Grosjean deserved longer ban, says Kobayashi

F1 Fanatic round-up

Kamui Kobayashi, Hungaroring, 2012In the round-up: Kamui Kobayashi says Romain Grosjean should have received more than a one-race ban for his crash at Spa.

Links

Top F1 links from the past 24 hours:

Grosjean ban lenient – Kobayashi (BBC)

“One race I was really surprised. I expected more than one race. He has had seven crashes in 12 races. It’s more than half. That’s too much.”

Maldonado hopes to see a lot less of the stewards (Reuters)

“I have been penalised quite a lot at the moment, we need to try to do something different, to be away from the stewards. I am doing my best and this is the solution, to be away from them.”

Kamui Kobayashi Q&A: Sauber?s potential ‘simply amazing’ (F1)

“There was somebody literally jumping to the front – jumping on other cars. That was very surprising for me – even with many years of racing under my belt I cannot remember being in such starting chaos. And why this time? Couldn?t it have happened in Budapest where it would have been no big deal for me. I was so far back on the grid that I wouldn?t have minded someone crashing at the front.”

Vettel puzzled by qualifying pace (Autosport)

“Qualifying was disappointing, but Sunday afternoon was okay and just before qualifying on Saturday morning was fine. Why? There is still not a one hundred per cent bulletproof answer, as there was nothing wrong with our qualifying.”

Italian GP – Conference 1 (FIA)

Felipe Massa: “I think qualifying is definitely important for us, just to have an easier race. I think maybe qualifying was not so great for me this year but I always had good direction, good pace in the races, not counting the first few races but afterwards, yes. I think qualifying is very very important so we focus on that and try to have an easier direction in the race, especially from the beginning to the end.”

Jenson Button: “I think I?ll have the same team mate…” (Adam Cooper)

“I was surprised to see what I read yesterday. I haven?t got a clue if there?s any truth in it at all. I think I?ll have the same team mate next year ?ǣ because this is the best choice for him.”

Lewis Hamilton refuses to rule out McLaren exit as speculation grows (The Guardian)

“Hamilton declined to comment specifically on his future on Thursday but said: ‘I want to win. You always want to win, that’s why most drivers exist and that’s why teams exist.'”

A game of bluff? (Sky)

Ted Kravitz: “If Hamilton’s management think they’re going to go to McLaren with a threat of Mercedes then they’ve chosen the wrong team because that team Mercedes might be out of Formula 1 sooner rather than later.”

Coulthard: The F1 family will raise a glass to Zanardi (The Telegraph)

“Alex left his mark on the paddock in other ways. An infectious character and a seriously driven individual, I remember once in practice Budapest when he exited the pits and blocked me for a whole lap. I pulled him aside later and asked him why he?d done it as I had been on a hot lap. He just smiled and said he had had track position.”

What might have been! (ESPN)

Karun Chandhok: “If you watch a lot of the starts even in F1, the guys who go around the outside are able to make places up and avoid chaos better as you have the tarmac run off area to use if you need it. Considering this then, I can’t quite understand why [Romain Grosjean] was trying to move all the way across to the inside of the track and the resultant carnage was a real shame because more than anything, I feel like we were robbed of a race.”

Formula One Betting: Italian Grand Prix Preview (Unibet)

My Italian Grand Prix preview for Unibet.

Tweets

Comment of the day

@F1antics on how the BBC/Sky deal has changed their F1 viewing:

Last year I watched every practice, qualifying and race and followed a lot of F1 media, often paying for content. I paid to visit one of the factories and travelled to watch some team testing. My interest in the sport prompted me to buy tickets for this year?s Canadian Grand Prix (where I spent money attending F1-related events), and I renewed my team membership.

I didn?t want to buy a Sky contract this year; it?s a lot of money to pay when I hardly watch TV, and wouldn?t want to watch any of the other channels. I did try a Sky monthly ticket at the start of the season, to watch on my laptop. I found it was a poor quality service with long time lags, and Sky?s customer support was abysmal.

