Lewis Hamilton says driving on slower tyres is “Just not exciting, to be honest.”
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Lewis Hamilton says new tyres will slow F1 teams down (The Guardian)
“The cars are slower on a race distance. Last year we had to make tyres last with heavier fuel load and now it’s even slower. I did run the other day and it was painfully slow, it really was. Just not exciting, to be honest.”
“There are no homes in or alongside the circuit but F1 has helped turn the Marina Bay area into a successful retail and business location. Most of all it’s made Singapore a destination with more global exposure than Hong Kong and that may have residential benefits.”
Jenson Button: I’ll quit Formula One if I become a father… it’s not worth the risk (Daily Mail)
“I don’t want to have kids while I’m racing. It’s not worth the risk. One reason is that I do think my attitude to racing would change if I had children. Another is you don’t get enough time to spend with them.”
Sebastian Vettel interview (Daily Telegraph)
“After 10 weeks away from Formula One, when they started the engine here at Valencia and everything was vibrating, I found myself sitting in the RB7 and smiling. Then I did the laps and I was cruising along, thinking, ‘What could be better than this, with this car around me, the blue sky, and everything fine?'”
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Comment of the day
James reckons the switch to Pirelli tyres is good news for Jenson Button:
Considering the Pirelli tyres are going to shred themselves in no time this year, this will play right into Button’s hands. He’ll make a set of tyres last longer than his competitors and could feature quite frequently on the podium, that is if Mclaren arent miles of the pace (which they seem somewhat fearful of being at the moment).
I would say that Button would be the dark horse for the championship this year. Just a sneaky feeling on this one. If Kubica was racing, I would say him as well for the same reasons.
James
Happy birthday!
Happy birthday to bac!
On this day in F1
Mario Andretti scored his first F1 win in the South African Grand Prix 40 years ago today.
Image © Pirelli
James
6th March 2011, 10:18
I should probably sign up to this website, I think this is the third or forth time I’ve been COTD XD
ed24f1 (@ed24f1)
6th March 2011, 11:59
As for your comment, don’t forget that Button also destroyed his tyres in Melbourne last year before anyone else, so he isn’t necessarily that much better than anyone else, particularly if the car is hard on the tyres.
James
6th March 2011, 12:21
But was the first to go on to the softs, and made them last longer than anyone else. He’ll keep them in good condition for longer than other drivers
BasCB (@bascb)
6th March 2011, 12:55
I bet Jenson was not feeling to bad about it. He did relatively well, so that is a small advantage he might be able to make work for him.
Todfod
6th March 2011, 12:08
I couldn’t agree with you on Button being a dark horse. Just taking care of your tyres isn’t enough, I think 2009 was his one and only realistic title shot.
Steph (@)
6th March 2011, 15:50
Congrats James :) You should register on the forum.
I think that with the new tyres there’s the potential Button could do very well in an area where one might assume that Lewis wouldn’t be as strong at so I agree with you but I don’t like to make predictions about the title so early :P
James (@jamesf1)
6th March 2011, 23:21
And I’m now signed up. How do I edit the profile pic? =s
Aris (@aris)
6th March 2011, 10:18
Really not a nice comment by Lewis. Seems like he’s trying to excuse himself? Considering that other front-row teams haven’t witnessed big problems with the Pirellis I believe that’s a way of saying “Sorry pals. I’m slow, but that’s because of the tyres.”
Dissapointed.
Oliver
6th March 2011, 11:37
This newer tyres are slower than the ones used last year. Every driver has said so. His complaint is more about how the drivers have to over pamper the tyres, meaning they are hardly driving on the limit.
In a recent comment by Lewis, he said he hardly even broke a sweat.
just observe the races and you may find out that they either last longer, or that the number of laps are reduced so the event doesn’t exceed 2 hours.
Mouse_Nightshirt (@mouse_nightshirt)
6th March 2011, 13:04
But that’s the things – this is the new limit. The limit of the car is always the weakest part. If that happens to be tyres, then the drivers just need to put up with it and get on with the job.
I’m really looking forward to these new tyres, it should really throw a spanner into the works of predictability for the first few races.
Mike
6th March 2011, 13:51
Well said.
BasCB (@bascb)
6th March 2011, 11:50
After reading what he acually says in that interview I must say i disagree with that.
Lewis recounts how hard it is to make the tyres last (driving really carefull “outlaps” to make the sofst last about 16 laps) and it is making the car slower as he cannot push as much.
This pretty much reflects what other young and fast driver Seb Vettel said. Lewis also states, that he thinks this is bringing the top teams down to the level of the rest a bit, reflecting what Alonso sayd earlier.
Seems these guys are worried a bit about keeping the advantage. With fast degradating tyres they might well find themselves in the middle of the pack after an early pitstop. Not something they are looking forward to.
Solo (@solo)
6th March 2011, 12:37
It’s not only the fact that the fast teams won’t get away that easy but a driver like Lewis has every right to be upset about a car making him go slow to preserve it because he loses the advantage he has over other drivers by going on the limit faster than them and pulling fast laps.
Even if he can preserve the tyre as good as Button, he will lose the advantage of talent for speed he had over drivers like Button because he will be driving in the same pace as him trying to make the tyre last longer. Being a fast and fit driver isn’t an advantage anymore.
The role for inborn talent for going fast is reduced and the experience factor plays even bigger role. Also fitness and strong body(we know Hamilton is good at that allowing him to push when another driver might be feeling not as strong after many fast laps) are reduced.
