Peter Gethin dies aged 71

F1 Fanatic round-up

In the round-up: Peter Gethin, who won one of the closest F1 races ever at Monza in 1971, has died.

Links

Top F1 links from the past 24 hours:

Former British F1 driver Peter Gethin, dies aged 71 (BBC)

“Gethin was best known for his victory at the 1971 Grand Prix in Monza, where he took victory for BRM by just 0.01secs from Ronnie Peterson.”

Mercedes firm on FOTA despite bumpy road (Reuters)

Nick Fry: “It’s obviously quite a difficult time at the moment and clearly we, Mercedes AMG, are very supportive of cost control in Formula 1.”

FOTA members to meet on Tuesday (FOTA)

“One team principal, whose outfit remains a member of FOTA, said that the removal of Red Bull and Ferrari could actually provide some benefits to the organisation – in allowing it to get things done.”

Kimi Raikkonen impression done by Sebastian Vettel (YouTube)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mn3lACZy8p8

Mark Webber turns attention to 2012 Formula One season (The Independent)

“The next most important race is Melbourne and next year will be different to this year, because that’s just the way I’m sure things will go.”

Clos to have HRT role in 2012 (Crash)

HRT General director Saul Ruiz de Marcos: “I think Dani is thinking more in GP2 for next year, but in one way or another will always be linked to the team. During the races, he will be by the ‘box’ and our motorhome, we want to be a shelter for the Spanish.”

David Coulthard says Kimi Raikkonen will return to Formula 1 stronger than ever before (Renault)

“He?s had some changes in his private life and he?s in a better place to have a perspective on what a great opportunity this is. Remember he came in straight from Formula Renault to Sauber, and when you go straight from being a kid in a lower formula to being immersed in Formula 1 and you?re earning all this money and have all these various distractions, I think you can?t really see the wood for the trees.”

F1 Fanatic via Twitter

“More details on Sky’s F1 team expected on Wednesday. Rumours David Croft and Anthony Davidson will join the already-confirmed Martin Brundle.”

Follow F1 news as it breaks using the F1 Fanatic live Twitter app.

Comment of the day

Ajokay envisages a different kind of scoring system for F1:

I always wondered what results would be like if F1 was scored more like golf – i.e. Lowest score wins.

You get your end of year score by adding up all your results, and whoever has the lowest number wins. Failing to start (DNS/DNQ) or failing to finish (DNF) gets you 25 points.

This year, Vettel would have 28 points, plus 25 from his DNF in Abu Dhabi, making 53. Webber would be second with 85, including 25 for his one DNF.

Anyway, that’s besides the point, if this system were used for teams who didn?t score any points, adding up all results from this year, Lotus would have 703, Virgin 737, and HRT 797.

HRT are a long way behind, often finishing further back than Virgin, and gaining a higher (therefore worse) score because of it. Yet because of one single 13th place in one race that was never again replicated, Virgin end up last.
Ajokay

From the forum

Happy birthday!

No F1 Fanatic birthdays today. If you want a birthday shout-out tell us when yours is by emailling me, using Twitter or adding to the list here.

On this day in F1

Happy 63rd birthday to 1982 world champion Keke Rosberg!

Advert | Go Ad-free

41 comments on Peter Gethin dies aged 71

  1. RumFRESH (@rumfresh) said on 6th December 2011, 0:10

    David Croft and Martin Brundle will be a brilliant commentary team if that’s how it pans out.

    • sato113 (@sato113) said on 6th December 2011, 2:03

      who would be main commentator? crofty i guess.

      • damonsmedley (@damonsmedley) said on 6th December 2011, 2:11

        I’d rather see Ben Edwards. He’s probably one of my favourite commentators ever.

        • TheBrav3 said on 6th December 2011, 3:08

          I’m glad ant might be with them at the races his own racing allows breaking up him and crofty would suck.

          • damonsmedley (@damonsmedley) said on 6th December 2011, 6:30

            Really? I don’t particularly enjoy Ant’s commentary. He’s very boring in my opinion. Crofty is OK, however.