So then I tried watching the BBC highlights, but I find the racing doesn?t interest me at all if I can?t watch it in full, with simultaneous live timing, and with other live commentaries/forums/team telemetries. I still tune in to catch a bit of the Jake Humphrey/Eddie Jordan/David Coulthard show, and BBC?s live race coverage has been great ?ǣ I think it?s better than last year.

But, to cut a long story short, my interest in F1 has waned. I doubt I?ll attend any races in 2013, I haven?t renewed my media subscriptions, and I doubt I?ll renew my team subscription when it expires. It?s a shame to have lost my passion, but I need to see live races to sustain it.

So I?m slowly beginning to find other things to do with my time and money. I don?t feel I?ve lost out, but I do think that F1 has. I?m just one person who was contributing to F1 salaries, but what if there?s more like me who?ve decided to spend their money on something more rewarding? The big players in F1 probably earn enough not to be affected, but the smaller players are surely going to suffer if there?s fewer people following the sport.
@F1antics

Read more:

From the forum

Happy birthday!

Happy birthday to Stephen!

If you want a birthday shout-out tell us when yours is by emailling me, using Twitter or adding to the list here.

On this day in F1

David Coulthard won a processional Italian Grand Prix on this day in 1997.

For the first half of the race Jean Alesi held the lead for Benetton, but Coulthard’s refuelling stop moved him ahead.

Alesi and Heinz-Harald Frentzen followed him home, with world championship contenders Jacques Villeneuve and Michael Schumacher fifth and sixth.

Here’s the start of the race:

Image ?? Sauber F1 Team

Advert | Go Ad-free

83 comments on Grosjean deserved longer ban, says Kobayashi

  1. Fer no.65 (@fer-no65) said on 7th September 2012, 0:04

    I have been penalised quite a lot at the moment, we need to try to do something different, to be away from the stewards.

    At least you’re changing the approach, mate. I remember not long ago, you said you would not change it. It took a while, don’t you think?

    • nemo87 (@nemo87) said on 7th September 2012, 0:10

      NO maldonado. WE don’t need to change anything.
      You’re the driver. YOU need to change something..

      fool.

      • Prisoner Monkeys (@prisoner-monkeys) said on 7th September 2012, 1:09

        Wow. Here I was, thinking everyone would be happy that Maldonado has finally developed the modicum of self-awareness that people have been demanding of him for months, but here we are and you’re cricicisng him for – of all things – bad grammar.

        Can you see why I might think you’re taking things a little too far?

        • vjanik said on 7th September 2012, 8:41

          what self awareness?

          “we need to…”

          he is either referring to his team in which case he is partially putting the blame on other people. or he thinks of himself as royalty.

          • Prisoner Monkeys (@prisoner-monkeys) said on 7th September 2012, 8:59

            Or, as someone for whom English is not their first language, he is not familiar with the proper grammatical rules of the pronoun ‘I’.

          • AndrewTanner (@andrewtanner) said on 7th September 2012, 21:19

            I imagine that’s got something to do with not wanting to pin all the blame on himself. He knows full well it’s got nothing to do with the team, but it’s a hard pill to swallow when you have to change you driving style.

            It’s a team sport, remember ;)

        • bosyber (@bosyber) said on 7th September 2012, 8:44

          The “we” is sometimes a little jarring to me too, but it’s not something we should blame Maldonado on so much as the current F1 (and world) “language”. They all do things together, until they are honest (cynically thinking).

          It is good that Maldonado and his driver coach/team have together decided they really need to change approach and focus on getting clean races; I am sure he knows he’s the one in the car so has to be the one to implement this changed approach. Hope it works, as both the team and F1 as a whole can use a fast driver like him showing good clean racing.

        • MahavirShah (@mahavirshah) said on 7th September 2012, 10:17

          It wasn’t exactly rocket science you know. We need to change something. As far as I know either the team need to change him or he needs to change how he drives. There is no ‘we’ in this. He seems to be making it sound like it’s some complex issue that requires deep thought, 2 years of penance on the himalayas and therapy. All he needs to do is not crash into anyone. That it took him this long to realize is kinda daft.