This will play right into the hands of drivers like Barichello, Button and Schumacher(now he doesn’t have to worry about his age making the race harder). Trulli might get an advantage out of it too managing not to have his usual drop of performance as the race goes on since the cars will be slower and not as hard to keep on the pace for a full race.
Also we know Hamilton is the pure racer type that likes to put pedal to the metal. His there because he loves fast cars and crazy speed. That is why he sounds like a schoolboy talking about best car whenever he feels some speed and annoyed by the engineers and all their car orders in the radio that stop him from racing. This is the guy that usually wants to race when all the others want to make more laps behind the safety car. You can’t really expect him to be happy when things get slower.
Jeffrey Powell
6th March 2011, 15:44
Well said,I used to do Road Rallies many years ago,I remember one event were the whole field of quite high spec RS 2000’S and ‘Twin Cams’ was beaten by a very experienced Navigator /Driver Crew in a bog standard Citroen BX. Now this was very laudible in an event foe Amateurs (as much as we all thought we were budding Roger Clarks) but F1 should be designed to let the fastest drivers use there speed advantage. If the more aggressive drivers have to moderate there driving in every race I for one will give up my 45 year love afair with F1.
Bren
6th March 2011, 23:07
perserving tyres is all part of the sport. ok u dont want them dieing after 2 laps but if one driver can make them last better than another then he has done a better job.
simple as that. to finish first first you have to finish and that includes your tyres.
Pedro
6th March 2011, 23:58
Seriously? You’d stop watching F1 because for one season the focus would be shifted more towards preservation of the tyres? That’s insane. I could understand if, before last season, someone had said “If next year it’s possible to complete an entire race distance on the softer compound, I’ll stop watching.” Last year’s tyres might have been technically “better” but we all agreed that something had to be done and fast.
Hats off to Pirelli for sticking their necks out. They’re risking quite a bit of stick to make our sport more interesting.
I think the problems are being exaggerated anyway. And Lewis just loves to whine.
Robert
7th March 2011, 0:52
Pedro – engines should last a race distance as should gearboxes, exhausts, wings etc.. Why do we need tyres that quickly degrade? Seems like a very artificial way to introduce supposed “excitement” to the sport.
Aussie Fan
7th March 2011, 8:29
Did you read that all in a daily mail article? Lol
Griggs
6th March 2011, 10:23
There’s an hour of classic F1 from the 1973 and 1976 seasons on ESPN Classic (Sky 429) today at 1.30pm.
I’ve watched the 1980 season on there before and it was full of close to the action pitlane footage. It’s more on the teams and drivers rather than the racing, but still worth the watch.
3 weeks to go!
Stephen Jones (@aus_steve)
6th March 2011, 10:29
lewis making excuses already? hope mclaren can sort the car out in time
electrolite (@electrolite)
6th March 2011, 12:38
I think it’s understandable. At the pinnacle of motor sport you want to be able to grab what ever you’re driving by the balls and absolutely thrash it round a circuit. At least for a little bit. Having drivers having to take care and measure their driving is good, but by the sounds of it it’s something all the drivers are literally being held back by all the time.
SouthAussie94 (@mpj1994)
6th March 2011, 10:33
KEITH ISN’T DEAD!!!
I got a bit worried there when the round-up was up at 10.30 this morning. So, like the pathetic F1 fan that I am, Ive been refreshing the main page every 20 minutes waiting for it to appear. Ive only been doing it for the past 10 hours…
Must have been a big night for you last night Keith…
Keith Collantine (@keithcollantine)
6th March 2011, 10:48
Not sure why the article didn’t go live on time, am looking into it. Must be the first time in a while that’s happened.
Anyway, yes, I’m fine, thanks for your concern :-)
Oliver
6th March 2011, 11:40
Perhaps you must wait for Wifey to sleep off before you sneak off to your puter.
Rocky
6th March 2011, 12:45
Having load problems very slow compared to all other sites. All ways worth the wait though.
sato113
6th March 2011, 15:08
is it at automated process? or do you click something at midnight to put it up?
Hairs (@hairs)
6th March 2011, 18:11
I’d like to say it’s an automated process but Keith is as much of a
sad midnight oil burning F1 obsessed nerddedicated F1 fan as the rest of us are, as you can tell from his twitter feed.christopheraser
6th March 2011, 10:43
It’s not for Lewis to say what is exciting it’s up to us to decide.
He may be board running around in testing, but if the degrading tyres makes the racing closer and brings strategy into play. He will have plenty to think about during the races.
Maciek
6th March 2011, 11:25
Why exactly would that be? The guy’s just saying that racing on slow tyres is less exciting. Nothing wrong there I don’t think.
kowalsky
6th March 2011, 11:52
i agree. It’s what i have been saying all along. The cars look slow!!!
The other day keith wrote an article on this matter, to see what the fans, thought. But i think the mayority of the fans are still blind about a fact that’s happening in today’s f1.
We’ll have to give them time to realize. It’s like when a young guy is in love, and can only see the good things about his lover.
Mike
6th March 2011, 17:24
People asked for Pirelli to make tyres like this.
mateuss (@mateuss)
6th March 2011, 22:19
Yes, people asked for drop off in performance, but there seems to be a general lack of performance to begin with.
Mike
6th March 2011, 23:26
Yeah, but consider how much experience Bridgestone had to concoct their tyres.