          • TheBrav3 said on 6th December 2011, 23:46

            He has good racing insight and I also like his opinion on rules new track designs and alterations (largely being that they lack real challenges.)

            He also comes out with some good info on for instance but not exclusively clauses drivers may have in their contracts. Most other members of the media either wouldn’t say or simply don’t know about that kind of thing.

            I also like that he’s not afraid to lay the blame at someones feet if he feels they made a mistake.

  2. AlonsoWDC (@alonsowdc) said on 6th December 2011, 0:11

    I did say the same thing as the COTD.

    I think.

  3. Helio (@helio) said on 6th December 2011, 0:12

    Sebastian Vettel is so funny! Hysterical! You cannot dislike this guy!

  4. Icthyes (@icthyes) said on 6th December 2011, 0:17

    That’s a pretty neat idea for the points system. Would probably need to be able to drop points though, you could get taken out when it wasn’t your own fault (or far more sinister circumstances). I know Button finished outside of the Top 5 three times and Webber never did, but as the original discussion says 25 seems a bit harsh – he’d finish even behind Alonso!

    Great outside-of-the-box thinking AJ!

    • Puffy (@puffy) said on 6th December 2011, 7:49

      Yeah, I’m not sure that system would reward a win enough. Lets say in a 19 race season, Driver A wins 18 and has a DNF in 1. Driver B comes 2nd in 18 and wins 1

      Current System (Highest wins)
      Driver A: 450 Points
      Driver B: 349 Points

      Proposed System (Lowest wins)
      Driver A: 43 Score
      Driver B: 37 Score

      In the proposed system driver B would win, which I don’t feel is an adequate reflection of the performance of the drivers.

      • Icthyes (@icthyes) said on 6th December 2011, 9:22

        I’m not really fussed about rewarding the win tbh. If a driver is holding back for the win because of points, then shame on him and if he retired in the next race anyway, could cost him the title. That’s how I see it.

        • ajokay (@ajokay) said on 6th December 2011, 9:47

          @puffy

          Yeah, it is kinda silly, which is why I clarify at the end of the comment that it would probably work best as a scoring system for teams that don’t score any points, as they

          a) have the most to gain from gaining a lower position
          b) all their scores (this year at least) have been between 13 and 23, and
          c) their results are never too far from the 25 points a DNF would give them, so a DNF isn’t as damning for them as it would be for a race winner and/or championship contender.

          I do stress, the current (and previous) points system work fine, this would just be a better way to decide the order of ‘pointless’ teams in a fairer way than i believe HRT have got their 11th place this (and last) year.

          @icthyes

          The other points system I always have in mind is one where each position is worth double the points of the previous one. So for instance 6th gets 1 point, 5th gets 2, 4th gets 4, 3rd gets 8, 2nd gets 16 and 1st gets 32.

          Each gained position is double the importance of the previous one. But then, is that going too far the other way? Plus you can only have so many positions that pay out points before the numbers start getting silly (7 points positions, and the winner would get 64, 8 and the winner would have 128)

          Maybe half as many (ish) points as the previous place would be an option.

          1 – 2 – 3 – 4 – 6 – 9 – 13 – 19 – 28

          But then you can only really keep the points scoring positions to

          • Puffy (@puffy) said on 6th December 2011, 9:53

            @ajokay indeed, I can definitely see your point when it comes to the lower teams, it seems ludicrous that HRT finished ahead of Virgin based on that single 13th place.

    • Fixy (@fixy) said on 6th December 2011, 15:52

      A similar scoring system was used before 1950 in the European Championship.

  5. damonsmedley (@damonsmedley) said on 6th December 2011, 1:31

    That Vettel video is hilarious! I wonder if he’d had a bit to drink because he was very entertaining. Or perhaps all F1 drivers are like that when they’re not trying to look good for sponsors.

    Jenson Button was also quite funny, as you can see here. And here’s another hilarious video of Martin Brundle! I love seeing them all in party mode and not worrying about what they say as much. It’s the only time we get to see some personality from the drivers, really.

