Bruno Senna, Williams, Barcelona, 2012

Schumacher given grid penalty for Senna collision

2012 Spanish Grand PrixPosted on | Author Keith Collantine

Bruno Senna, Williams, Barcelona, 2012Michael Schumacher will be docked five places on the grid for the Monaco Grand Prix following his collision with Bruno Senna during today’s race.

Schumacher ran into the back of the Williams at turn one on lap 13 while trying to overtake Senna.

Schumacher blamed Senna for the crash, calling him an “idiot” on his team radio afterwards. He added later: “I want the stewards to clarify what happened. He moved to the right, but he shouldn’t move back in the braking place to the left that sharply.

“I’m just behind him and I don’t know how sharply he is going to move. So it was all very dangerous.”

Schumacher recalled another collision between their pair in Brazil last year, saying: “I don’t know what he was trying to prove but in Brazil last year he was driving into my car and today he was doing funny things.

“A lap before he had an accident together with Grosjean so I don’t know what he was going through his mind.”

Senna blamed Schumacher for the crash which ended both their races: “For sure he had much better tyres than I did at that point, I had quite old tyres. But he decided to try to drive on the inside but he didn’t move there early enough and I had to brake earlier than him so he just hit me.”

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237 comments on “Schumacher given grid penalty for Senna collision”

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  1. It’s clearly Schumacher’s fault. There was plenty of room for him to take the outside line, which Senna had left him, but instead he tried to pull to the inside, despite the closing speed and different braking distances.

    In fact, I’m wondering why his penalty is so lenient in comparison to Hamilton’s. I’m far from a Hamilton fan, in fact, I really disliked him, but his penalty shouldn’t have been as harsh, and Schumacher should be demoted ten places.

    I’ve defended Schumi’s comeback time and time again, but this combined with the whining about the Pirelli tyres has done it for me. Leave now, Michael, you’ve ruined yet more of your reputation.

  2. It took like nearly 5 minutes for some people to explain their point of view. okay but under racing conditions? you can’t afford to take 5 minutes to watch a youtube video when you’re racing. It’s a misjudgement pass under braking + slipstream. Penalty or not, we’re all looking forward to Monaco.

  3. Senna only turned a slight bit to the left, just to take be able to attack the apex better, as he would have assumed schumacher is way to far back for a pass attempt, which he was. all drivers do that. Schumacher used to be the dirtiest driver and changed lanes in overtaking zones all the time, he won championships that way, so he should not be complaining.
    People who watched the video and thought senna was at fault for moving, look at when he moves back, schumacher had no chance at that pointand the incoming speed of schumacher even after that, its obvious schumacher just braked way too late.

  4. That was a driving incident. Nothing special really.

  5. It was just a racing incident in my opinion. You have to take several things in context. For one thing, when you’re traveling down a straight at 200 mph you have almost no time to react. If I remember correctly schumacher instantly tried to change direction going to the right as soon as he saw senna start moving. I guess he assumed that he would keep moving over, so it was schumacher’s mistake but just a misjudgement, an incident. Penalty seems a little harsh but that’s just my opinion. As far as the idiot comment, I’m know for a fact FAR worse things are said over team radio than that, they’re usually just not broadcasted

  6. In my humble opinion Senna was at fault here, he made his block to the inside, when Shuey goes back outside Senna cuts him off and then slams on the brakes. Very dangerous, who else do you see making idiotic movements like that? Of course Shumacher is one of the most notorious blockers of all time, but this wasnt blocking. This was weaving and should have been penalized as such.

    1. It wasn’t weaving. ‘Weaving’ is when a driver moves away from the racing line, back towards it, then away from the racing line again, which Senna clearly didn’t do.

      Had he done so, I expect the stewards would have punished him rather than Schumacher.

      1. I guess it’s no good to attack the show that the tyres make and after this punishment Sch may well take this into consideration.

        It’s just so much far-fetched judgement by the stewards that I think it will raise suspicions why are so harsh and is there any actual reason.

        I’ve seen so many driving accidents in the motorsports’ history that I could hardly believe they’ve punished him for this one. It is so clear that both have their fault. No need of penalties.

        1. It is so clear that both have their fault.

          No they don’t – Senna’s driving was entirely legal, and he was taken out of the race by a driver who hit him from behind. Hence Schumacher’s penalty.

          1. I’m talking with the commanding stewards on the driving incidents in the Spanish GP or with Keith Collantine, the blogger from Great Britain.. ;)

          2. @hadzhiev… actually you are talking to commanding steward on driving incident in the Spanish GP. Keith considers himself as one of the stewards. ;)

  7. To me this exposes the one move rule, because Senna’s second move was to go back onto the racing line, which in my opinion is totally ok, but at what point is he moving twice to block and at what point is he simply moving onto the racing line for the corner?