This whole notion of having a super fast but quickly degrading tyre is I think absurd, the reason Hamilton is going slower is because he’s trying to make them last longer… That’s how it sounds to me. To be honest, if he wants to drive them on the edge, I think he needs to stop conserving them.
BasCB (@bascb)
6th March 2011, 13:00
I agree as well. What do you expect him to say? “No idea, do not want to comment”?
He is giving his opinion, and explains what he means pretty much in depth. I perfectly understand why he feels that way and he has a point.
The tyres will probably do a bit better with hotter weather and getting to learn how to best use them will help as well (that is where Alonso and also Vettel and Webber and Massa will have a big advantage over the McLaren guys who have less testing miles), but making them work will be important.
Hairs (@hairs)
6th March 2011, 18:15
Normally I think we’re all in favour of drivers losing the “spout the PR line” speak that we all hate, but on this occasion I’ll have to disagree with what Lewis has done here.
Pirelli were specifically asked to produce “degrading” (ie dodgy, imperfect) tyres by the teams, Bernie and the FIA. They’ve done exactly what they were asked to. Bridgestone produced immortal tyres last year after criticism from some teams about tyre degradation in 2009 – they didn’t like the bad publicity. No company would.
So for Lewis to start spouting off before the season even starts, before his new car is even in its “first race” spec, is just out of order in my view. It’s damaging to Pirelli and they don’t deserve it.
Johnny86
6th March 2011, 10:43
Man!!..this must feel like a slap on the face to martin. The other day he was asking all the drivers to stop publishing negativity and then,as if like a disobedient student, his own driver spits on his face. EMBARRRASSSINGGG.
Patrickl
6th March 2011, 11:47
Hamilton said this weeks ago (right after he actually tested). I guess the writer couldn’t come up with something new so he went through his old notes.
John H
6th March 2011, 14:00
He talks about the tyres, not the car.
John H
6th March 2011, 14:02
Ah, ok Whitmarsh was talking about the tyres. My bad.
sebsie
6th March 2011, 10:45
Jeez, what’s wrong with people here? A guy speaks out his mind on the tyres and all you do is trash his thoughts? Then you’ll complain when he restricts himself to politically correct responses. And in this case, all he’s said is nothing but the truth (and I’m sure the rest of the drivers would agree with him). Get off his back already!
quick_kill
6th March 2011, 10:58
I bet you, they haven’t even read the whole column yet.
Johnny86
6th March 2011, 11:08
The thing is, the other drivers were saying similar things about the tyres. So then , Martin Whitmarsh comes out and says that the drivers shouldnt run their mouth and spread negativity about the tyres. And then, his own team’s driver comes out and does exactly the opposite. How can some one expect the other drivers to shut their mouth when he can even stop his own driver from running their mouth.
Patrickl
6th March 2011, 13:01
Hamilton said this well before Whitmarsh made his comments.
kowalsky
6th March 2011, 12:01
well said. F1 is going in the wrong direction, and the young fans keep pushing it there.
Hamilton is one of the purest drivers, and he knows that the cars are not what a f1 should be.
I think a hard tyre that can allow to push for the hole race would show the best drivers. But that’s just me.
Mike
6th March 2011, 17:38
Like the soft Bridgestone tyres you mean?
kowalsky
6th March 2011, 20:14
that’s it.
Robert
7th March 2011, 0:58
I’ve always found races dominated by tyre wear to be SO dull. Is it not self-evident to anyone who loves out n out racing and wheel to wheel on track action that tyre strategy dominated racing does not make for exciting racing? Good for the pitlane geeks, but no-one else.
james_mc
6th March 2011, 10:55
Regarding Hamilton’s “negativity”, he doesn’t say that he or the McLaren is slow in relation to anyone else, he just says that the whole formula is slow and that everyone is looking a bit closer :-)
Interesting thoughts…
Journeyer
7th March 2011, 3:38
He wouldn’t be so negative if they were setting the pace, regardless if they were slower or not. ;)
Hamish
6th March 2011, 11:08
I don’t see what all this recent fuss is about with the comments regarding the tyres in recent days. Everyone is in the same boat here so its not as though one team is any more disadvantaged than the other.
In this day and age of ultra smooth circuits, tarmac run-off areas, ultra reliable engines and outbraking being a thing of the past its good to see the introduction of the new tyres. They serve the purpose of the sport, not the purpose of an organisation wanting a squeeky clean image as we had with Bridgestone.
By my recollection the furtherest back a winner of a dry GP started last year was 3rd (Alonso, Bahrain). Drivers simply don’t make mistakes, and if they do the tarmac runoff saves them, the cars are very reliable these days and with the sport having a sick fetish for aerodynamics anyone who completes 3 overtaking maneuvers in a race should be eligible for sainthood.
Bring on the Pirellis I say.
RFB
6th March 2011, 11:15
To be fair, based on what I’ve heard about the way the tires wear and degrade, I’m not sure Button will have much of an advantage. And considering how he struggled to get them at the right temperature last year, he might actually be in trouble again.
Sukoco
6th March 2011, 11:17
i agree with hamilton.. sure we need fast deg tires.. but i think we also need tire that can be pushed hard.. not outlaps race.. i think mr.A Senna would haved headache if 90s got this tyres..
Alex Bkk (@alex-bkk)
6th March 2011, 11:43
I posted this on another thread but I think it bears witness as to why Macca tested the Pirellis with the 2010 car.