  6. damonsmedley (@damonsmedley) said on 6th December 2011, 1:39

    The BBC article didn’t mention why Gethin had died, but F1.com had a little more information:

    British driver Peter Gethin, winner of the 1971 Italian Grand Prix, has died at the age of 71 after succumbing to a long illness.

    I’m not sure what the illness was as it’s not stated. But he will not be forgotten.

  7. wasiF1 (@wasif1) said on 6th December 2011, 2:15

    If there are anyone who can do it,it has to be Seb

  8. sumedh said on 6th December 2011, 2:16

    A very weird scoring system that.

    You are effectively saying that two 12th places (24 points) is better than one win and one DNF (26 points). And if you were to penalize the DNF lesser than 25 points – say 15 points – then the guys running 15th or lower would rather park their car than finish the race.

    The system is equivalent of giving the winner 25 pts, second place – 24 pts, third place – 23 pts… 23rd place – 2 points, 24th place – 1 point. DNF – 0 points. Thus, reducing the advantage of the winner massively. Consistency would be king.

  9. Of which Vet-tel online video media is usually very funny! When i ask yourself in the event he’d received a tad to help take in mainly because he / she seemed to be incredibly amusing. As well as many F1 people usually are that adheres to that as soon as they’re definitely not seeking to glimpse perfect for sponsors.

  10. Alex (@smallvizier) said on 6th December 2011, 6:51

    The current points system – which awards points roughly geometrically, while still being understandable – is a good one. And it’s been great for the midfield racing that it actually awards points down to 10th position.

    All I’d do is extend it a little. As a tiebreaker for teams which never finished in a scoring position, add on 0.8 points for 11th, 0.6 points for 12th, 0.4 points for 13th, 0.2 points for 14th, and 0.1 points for 15th.

    Note that this mirrors the points from 6th to 10th (though obviously the figures are a lot lower). I’m not sure whether they should actually be part of the main points system, or simply used for teams like Virgin and HRT which never scored points conventionally.

    There are other points systems which are mathematically superior, but the advantage of this one is that it should still be reasonably understandable to non-mathematicians.

  11. Tifoso1989 (@tifoso1989) said on 6th December 2011, 8:28

    according to Autosport that despite ferrari’s third place in the standings the italian team is set to be awarded more prize money than Drivers’ and Constructors’ champions Red Bull
    i think this is the main reason why Red Bull left FOTA

    • BasCB (@bascb) said on 6th December 2011, 8:50

      Yes, due to Ferrari getting money for being historically a successfull and important feature in F1 (and McLaren and Williams too, just to a lesser extent) they get a lot of money even if they do not win much.

      Sure enough if Bernie now signs up Ferrari and Red Bull before picking off the other teams early next year, Red Bull is bound to get a bigger pot as well. But if they would have stuck all together, they could have gotten even far more, so I do not think its the reason for bailing out.

      In the end, how much does the money mean for Red Bull, its just part of the marketing budget.

      What really counts for Mateschitz is the ability to win and be successfull regularly, so the RRA restrictions might be more important to them, when they feel that restrictions are going towards hampering aero development and favouring towards the engine/mechanic side where others can beat them more easily (esp. with the grunt of a big manufacturer behind them like Ferrari and Mercedes).

      Indeed it might be that these teams have been at opposite extremes of the RRA discussion, with Red Bull wanting to keep aero development but cutting engine etc. and Ferrari wanting to cut aero to put more effort into mechanical/engine development.

      I would love them to find a good balance, so Red Bull can have a weaker mechanical side and engine but superb Aero and Ferrari can hone their engine a bit but have less efficient bodywork.
      But I suppose it would be a constant battle to find any good balance, just look at paring Turbo/NA engines in touring car racing.

    • Keith Collantine (@keithcollantine) said on 6th December 2011, 8:52

      A very interesting piece of information, thank you for that, but I don’t see the connection you’re making: FOM award the prize money, so how does Red Bull leaving FOTA make a difference?

    • snowman (@snowman) said on 6th December 2011, 9:06

      That’s been happening for years and all the teams agree with it because without Ferrari the brand value of the Formula 1 world championship is greatly devalued.