    • Traverse Mark Senior (@) said on 7th September 2012, 0:15

      Clearly Grosjean’s race ban scared the bejesus out of him, lets hope he has learnt his lesson (although I doubt that he has).

      • Kimi4WDC said on 7th September 2012, 0:52

        I think it was a good precedent they put up. If Maldonado does something bad again, they will punish him severely as Grosjean’s incident qualified as unintentional, which means intentional will be rated as 2-5 race ban.

    • John H (@john-h) said on 7th September 2012, 0:15

      “I” need to try something different don’t you mean? Even after Grosjean ban the guy still sounds like a jerk.

      • John H (@john-h) said on 7th September 2012, 0:28

        Apologies, a bit strong language. I just wish he would be more responsible, because he clearly has pace. It’s a shame he never admits guilt for anything. Reminds me of my 2 year old daughter.

    • HoHum (@hohum) said on 7th September 2012, 0:35

      @fer-no65, yes indeed, he goes on to say he must “think more”, I hope he does, he seems likeable out of the car.

    • matt90 (@matt90) said on 7th September 2012, 1:51

      There is so much wrong in that statement. First of all, who is ‘we’? There is nobody other than Maldonado responsible for his crashes. Secondly, he says:

      we need to try to do something different, to be away from the stewards. I am doing my best and this is the solution, to be away from them.

      Is he saying that to stay away from the stewards, he need to stay away from the stewards? Really?

      • matt90 (@matt90) said on 7th September 2012, 1:56

        To be the fair, the article reads as a series of random quotes, so I assume he’s actually trying to to say the evaluating situations more will keep him out of the stewards office. Pretty obvious, but at least it’s logical.

      • Fer no.65 (@fer-no65) said on 7th September 2012, 3:33

        @matt90 I read it as we = myself and the team. The team should tell him more often “watch out, kid” and he should realize that enough is enough.

        He’s not the best at english either. In the latin coverage, they interview him directly and he’s often saying: “it’s one of those things”, “crashes happen” and stuff like that, as if it was destiny. Well, destiny has been striking him very often… so it must be him. To say “we need to try to do something different” is a massive change, compared to “what I do is okay and the others should adapt”.

        • BasCB (@bascb) said on 7th September 2012, 7:13

          they interview him directly and he’s often saying: “it’s one of those things”, “crashes happen” and stuff like that, as if it was destiny

          he was saying very much the same in english interviews I saw with him before the summer brake @fer-no65, so lets hope this is a change of attitude

    • Jeanrien (@jeanrien) said on 7th September 2012, 2:26

      But some parts of the article could be read as it’s not over

      “Sometimes I have been involved in small incidents and I have been to the stewards again so I will try and be away from everything. But at the same time I will try to push and I will try to do my best for the team and myself.

      Maldonado pushing = Maldonado crashing most of the time, at least it’s what it seems, so I wait to see …

    • Maksutov (@maksutov) said on 7th September 2012, 5:53

      He hasn’t yet said that he is going to change his driving, only that he is going to stay “away from the stewards”. Hahaha…

    • BasCB (@bascb) said on 7th September 2012, 7:09

      I will be laughing endlessly if we see him running away far from the stewards office come the 55th lap of Monza and another incident!

      Seriously, it does give the impression that he finally understood the message too, possibly Grosjean’s penalty helped, because without doubt Frank Williams, and Alex Wurz and the stewards team would have been making it clear that his race ban was around the corner if he does not start to use his brain in the right moment.

      • bosyber (@bosyber) said on 7th September 2012, 8:48

        hah, that would be hilariously sad @bascb :)

        Well said, I do think it sounds like he finally is admitting that he needs to change his way of racing a bit; Seems the changed attitude of the stewards, seemingly inconsistent with the earlier ways as it was, is having an effect. Let’s see if it lasts and turns into a set of consistently fast and reliable Grosjean, Maldonado drives and stewards decisions.