I wonder if in the development of the 2011 car they got so side tracked trying to catch RB in down force they they didn’t concentrate on the tyres? And what if they got the down force wrong?
Oliver
6th March 2011, 11:44
When we dislike a person, we always look for faults in whatever they say, even if its, I LOVE YOU.
Patrickl
6th March 2011, 11:50
Hamilton is 100% right. These tyres will kill racing.
The tyres mean that all they can do is make their tyres last as long as possible. No overtaking, no fast laps. Nothing. 100% focus on jst driving carefully.
Perhaps we will see some “entertaining” races because the tyres will give laptims that are all over the place. It’s funny to see an F1 car blast past the other one when it’s 5 seconds a lap faster.
It’s not racing though.
Hamish
6th March 2011, 12:05
Its an interesting situation to be in as we all know the easy solution to “improve the show” is the reduction of aerodynamics.
However, this simply won’t happen. To do this would mean teams would have wasted millions upon millions of dollars on investing in wind tunnels and would have to rely on the driver to be the difference in performance. We all know that in this day and age that thought is just ludicris.
The importance on aerodynamics has simply gone too far. Its something that we, as a fan cannot even see! The fact that having Adrain Newey in your team is more important than having the best driver in your team sums that up rather nicely.
Patrickl
6th March 2011, 13:08
Indeed. And then they come up with gimmicky things like grooved tyres, mandatory pit stops, top 10 rules, tyres that only last 15 laps, “artificial rain” etc etc
It’s depressing.
What’s more, the gimmicks are working against each other. The strategy is practically fixed even before qualifying which goes directly against the thought of having different strategies.
In this case in think the idea was reasonable though. It would probably be better to have more strategy, but it should be up to the drivers/teams and not forced by regulation.
Pirelli just screwed up royally. They keep hammering on the fact that they were supposed to make tyres that lasted only 15 to 20 laps (even though they were the ones who suggested this idea in the first place). Either way, no one said that they should make tyres that degraded by 5 seconds over a stint starting from the first lap.
Having tyres that last for 15 to 20 laps is fine, but tyres that really last only 1 lap at performance is not.
fullthrottle
6th March 2011, 21:53
I cannot wait to see scuderia alonso and RBR managing his tyres and being FAST. Hamilton needs to adapt to the tyres like everyone else, and his fans stop whining about the pirellis ruining the races.
claudioff
6th March 2011, 13:06
Sorry, but I do not agree. I have been watching F1 since 1972. I doubt current Pirelli tires are worse than, for instance, the tires fitted in Fittipaldi/Stewart/Lauda/Hunt/Andretti/Scheckter/Jones´s cars (70´s champions). There was no racing at that time? I understand that Hamilton is upset and his reasons, but the rules are the same for everyone.
Patrickl
6th March 2011, 13:23
So I assume you have some figures to prove that in those days they were losing 3 to 5 seconds per stint and that they had to make 3 to 4 stops per race? Otherwise your whole argument is pretty much baseless.
Cause I saw races back then too and I’m pretty sure the tyres weren’t of such poor quality as these Pirelli’s are now.
BTW Please try to keep in mind the difference between tyre wear and degradation. That seems to be a common mistake with people who insist that more pitstops are better.
Also, the point that the rules are the same for everyone just proves my point.
Sukoco
6th March 2011, 14:53
I agree with patrick.. we must split between degradation n grip.. i just want good structure with rubber thats last 12LAPS smooth linear degradation n 25sec advantage so i can push hard on my car to next pits.. not 10laps but lost 5sec adrift on lap 2 ..hey i needs 25sec to pit
Mike
6th March 2011, 23:32
You just send the instructions on how to make that compound right over to the guys at Pirelli.
claudioff
6th March 2011, 18:42
I supose that you are not suggesting that fitting 70´s tires in a 2011´s car is going to make it faster. The whole point is “What is racing!”. In my humble opnion, racing is a motorized competition with same rules for every one. Every one starts at the same time and wins who get´s first at the finish line. Rules change and there are many factors that will ultimately decide who is going to be next F1 champion. How good the teams will manage their tire is one.
Is the 2011 F1 championship going to be about racing? Yes.
Will it fit Hamilton´s (My favorite driver) driving style? No, unfortunatly.
It is up to you to decide what is racing? Put here your answer.
Sukoco
6th March 2011, 22:16
I would say ideal tyre were back in 98+s when tires war happen. i agree to u for simpe racing def.. but this is F1 with must got best resource on earth racing.. not F3 GP2 racing go fast on same car..
Mike
6th March 2011, 23:33
@Sukoco — What like the ones specifically designed for Schumacher?
Sukoco
7th March 2011, 2:14
hahai thats cool.. yeah i amaze mr.schu determination.. but i like F1 more.. i think hill,mika, villenueve also haved advantage.. 2009 we have single supp that deg linear until next stop (caused their design accoumade feul stop) can that japan manufacture give their formula? hope Pirreli evoul..
kowalsky
6th March 2011, 22:37
claudioff. What era you consider was the best?
And what drivers captured your imagination during those 4 decades?
VXR
6th March 2011, 14:15
If lap times are “all over the place” why won’t there be “No overtaking”?
Patrickl
6th March 2011, 16:25
Like I said
Mike
6th March 2011, 23:35
On genre — F1 isn’t racing? I suppose it is more of a Drama…
Eric
7th March 2011, 23:43
The potential for a boring year of racing is definately there, however I’m willing to give them the benifit of the doubt until I actually watch a couple of races. Canada was a great round last year and that was largely down to tyre wear.