      Ferrari left because Fota wasn’t going to or couldn’t do anything with the allegations of Red Bull cheating the system.

      It’s a bit unclearer why Red Bull left but they have everything to gain and nothing to lose by doing so. If it comes to a spending war they can outspend everyone and nearest rival McLaren would be left behind because it doesn’t have the Mercedes big money behind it anymore.

      Also Red Bull would have a chance of cutting a better deal over the concorde negotiations coming up.

    • TimG (@timg) said on 6th December 2011, 9:58

      Ferrari has also left FOTA – if it was about Ferrari getting too much prize money why would that cause Ferrari to walk?

      In fact, Red Bull left FOTA because of ongoing disagreement over the Resource Restriction Agreement (RRA), not the amount of prize money. Prize money is determined by the Concord Agreement, which the teams have seem and signed up to so it’s not a secret to Red Bull that Ferrari get more money.

      Mere mortals like us haven’t seen the Concord Agreement, which is why it’s a source of endless curiosity and speculation.

  12. ajokay (@ajokay) said on 6th December 2011, 9:56

    Here’s one for @keithcollantine ‘s F1/motorsport-related christmas list.

    If you have a spare £700/$1099 lying around, how about one of these?

    The Traxxas XO-1.

    A 27 inch long 1:7 scale supercar that does 62mph (real mph, not scale mph) a fraction of a second quicker than a full-sized Bugatti Veyron can. It’ll go faster than 100mph too.

    It also comes with an iPod docking station and app that gives you a virtual tuning garage and dashboard, allowing you to refine the setup when stationary, and keep track of the car at speed.

    Slightly mental, that.

  13. Seb’s so hilarious and seems like a great bloke which in a way is a shame because it was so easy to have Schumi as the villain as he was so closed off and a bit robotic during his dominating years. I don’t know how or why anyone could dislike Seb except for his amazing success which is understand but a bit petty (and I’ve been there at moments this year when Ferrari has been so miserable). That clip actually makes me think of Graham Hill personality wise. I hate driver comparisons because I think drivers should be admired and loved in their own regard but it’s been a long time since the sport has had such a chirpy and good humoured driver (the only others I can think of are perhaps Rubens, Massa, Alonso can be quite entertaining and possibly JB but they’re often labelled as moaners). I admire Seb’s driving but I adore his personality far more.

    • damonsmedley (@damonsmedley) said on 6th December 2011, 15:47

      I hate driver comparisons because I think drivers should be admired and loved in their own regard

      Ironic considering Seb says in that interview that he loves comparing drivers from different eras! I agree with you though, Steph. It’s not fair to compare drivers, especially from different eras as it’s a completely different sport nowadays.

    • Fixy (@fixy) said on 6th December 2011, 16:14

      You’re right @Steph, I can’t see how someone can dislike him. They may be ‘angry’ with him for dominating the sport, but his driving is perfect and his humour great. A very nice character.

    • bosyber (@bosyber) said on 6th December 2011, 20:18

      You are right @Steph, he’s a funny guy, and he seems to have gained some more confidence in showing it too this year, good to see. I also watched Button yesterday, and recall Alonso being funny with the magic act for the BBC.

      That’s something that the BBC have been good at showing I think, though they haven’t been able to get all the drivers like that (well, Ham was quite surprising, but not in a funny way really this year), but at least some of the bigger names, with their feature interviews at races.

      I’ll miss it next year (not in UK, so no Sky), but I hope Sky will continue doing it, very good to get to see more of the drivers when they aren’t in their car too.

  14. mole (@mole) said on 6th December 2011, 16:02

    I would hate that scoring system as it rewards the team’s engineering more than a drivers skill. Why should you do worse than your competitor in the DRIVERS championship because although you can blow him away when your car is working, it blew up twice?

  15. BasCB (@bascb) said on 6th December 2011, 18:29

    James Allen posted some nice bits from the press visit to the Mercedes engine plant in Brixworth.

Add your comment

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *

All comments must abide by the comment policy. Comments may be moderated.
Want to post off-topic? Head to the forum.
See the FAQ for more information.