also don’t confuse nominal value (http://www.investopedia.com/terms/n/nominalvalue.asp) with traded price (which includes pricing-in for dividends, future earnings, premium/discount for risk, etc) – which is the actual ‘value’ of the company when multiplied by the total number of shares.

    • Adrian J (@adrian-j) said on 6th February 2011, 10:13

      I actually read £0.02 a share over on Pitpass…

      Anyway, does anyone know how I a person would go about buying some of those shares? I’m thinking that if I was able to get them at £0.05 then a £50 investment wouldn’t be too bad (1000 shares) and surely they must go up pretty soon so it could be a decent way to pay for a trip to a Grand Prix….

  5. Hamish said on 5th February 2011, 2:08

    136969 pound is 27.39% stake in the team. Racing fan or not, thats a bloody good investment.

  6. wasiF1 (@wasif1) said on 5th February 2011, 3:07

    Nice work @nemo.
    Yeah I think all the F1 car so far have a longer wheelbase because now they have to eat that large fuel tank together with that heavy KERS.

    • BasCB said on 5th February 2011, 14:17

      But in theory, the KERS and to some extent the DRS should mean a bit less fuel consumption during the race (set off by losing the F-duct drag reducing device?)

  7. Solo (@solo) said on 5th February 2011, 11:52

    Button just explained why Massa became even worse after Germany.

    • BasCB said on 5th February 2011, 13:42

      I had the same impression. Although Massa himself is adamant he was only having trouble getting the tyres to work for him.

    • Adam Tate said on 5th February 2011, 20:47

      Spot on Solo! My respect and admiration for Button has shot up after reading his views on this. I hope he and Massa do some serious butt kicking this season, and that includes putting one over on their more, ahem highly rated team mates.

  8. Oliver said on 5th February 2011, 14:27

    Green Lotus Vs Black Lotus.
    Lets take a closer look.

    Green Lotus came up with the idea of Reviving the Lotus racing brand, they sold the idea to Proton, owners of Lotus car company and got a licence for 5years to use the Lotus name.

    Fernandes, owner of green Lotus then spent his money, building up the infrastructure to build the brand and establish good will in the racing community as well as internationally. His plan was to first establish a baseline operations, due to the limited time available from when they got their racing licence, then to embark on a full scale onslaught the following your, when they would have had enough time to make a decent entry.

    Well haven succeeded in establishing goodwill in the racing community and amongst the general public. A new manager of Proton in the name of Bahar, decided that with the existing brand awareness created by green lotus, they can just go ahead and invest in a more competitive team and use the idea brought up by the green racing team to race in black.

    Of course they could also just terminate the licence of the green racing team, cutting them out of their investments and TV rights in the process, after all they didn’t matter.

    Well enter Mr. Lopez, a man who bought the brand of Renault with a loan from Renault, and in need of a partner to ensure his investment doesn’t go down the drain. So for him to talk about Fernandez being interested in money, is just plain ludicrous, like he will enjoy if if Renualt told him he can no longer use Renault in his team.

    It should interest you to know that, the “Renault” in Renault, is as a result of running the Renault engines, and not as a result of being the Renault racing team. :-) So Lopez in actual fact owns a racing team that is neither Renault nor Lotus.

    So green Lotus, is trying to be Lotus, and the case is still pending. At least they know who they want to be.

    Black Lotus, on the other hand, is trying to be Lotus and Renault at the same time, and is at yet neither, and is what I can only describe as having an identity crises.

  9. Oliver said on 5th February 2011, 15:22

    Looking at Team Lotus’ extra day testing, I think private testing is somewhat beneficial than the official tests, as a team can get reliable data and not have to worry about other cars interfering with their programme.

  10. George (@george) said on 5th February 2011, 16:22

    That was a really nice interview with Coulthard, he always seems a bit uptight on F1 coverage.

    I cant believe I watched that whole Peter Windsor video without getting bored, aero talk usually sends me to sleep.

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