UneedAFinn2Win
6th March 2011, 15:13
Kill what exactly ?
Do you watch a different series ?
Hamilton is one of those aggressive drivers who turns the wheels full tilt, same as Kubica. You can see that in the incar footage. Now he faces a situation where he has to learn a skill that past WDC:s had in abundance: managing the rubber.
It used to be a real nailbiter back in the eighties, when qualifying tires lasted one lap, if you were lucky with traffic and not veering off line to the marbles. The winner of many races was decided on the last few laps; who had the skills to nurse the car home. The new rubber after pitstops created amazing leaps inlaptimes, so that even a late pitstop didn’t mean you had lost the race. Go on, praise the parade of boredom that was Bridgestone-clad, I say make the tires even more aggressive.
Hare
6th March 2011, 15:58
A balanced voice in the crazy world of judging everything before it’s happened. Let’s see how the first few races go before we condemn all the latest rules an innovations in an almost ritual manner of prejudice.
Patrickl
6th March 2011, 16:30
In fact he’s simply sayng exactly the same as a ridiculous amount of people who think that tyres lasting for 10-15 laps is the best thing since sliced bread.
How is that a balanced voice?
Not to mention taking a digg at Hamilton when in fact just about every F1 driver has said the same.
If anyone has a better skill of extracting the most performance from the tyre it’s Hamilton. At the very least better than Button since he was ahead of Button almost every race.
Aussie Fan
7th March 2011, 8:31
boo hoo, he only faces the same situation as Schumacher faced when he first tried to turn into a corner in the 2010 Mercedes, only to be met by a wall of understeer. Cry me a river…
kowalsky
6th March 2011, 16:44
and nobody is going to attack, just waiting for the pitstops. I think it’s not the right way to go. Action in the pitlane, and control when out on the track.
Bring back wider tyres that drivers can abuse. 900bhp engines (turbo or atmospheric)with a beautiful sound, and keep this level of down force. That’s f1 to me.
Maciek
6th March 2011, 17:47
I agree in the sense that if every race this year is a Montreal 2010, I will definitely not be happy. I know most people rated that race very highly, but I thought it was a lottery. One race in a season, fine. The whole season? Not for me anyways. At the same time, what I don’t agree with is that drivers will focus exclusively on being careful. Some will, but for most it’s not in their blood. And if the guys who are all out racers are forced to think of conservation at least a bit, it will only make them more complete drivers. But all in all I agree with others that it’s a bit pointless to condemn the season to failure before it’s even started. Personally, I can’t wait : )
Patrickl
6th March 2011, 18:13
Well I guess we’ll have to wait and see, but both Hamilton and Kobayashi claim that they have no choice. That Saving the tyres is pretty much the only option.
VXR
6th March 2011, 18:54
F1 isn’t an arcade game.
Patrickl
6th March 2011, 23:49
Once every 28 days it’s a full moon.
Aussie Fan
7th March 2011, 8:33
Yes, & the sun appears to be of a spherical shape too (while we are mentioning usless facts haha)
VXR
7th March 2011, 17:16
Boringly predictable, isn’t it? ;)
Would be so much more interesting if it didn’t do that. LOL
PeriSoft
7th March 2011, 20:23
The hell F1 isn’t an arcade game – ARWs anyone? It’s almost more arcadey than the arcade games were…
BasCB (@bascb)
6th March 2011, 11:55
Bernie will be glad about that financial times report, it really shows why all these destinations do get some development.
Belgians (not sure who, as there is no government really) should pick up on that to sustain their GP!
Oliver
6th March 2011, 12:03
RE: COTD
I really don’t see wat qualifies the above COTD apart from the fact that Jenson Button was mentioned.
BasCB (@bascb)
6th March 2011, 13:01
The simple fact Keith chose it to be there?
It shows what type of impact those tyres can have, something pretty much discussed in all F1 forums at the moment.
Icthyes (@icthyes)
6th March 2011, 12:08
Lewis’ comments have made me again wonder if Pirelli have boobed a little.
The whole theory about the tyres was that some drivers could max them out and others nurse them to avoid using an extra set and it would work out roughly equal, hopefully with a slight advantage to the former to reward exciting strategies. Maybe the performance difference between doing so will be enough to out-weigh the extra pit stop and I really hope it does so. I would urge Lewis to start thinking about whether he could do this in most races, because if there’s anyone who could make it work it would be him.
The problem is you’re not always on the same tyres; most front-runners will start on the softs and with greater degradation, eking them out will be much more important because (and this is where Pirelli might have boobed) they don’t look like they’ll last nearly long enough for the performance advantage to out-weigh an extra pit-stop.
This is what happens when you have such constricted rules about strategy: two mandatory compounds, Top 10 rule, etc. They all sound well and good in theory but if it’s a choice between slower, closer racing and faster, more open racing then I’d always choose the latter. That’s what F1’s for. We have entertaining feeder series for the former.
Patrickl
6th March 2011, 12:12
I really don’t get the COTD. They said exactly the same going into 2010 and it never showed.
Suppose Button goes a lap longer on these Pirelli’s. How is that going to hand him the championship?
What’s much more important is the balance of the car/tyres. The Pirelli’s are more prone to understeer. What’s even worse is the variation in balance between compounds and even inside a single stint. they can swap from understeer to oversteer in the course of a few laps.