      • I genuinely believe this is what Maldonado is trying to say – he will avoid the stewards by simply ignoring them after a race.

        “Haha stewards you will never catch me and if you do I’ll crash into you and say THAT’S RACING”

        I personally wouldn’t chase after that psycho.. lol

    • caci99 (@caci99) said on 7th September 2012, 12:25

      Hmm, Maldonado is now afraid from stewards because of the decision they took for Grosejan, and may be they have send a message to him as well. Well, I hope the stewards will not let him down.

  2. Matt (@agentmulder) said on 7th September 2012, 0:18

    I’m surprised to hear Kamui weighing in on this. He’s usually one of the more reserved guys (probably a language thing) and for him to come out strongly against somebody is uncharacteristic. I think though he and Grosjean are prime examples of how you should and shouldn’t drive aggressively. Kamui waits until he is in a position to overtake, bides his time, and uses his car’s natural tire conservation to wait for the gap. When it presents itself, he goes for it, sometime touching tire sidewalls, but nearly always in a way that ends perfectly. While he makes mistakes, his successes far outweigh the failures.

    Grosjean on the other hand seemed to take Senna’s famous quote to its literal extreme. The guy doesn’t wait, especially on the first lap. He tries to take lots of positions right from the start, ignoring the fact that he’s shooting straight toward where the other cars will apex. I guess he expects those around him will brake to avoid him or something. On rare occasions he makes this work, but more often than not he ends up damaging someone else, or doing what we saw in Spa.

    I have nothing against the guy, and would be more than happy to lay off him if this ban screws his head back on straight. I think a race ban was a bit much when you compare Grosjean’s crashes (many incidents, none intentional) to Maldonado (roughly same number of incidents, nothing as dramatic, but he has intentionally used his car as a battering ram), but maybe this is what Romain needs to reassess his BANZAI! tactics.

    • electrolite (@electrolite) said on 7th September 2012, 0:26

      ‘I’m surprised to hear Kamui weighing in on this. He’s usually one of the more reserved guys (probably a language thing) and for him to come out strongly against somebody is uncharacteristic.’

      Absolutely!

    • xeroxpt (@) said on 7th September 2012, 0:27

      Yeah agreed, he really does go beyond the limits, it’s the survival mode, it’s very useful on GP2 they are much more aggressive than F1 drivers and their aggressiveness pays off, but somehow most former GP2 drivers don’t make elementary mistakes, they bang wheels crash into each other etc, but not like we are seeing with Grosjean, he may just be taking some advice from former F1 drivers, the ones that dare get the rewards but until now he is only getting the rubbish, nonetheless i still like him.

    • Alfie (@alfie) said on 7th September 2012, 0:32

      Perhaps he voiced an opinion because it badly affected his race?

    • Traverse Mark Senior (@) said on 7th September 2012, 0:38

      I agree that it is uncharacteristic, but let’s not forget that his best qualifying performance since entering F1 was ruined by GRO, and when you couple the fact that Sauber appeared to have genuine pace, I can understand why he said what he said.

      • Matt (@agentmulder) said on 7th September 2012, 0:43

        Yeah, its perfectly understandable. I have no problem with him coming out with his view. I expected somebody to call for a harsher punishment, I just never expected it to be Kobayashi.

    • Adam B (@lurker) said on 7th September 2012, 1:12

      I have to admit that I haven’t read the full conference transcript, but the quotes from the article Keith linked to above about Kobi’s comments seem to suggest that he “thought that Grosjean DESERVED further punishment” is a touch misleading. He said he was “surprised” that Grosjean didn’t have a larger penalty, and “expected” a larger penalty. I don’t recall reading about him saying that Grosjean “DESERVED” a harsher penalty.

      even so, I agree in that it is unusual for Kamui to get outspoken about anything. That said, he got wiped badly by Grosjean and ruined what could well have been his best result of the season (maybe even his career so far).