    I remember this coming up last year when the one move rule was being penned in and not just a gentleman’s agreement. Schumacher should definitely be penalised, but I think this is more complicated than many are making out and raises some questions for future second moves back onto the racing line just before a corner.

    1. That’s rather well-said, John H. Nice to see someone has considered at least part of the underlying problem.

      It should be clear to anyone who thinks about it, that measuring on-track moves so as to define when and where an arbitrary and imaginary line has been crossed (as evidence of one or more ‘moves’) will often not be a black or white case – even with the benefit of video! This is because at some point, anyone in the position of ‘judge’ needs to make a judgement about whether or not a breach of the rules has been committed.

      These types of decisions are always open to criticism because even the stewards themselves must ultimately make an interpretation of exactly what the rule means in the practical sense – never mind the general enthusiast, the vast majority of whom will never even get on track.

  8. Schumacher looked foolish twice over – misjudging when Senna would have to break and then falling back on the old Schumacher line of ‘whatever really happened, the important thing is that I didn’t do anything wrong’. I was really excited about him coming back, but right now he’s looking like he doesn’t even belong on the grid. it was an unnecessary, dangerous accident caused by lack of judgment and it’s not his first one in recent memory. A 5 place demotion is fair, though it could well have been more.

  9. Hahaha… Schummy was impatient.. .. he would be able to easily overtake Senna in the next few corners… it was a stupid mistake… … Sometimes it’s funny to hear drivers complaining … remember Hungary 2010?… or .. how about Rosberg in the last race? … funny is that, on both ocasions, drivers did not hit the car in front … … He should learn how to overtake out of DRS zone with KOBAYASHI !

  10. Compared to Hamilton’s 23 place grid penalty in Spain, Schumacher has got off lightly.

  11. Agreed. The need to mete out punishments for almost every incident/collision will eventually ruin the sport. And the amount of what i will controversially call “new” fans to the sport, who clamour for these penalties is not helping either. I suspect it must come from a lack of understanding about what racing involves.
    Anyone who has done the tiniest amout of Karting when speeds are only up to 60mph wil understand the idiocy of screaming hysterically for punishments when incidents happen.
    Imagine the calls for these kind of punishments when real wheel to wheel racing ws actually done in the days of Senna, Prost, Mansell and a certain Schumacher.
    When drivers race, rather than follow themselves, incidents WILL happen. It is NOT possible for a human being to judge distances and movements at speed of up to 200mph correctly ALL of the time. These guys are NOT metronomic robots. I think people forget that sometimes!
    This was simply a racing incident, and to expect stewards to use their grey matter on this issue and many others is obviously asking for too much. To punsih Micheal is simply madness!

  12. MS has a history of running into others starting with his unconscionable smashing into D. Hill in Australia – he is a spoiled brat who cannot understand why anyone would get in his way – my fellings about his bad behavior have been documented for many years, even when he was just in the Ferrari pits waving to the camera every chance he got – he WAS a great , talented, driver . qualifier and finisher – he is over and done with – his bad behavior is now getting old as he tries to recapture his old glory days – there can be no excuse for keeping him in a car when there is such great new talent in the offing – mssrs Perez, Maldonado, Rosberg, DiResta, etc should be given chances to exercise their talents without the interference of a hasbeen

  13. Kimi is flying again, Schumi is still crying.

    1. Revevemevemere
      14th May 2012, 19:11

      Is that the same Kimi who was beaten fair and square over a season by a certain F. Massa, and was eventually booted out of Ferrari to make way for a better driver? Oh and might he be the same chap who first ran Hamilton off the road and then tried to give him a puncture at Spa 2008, but ended up making a clown of himself instead?

      Let’s compare him to Schumi when he has won 7 WDCs.

  14. So do you think Shumi Lit the Williams fire himself? Or commanded one of his old lackies to do it? Would make a great comic sketch!

  15. had their be not a certain ” SENNA ” in Bruno’s name , he wouldnt be seen driving an F1 car. He is just living on Aryton Senna’s name. Such a pity.

  16. Helmutnewton
    15th May 2012, 4:01

    I’m puzzled by Senna’s sheepish attitude after the race. He was almost apologetic and certainly didn’t sound like someone furious for having been unjustly put out of the race. If anything, I’m sure he was relieved not to have to finish the race out of the points while his team mate finishes on the top.

  17. The Article read:
    Senna blamed Schumacher for the crash which ended both their races: “For sure he had much better tyres than I did …………..he didn’t move there early enough and I had to brake earlier than him so he just hit me.”
    i guess that’s a very good answer.

    1. I guess he could brake earlier without making these little weaves. He obviously knew that he would brake much earlier. That’s why I take for granted that both drivers have their different fault.