Any driver can just driver more careful and save the tyres if he needs to, but Button has demonstrated over and over that he is completely unable to deal with balance problems.
Shiro
6th March 2011, 12:19
He is right. The race pace is TEN SECONDS slower than what we would’ve seen a few years ago. I imagine for a driver it’s not as exciting when you’re braking so early with much slower cornering speeds. We can only hope that the racing on track makes up for it because these lap times are pretty bad.
matt88 (@matt88)
6th March 2011, 15:16
“I imagine for a driver it’s not as exciting when you’re braking so early with much slower cornering speeds”
So I assume that Fangio, Ascari, Clark and all the drivers of that era were bored to death…
Sam
6th March 2011, 15:36
You do at that time, that was the ‘limit’ they could feasibly reach without killing themselves right??(which happened anyway)
I guarantee they were satisfied with their speed.
matt88 (@matt88)
6th March 2011, 16:16
i should have written “irony alert” on my post… :)
Shiro
6th March 2011, 16:16
Of course not. But would you really want to see lap times down to 50s/60s levels?
matt88 (@matt88)
6th March 2011, 16:57
i don’t think that times will increase so dramatically. and, as Keith already pointed out, for the new generation of F1 the pursuit of speed isn’t the major goal, otherwise we would have kept and improved the cars that were running in 2004.
Moreover, the pursuit of speed for its own sake is pointless, first of all for the manufacturers but also for the worldwide audience, who care much more about unpredictable races and championships.
PeriSoft
7th March 2011, 20:25
“Moreover, the pursuit of speed for its own sake is pointless, first of all for the manufacturers but also for the worldwide audience, who care much more about unpredictable races and championships.”
Why bother to ******* go racing at all, then?
slr
6th March 2011, 13:17
I wouldn’t be surprised if Button beat Hamilton in the championship this year. Hamilton will probably have to make more stops than anyone else as he’s not the best at preserving tyres. This situation with the tyres going off will definately favour Button, he might be stopping less than his rivals which could well translate into some great results.
Patrickl
6th March 2011, 13:25
When has Button actually demonstrated that he could run longer on his tyres than any other driver?
VXR
6th March 2011, 14:21
In 2010 the tyres were so hard and perfect that anyone could have done a whole race distance on those tyres. No one had to ‘save’ their tyres in 2010.
Shiro
6th March 2011, 16:35
I think you’ll find that to be rubbish.
Patrickl
6th March 2011, 16:43
So you agree that the whole “tyre management” hype is just that, a hype? Otherwise you would obviously be able to provide any evidence.
Other than for instance McLaren saying that Button’s and Hamiltons driving style both have a similar propensity for damaging the tyres. Button exposes the tyres high loads for longer and Hamilton brakes and accelerates more.
McLaren added that they don’t see Button treating his tyres any better.
Or maybe you could point to a race where Button in fact tried a long stint. Say … Malaysia? Button didn’t really perform that well there.
slr
6th March 2011, 22:21
Abu Dhabi springs to mind.
Patrickl
7th March 2011, 0:07
When he went from P3 to P3 by going longer on his first stint? Meh.
That’s more another example of when McLaren messed up Hamilton’s strategy. They try to attack Vettel and then get Hamilton stuck behind Kobayashi and Kubica.
Despite that costing Hamilton 8 seconds, Button still doesn’t manage to get ahead.
Oliver
6th March 2011, 13:31
We all complain that the teams force their drivers to turn down the engines and go slower after two thirds race distance.
Well wit these new tyres, they may just as well turn down the engines at the very start of the race as too muc power will just wear them out.
If you push too hard to close up to the deiver ahead, you will use up your tyres and have to pit earlier, sending you further back. We may still end up with a stalemate, where the cars just follow one another till the race ends.
Patrickl
6th March 2011, 13:55
Apart from that, with all the pitstops going on, this could very well result in drivers waiting for those stops to “overtake”.
VXR
6th March 2011, 14:23
Why would a driver do that if the tyres are so bad that the drivers can barely keep the cars on the track?
Patrickl
6th March 2011, 16:43
Because their car might be faster?
Patrickl
6th March 2011, 16:44
Besides, they might go for an earlier stop to “overtake” as well.
SPIDERmaN (@spiderman)
6th March 2011, 14:29
In other words the drivers are afraid to say the new tyres by pireli are rubbish…compared to previous tyres by bridgestone..and only Hamilton is saying so but in kind words…i wonder how long before we have a situation like one where drivers refused to race with bad tyres from a certain supplier during previous a grand prix in the states…?
VXR
6th March 2011, 14:46
You mean the tyres that ‘had’ to last a whole race distance. LOL
I remember that in 2005 the drivers drove in constant fear of locking up their tyres. The first corner after the start was more “After you Claude” than “Take no prisoners”.
I suppose we could go back to that again, but if you happen to lock up your tyres on the first lap your race is pretty much shot.
Another alternative is for Bridgestone to make tyres that were exactly the same as Bridgestones with regard wear and degradation, but that just smacks of being “artificial” in the extreme.
I’m also glad that the article posted by Keith proves my point about Hamilton ruining his McLarens tyres after less than 10 laps.
That’s a problem with the McLaren, and not the tyres. Red Bull, Ferrari and others all managed well enough on them.
Drivers will always complain. It’s what they’re supposed to do.
VXR
6th March 2011, 14:48
“Another alternative is for ‘Bridgestone'”: Should read ‘Pirelli’.