      I really hope that the Spa pace is indicative of what we can expect from Sauber, and Kamui, at Monza.

    • Jeanrien (@jeanrien) said on 7th September 2012, 2:31

      It’s easy to understand why he is speaking like that … just count how many of his races WE has been ruined by other drivers for Sauber. Those Sauber looks like car’s magnet. They already have a great season and that’s probably hiding the even greater season they could have if not taken out by others

    • AndrewTanner (@andrewtanner) said on 7th September 2012, 21:24

      This did cross my mind, but they had their best qualifying result in I don’t know how long so they had a lot to lose. Had the Sauber’s qualified further back I fully expect that the media largely wouldn’t be so bothered what Sauber think.

  3. xeroxpt (@) said on 7th September 2012, 0:21

    Karun is a reasonable guy, I would like him to replace Jerome on GP2 for the Italian GP. I’m too of the opinion Grosjean should have earned an harsher penalty, it’s just that he should have been penalised earlier and he perhaps could have stopped making such paramount, inane mistakes at the starts, like Karun says, Grosjean makes no sense, and like other drivers like Kobayashi state, they never were that unconscious of what can happen when cars are bunched up, I don’t want to stir things up more but what even impresses me more is his incapability of truly apologizing, he talks about the accident he is on defense mode, he’s not lying, he just sounds like he is being robbed, he sounds like a rich spoiled kid. “I’m sorry and this won’t happen again” it’s all i want to hear, not that the FIA and the Stewards make a bad job communicating and explaining themselves because in the end they are right and in the end Mr Grosjean will have to do something to apologize to the ones involved.

  4. Alex Brown (@splittimes) said on 7th September 2012, 0:26

    COTD from @F1antics: spot on. F1 needs us more than we need F1.

  5. Alfie (@alfie) said on 7th September 2012, 0:28

    I’ve felt my interest in F1 wane a little, but I have Sky :/

  6. Bullfrog (@bullfrog) said on 7th September 2012, 0:30

    Maybe the céntimo has dropped at last – or perhaps, on his most recent visit, the stewards warned Pastor that if they see him again it’s the naughty step for him as well as Grosjean.

    But can a driver just change his approach like that? I lost count of the number of times David Coulthard assured us it was “no more Mr Nice Guy” at the beginning of a season…

    Good to read Kobayashi’s thoughts as we don’t hear much from him, but I can’t help thinking that if he’d concentrated on getting his own start right, he might have got himself round La Source and clear of trouble, like Button and Raikkonen.

  7. xeroxpt (@) said on 7th September 2012, 0:34

    Great COTD, F1 is not like Football, for many reasons they can’t treat us the same way, Football is everywhere it is very accessible it keeps the inner flame that itch to the sport, if they shut F1 they may lose a lot of people, they have lost this season the traditional casual Sunday lunch viewers , and if small changes have already happened as Keith mentioned on the ratings post, from now on only the US could raise their ratings, they are the ones rock bottom at the moment, only hardcore fans watch it, UK and Italy seem to be doomed. My biggest fear is that the next generations won’t have the love for Motorsport that i have, everyone is free to have their own opinions but Motorsport won’t improve if people don’t care.

    • Traverse Mark Senior (@) said on 7th September 2012, 0:58

      The new generation of drivers (like Hamilton and Vettel) definitely helped to reinvigorate the sport and bring in new fans. The popularity of F1 has boomed since 2007 but the way things are going, it wouldn’t surprise me if F1 has to ready itself for a massive lull in form, especially if Murdoch.inc does follow through (LoL) with his plan for world domina *cough* I mean his plan to completely own the F1 broadcasting rights.

  8. Prisoner Monkeys (@prisoner-monkeys) said on 7th September 2012, 1:14

    I think Lewis Hamilton is playing a dangerous game with McLaren. He might be fast, but McLaren aren’t just looking for a fast driver – they want someone who fits their profile, and speed alone is not the only variable that will decide the team’s line-up next year.