      It was just a racing incident. Nothing so special in it at all.

  18. After watching the incident for a few times, it looks like Seana make a late defense weave but didn’t realize that MS was coming in so fast. From my personal point of view, Seana should be blame for causing the accident but from a technical point of view, yes it’s just another racing incident.
    But why MS is the one to be penalized? I think the steward handle the case unprofessionally.

    1. Senna was clearly doing nothing wrong and it was MS that was not in control of his car. If MS was carrying so much speed he should not have tried using it to occupy the same spot as Senna. MS deserved the penalty he got, and as was pointed out above, MS is lucky he only got 5 spots on the next grid when you consider the much more severe penalty LH got in Spain and LH didn’t take someone else out of a race.

      1. It was a racing incident to me, Michael has to take some blame but i said it in the last post seeing from other posters video and pictures my opinion Senna wasn’t that innocent either. And Vettel think it was racing accident: For Hamilton penalty my opinion because Mclaren already known it will happen but still cover it up and let Hamilton out for another lap: Buemi also got it from last year German GP:

        1. I still don’t see how Senna did anything wrong. It’s not like he intentionally slammed on his brakes to make MS hit him. And SV calling it a racing accident doesn’t excuse MS. It is still an accident, and was obviously avoidable or MS wouldn’t have been penalized. As SV points out…these things happen, and this is not the first time in the 2 and a quarter seasons of MS’s return he has misjudged and whacked someone from behind. He obviously wasn’t in control of his car.

          1. You have your opinion i have mine and i stand by it.

          2. Same here.

  19. Can’t believe I spent so much time reading this but here goes:

    A) Suzuka 1990 Senna makes no move whatsoever towards Prost. Prost closes the door, to his credit, just like before when he had something to gain rather than lose. And this incident is incredibly isolated since Senna was treated disgracefully the year before by the “authority”.
    B) it’s really quite simple…the car in front tried to give room, but it would have been beyond ridiculous for Bruno to have actively driven out the way. Bruno has track position and broke no rules. Therefore there is no argument required: the driver in front, if obeying rules, cannot be at fault for contact in this situation. Because if they didn’t drive into the car to the rear/brake test/change direction etc – the situation in which rules would be broken – they cannot possibly be at fault… a crash has to have culpability attached – be it from mistakes or intent. Racing incidents are, to me, when that culpability is spread evenly – not when it doesn’t exist at all.
    C) Bruno’s body language said it all. That is a man who knows what is worth his anger and what is not. He also knows far more than Schumacher what risks you’re really taking if you act like a tool. Broken legs is “phew!” but losing your uncle and your dad to high speed instills in you a lot more than a lucky escape feeling, in my opinion.

    One more thing: Senna’s (senior!) intent was never to hurt, never to actively damage someone else’e car or health: it was just that when he said “if you no longer go for a gap…” he actually meant it. And Suzuka 90 was not to injure prost in any way, it was to level the playing field. A level playing field being something that MSC has trouble winning on. I like him, but if we go on stats, Jacques beats Gilles, which for the sake of the future of motor racing I hope we can all agree is terribly wrong ;)

    1. ????
      A. Aryton Senna himself already admitted it he drove into Prost, if after the start he loose the P1 he would go for it. Anyway it was dangerous high speed crash like i already said in previous post.

      And clearly Senna was one of the great but also a ruthless driver in F1, google it you will find it you can agree or disagree with it. And i don’t think comparing Jacques-Gilles to i assuming your mean is Senna-Schumacher is right, Jacques is a good driver but personally i don’t think he is the same level with Michael. It already in an argument before here in this site arguing about Schumacher-Senna you can read it. But afterall both are one of the greatest driver F1 ever seen.

  20. Sorry… by comparing Jacques and Gilles I meant to prove that Schumacher’s stats are not enough to say he’s the greatest (so as to prove he isn’t omnipotent). And I do realise I brought a lot of stuff back up again!! Senna did cause that crash as he admitted but he did NOT actively drive into Prost’s car, as in change direction towards it (The lack of penalty backs this up). That is clear in the footage. I know Senna was ruthless, but never unkind for its own sake. There are of course differing opinions on his driving, but i would hope that his commitments outside the car would be enough for even the most vehement MSC fans to be able to find some respect for him as a man. Bruno is not an Ayrton…but he is a good driver who has admitted his mistakes when they do exist.

    1. It’s your view fair enough for some MS fan or not the stats and his proving skill already show what he got. I respect Senna and think he is a Super driver, and i just think it’s not true when people/Senna fan saying Senna didn’t intentionally drove in to Prost contrary to what he already admitted it and you will see in some races Senna was involved couple of ruthless crash. Bruno didn’t admit it when in Brazil or Spa which i think it’s racing incindent like this one as well(i’m not alone in this).

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