Oliver
6th March 2011, 15:32
The tyres are not bad, they are purpose designed to wear out quickly, as requested by the evevt organisers. One thing we shouldn’t forget is that Pirrelli are yet to complete a race with these recent F1 cars, so they still have a way to go before they get the balance right.
VXR
6th March 2011, 15:44
That’s right.
Mark Webber said his biggest problem was with the balance of the tyres (wearing unevenly front to back) rather than with the wear.
F1 cars have been getting slower and slower for more than half a decade now. Has anyone not noticed that?
Patrickl
6th March 2011, 16:46
Pirelli stated that they would produce tyres that coul last a third of a distance. Needing 2 stops.
It doesn’t really look like that’s what they come up with.
I also seriously doubt that any design feature at any point in the proces was that they should degrade 3 to 5 seconds per stint.
You can argue a lot about how these tyres will work in the race, but it’s 100% certain that Pirelli did not produce the tyres they were supposed to.
VXR
6th March 2011, 17:19
The tyres haven’t yet been run in ideal conditions yet and its patently obvious that ‘some’ teams will have no problem going a third of a race distance on one set when they do. Barcelona in February or March is not the same as Barcelona in May or June.
Pirelli were asked to make tyres that degrade, rather than ones that actually got faster over a stint (where’s the logic in that?) like the Bridgetone made. So far, they have done that.
I think Pirelli have achieved 100% what the teams, FOM and the FIA have wanted for a long time. You’ll notice that it’s only the drivers that are complaining.
David-A (@david-a)
6th March 2011, 18:41
Won’t it be hotter in May/June when they race in Barcelona? Doesn’t that mean tyre degredation will be even worse?
Patrickl
6th March 2011, 18:50
Pirelli claimed it was their idea to force more pitstops by making the tyres last shorter. There were not asked to do so.
Perhaps they were picked because that’s what they said they would do (since Michelin wanted to go for harder tyres), but that’s a different matter.
Some teams might be able to do a third of a distance on these tyres in optimal conditions. But then they will have one set that is much softer and they will have to run qualifying on one set too.
Keith Collantine (@keithcollantine)
6th March 2011, 18:59
According to Nick Wirth, they were:
See: “Don’t blame Pirelli for high tyre wear” – Wirth
Patrickl
7th March 2011, 0:12
Indeed the team bosses have gone into PR mode and now they are trying to protect Pirelli. Apparently they don’t mind twisting the truth to make their case.
When pirelli was trying to get the deal they were already stating that this was what they wanted to do. Michelin did not.
Besides, there is a huge gap between having tyres that last 20-25 laps and ones that cannot even reach that and go slower by a whopping 5 seconds over a stint.
So, regardless of whomever had the idea, this certainly wasn’t it.
rfs
6th March 2011, 15:41
A question about the pirellis: weren’t they used in the 2011 GP2 Asia series races? Were drivers forced to drive at a snails pace and make 3 or 4 stops?
AndrewTanner (@andrewtanner)
6th March 2011, 16:42
They were used, but i’m not sure if the compounds are relative to F1 in their wear and degradation. Certainly nowhere near that amount of pit stops though.
Patrickl
6th March 2011, 16:49
Pirelli claimed they would use the same tyres for F1 as in GP2.
So the answer is probably “Yes”.
On the other hand, Pirelli have made some improvements to the tyres since then, so maybe they are slighly less worse now.
AndrewTanner (@andrewtanner)
6th March 2011, 16:41
Another knee-jerk from Lewis. Calm down boy! Stick them all in a race on the same tyres (there or thereabouts) and it will be no less exciting than previous seasons.
Patrickl
6th March 2011, 16:51
He drove the car with those tyres!
He’s talking about excitement for the drivers not the viewers!
Talk about knee-jerk reactions …
VXR
6th March 2011, 17:34
TBH I’m not particularly bothered how ‘excited’ Hamilton feels as long as he tries the best he can with what he’s given. It’s not like he didn’t complain of having ‘no grip’ several times last season, when, in fact, his lap times had actually gotten quicker!
I do hope that any improvements made to the Pirelli’s don’t make them last any better than they did on the GP2 cars!
But if Memory serves me correctly the Pirelli tyres were not any problem at the Abu Dhabi F1 tyre test!
Patrickl
6th March 2011, 18:54
It doesn’t matter one iota if you care about Hamilton or not. This article is about what Hamilton said.
Anyway, It’s obvious that you have your heart set on something that’s even more of a lottery than the race in Canada. Looks like you get your wish good for you.
I just hope that people will get their heads back soon enough to fix the mess. Unlike the disaster with the grooved tyres.
Less aero and hard tyres is the only way to get back real racing. Not tyre lotteries and tyre management.
VXR
6th March 2011, 19:56
Sounds like a recipe for knowing exactly what the race result will be by the time they’ve all gotten around the first corner!
At what point, do you think, that half the world will switch to another channel?
Less aero = less speed. Even more fans and ‘some’ drivers complaining that F1 cars aren’t ‘exciting’ enough, and on hard tyres too!
Mike
7th March 2011, 2:46
I think less aero on these Pirelli tyres would be ideal.
To be honest, I think once the racing starts and people see how exciting the high wear tyres are. I think this issue will be forgotten.
VXR
6th March 2011, 19:14
Au contraire!
Pirelli were given the design brief by the FIA, FOTA, FOM to make tyres that degrade more rapidly.