  9. Rui (@ruicaridade) said on 7th September 2012, 1:35

    http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-9TmtCyYYUnY/UAwcPRgKX2I/AAAAAAAAEUI/DxvU03Jsssc/s1600/Gp_Germania_2012_gara_domenica_026.jpg

    Grosjean seems to have a problem in sensing the size of the vehicle he is driving.

  10. tokyospark (@tokyospark) said on 7th September 2012, 1:42

    I agree! Kobayashi didn’t say Grosjean deserved a harsher penalty, only that he had expected he’s get one. Your headline is misleading Keith, and those who know Kobayashi are surprised by it. Please don’t resort to the sensationalism that envelopes many lesser websites. Your fans and followers don’t need or want it. That’s why we come here!

    • Julian (@julian) said on 7th September 2012, 2:13

      “One race I was really surprised. I expected more than one race. He has had seven crashes in 12 races. It’s more than half. That’s too much.

      Nothing sensational about it. If he was expecting more than a one race ban its only logical that he thinks he deserved more than a one race ban.

      • Maksutov (@maksutov) said on 7th September 2012, 6:00

        “If he was expecting more than a one race ban its only logical that he thinks he deserved more than a one race ban.”

        ^ that

      • tokyospark (@tokyospark) said on 7th September 2012, 10:11

        It may be logical that he thought he deserved a longer ban, but the fact is that he didn’t say that. I’m not the only one to point this out. If the headline had read “Kobayashi thought Grosjean would get a longer ban” that would have been spot on. When you have a headline that specifically states someone said something, that should be exactly what they said, otherwise it’s paraphrasing and assuming intent. Something Keith hasn’t done in the past so I was surprised.

    • Mike (@mike) said on 7th September 2012, 2:57

      I doubt he’d expect a longer penalty if he didn’t think he deserved a longer one. Keep in mind that Kamui just had a huge opportunity demolished by Grosjean, so it’s natural that he’d feel that way.

      That and if you’ve been on the website for any amount of time, you’d know that Kieth simply doesn’t work like that.

  11. raymondu999 (@raymondu999) said on 7th September 2012, 4:09

    We need to get Kamui and Romain in the same press conference! I still remember Trulli and Sutil…

  12. Maksutov (@maksutov) said on 7th September 2012, 6:03

    Well Kamui makes a good point. And weather people like it or not, it is what Kamui thinks, and he is not afraid to express his opinion. Thus article heading, “Grosjean deserved longer ban, says Kobayashi” is valid.

  13. Maksutov (@maksutov) said on 7th September 2012, 6:21

    Hamilton:

    “I want to win. You always want to win, that’s why most drivers exist and that’s why teams exist.”

    Well, that comes back to my comment on the previous article.

    I think Hamilton is getting frustrated, and wants a faster car. But he is not always going to have the fastest car whichever team he goes. I don’t think Ron Dennis is going to wait too long. I know Whitmarsh is in charge, but really Ron is the one who calls the shots. He likes to be in control of his McLaren. As other people have mentioned, continued signs of indecisions or uncertainty by Hamilton could give enough reason for McLaren (by that I mean: Ron Dennis) to seek and secure other options.

  14. BasCB (@bascb) said on 7th September 2012, 6:56

    Shame he probably won’t be able to make it in time, but wouldn’t it be amazing to try and get Alex Zanardi to hand out the trophies on Sunday?

    • Funkyf1 (@funkyf1) said on 8th September 2012, 3:37

      Would be a great choice @BasCB, I think every race presentation should be done by a former driver! Zanardi is the perfect choice for this round, although considering his recent achievements he might steal the show!

  15. JCost (@jcost) said on 7th September 2012, 7:18

    Button is right. Ted Kravitz is right. Hamilton has nowhere to go.

Add your comment

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *

All comments must abide by the comment policy. Comments may be moderated.
Want to post off-topic? Head to the forum.
See the FAQ for more information.