Pirelli recently released a press statement that included: “The increased degradation is a feature specifically requested by the teams and the organisers to improve the show”.
I could have made that up, but the statement is freely available if you know where to look. ;)
They were given a design brief, and so far they have stuck to it.
Patrickl
7th March 2011, 0:30
Pirelli motorsport director Paul Hembrey, June 3rd 2010:
That’s well before the deal was signed. Now they suddenly come up with the suggestion that all this was forced on them by FIA.
At best you could claim that this desire of Pirelli to increase the number of pitstops is what made FIA pick them.
Michelin wante to use more durable tyres and have less of them to save costs.
This was supposed to be unacceptable for the teams, yet Pirelli brings 3 sets of tyres less per race weekend as well.
DaveW
6th March 2011, 20:06
Yes the tires are the same for everyone, so is the fuel, the barometric pressure, whatever, but the fear is that we will see the cars pussy-footing around becasue 1-2 laps on the tires’ actual limit ruins them. When we see somone put in a FLAP, instead of hearing Steve Matchett screaming, “purple in ALL THREE SECTORS,” we will be hearing him say, well, that stint is ruined. Is that what the people want? Test-driving fror 90 minutes? It’s exactly as if we decided to cut the fuel alotment by 1/3rd and then said, its the same for everyone, so stop complaining that its no fun to have to coast into every corner and short-shift.
VXR
6th March 2011, 20:44
I don’t mind the ‘purple in all sectors’ remark every now and then…But for every lap?!
You would hear this quite often because the Bridgstone tyres actually got better as they eventually wore down!!! Regularly we would see drivers doing their fastest lap at the end of a stint. What’s that all about?
The fuel isn’t the same for everyone. You can put however much fuel in the tank as you please. Usually just enough to require some ‘eco’ driving at some point during the race.
I bet you can’t wait for 2013? LOL ;)
Oliver
7th March 2011, 0:30
I’ve waited to get your opinion onthese tyres DaveW, and you have precisely summed it up. If not that we are guaranteed at least one pit stop, we could have ended up having the fastest lap on the formation lap.
verstappen
6th March 2011, 22:19
We have to wait and see how it all pans out. Hamiltons comment doesn’t sound promising though. Luckily we still have Q1 and 2. Of Q3 I’m not sure, because of the top ten rule…
Patrickl
7th March 2011, 0:33
What’s more worrying, just about all drivers have said pretty much the same.
Kobayashi was the first who made it clear that overtaking would be pretty much impossible since the tyres would then degrade too fast.
Apart from of course cars on different strategies just easing past each other.
wasiF1 (@wasif1)
7th March 2011, 1:38
Seems like the new tyres aren’t helping the team. As they said they are not durable & now they will be slow. I just hope they makes 2-3 pit stop per races which later should speed up the race.
VXR
7th March 2011, 11:17
Martin Whitmarsh had many times suggested to the FIA and FOTA that the tyres need to be more ‘edgy’.
I can only think that Michelin didn’t get the contract because they wanted to show that they could make one set of tyres last an entire season. YAWN!
VXR
7th March 2011, 12:41
@ David A.
No. Because recently the Pirelli tyres have been operating in temperatures that are under its normal operating ‘window’, which means that they cannot perform at their best. Just because it’s hotter doesn’t mean to say that the tyres wear out faster.
Unfortunately the Bahrain test had to be called off, which would have seen the tyres operating much the same as they did in Pirelli’s last Bahrain test.
The test in Barcelona this week will no doubt once again be filled with drivers moaning about tyres. The weather forecast isn’t that much different to what it was at the last Barcelona test.
VXR
7th March 2011, 13:35
With regard to ‘The sky is falling’ comments from ‘some’ drivers:
Mark Webber:
“This has happened in the past. Last year at Jerez we were completely s**tting ourselves with the Bridgestones doing long runs, thinking ‘oh my God, we’re going to be stopping every…’ you know, then we get to the first races and drive around all day [on one set],” he said after the last test. “We need to go racing.”
But at present he feels the Pirellis’ characteristics are adding to the challenge for drivers.
“It’s easier for us to look average,” said Webber. “You’re even talking to yourself in the cockpit ‘come on Mark, that was messy, that was scrappy’, it’s very easy to be losing time when the tyre goes away a little bit, so you’ve got to have that in mind.”
Andy C
7th March 2011, 15:25
Another reason to like mark webber.
The parallel I would draw is, if you remember after Bahrain last year, everyone was saying something has to be done to improve racing, then we end up with 5 people going for the title and people calling it a great year.
Marks got the right attitude. Get out there, drive as well as you can.
I’m looking forward to seeing it, as I think more mistakes will happen.
I wonder how much of it is that he’s actually pretty hard on his tyres in comparison to Alonso or Button or others. So maybe he feels he has more to lose.
Personally, I’m looking forward to it.
If you’re good enough, you’ll find a way to get to the front of the race. Period.
VXR
7th March 2011, 16:02
Even Vettel says it will be “interesting”.
“I think one stop is impossible and at this stage also two stops, so I think it will be a three or four-stop race. I think it will make it very interesting,” he said.
Alonso, on the other hand.
“From what we have seen so far, degradation is very significant, which means we will have races with lots of pitstops,”
“I’m not keen on that because I think this increased uncertainty does not favour the strongest teams.”
No doubt Alonso would rather just disappear off into the distance in his ‘very easy on its tyres’ Ferrari, without having to make any stops at all.