Massa and Gutierrez given penalties for blocking

2013 Spanish Grand Prix

Felipe Massa, Ferrari, Circuit de Cataunya, Barcelona, 2013Felipe Massa and Esteban Gutierrez have been moved back three places on the grid for the Spanish Grand Prix for holding up other drivers during qualifying.

Massa was found to have held Mark Webber up while Gutierrez was punished for getting in Kimi Raikkonen’s way during Q1.

Massa falls back from sixth to ninth while Gutierrez is moved back to 19th on the grid.

The Ferrari driver was unhappy with his penalty: “It was not my intention to get in his way and in all honesty, I can?t recall having affected his qualifying,” he said.

“When I saw him in the mirrors, I thought I?d get through the corner before letting him by, which was the only course of action at such a narrow point. On top of that, he was on worn tyres at the time and I don?t think he was doing a quick lap.”

See the updated 2013 Spanish Grand Prix grid

2013 Spanish Grand Prix

Browse all 2013 Spanish Grand Prix articles

50 comments on “Massa and Gutierrez given penalties for blocking”

    1. I don’t know, Monisha has just seen Frijns winning the feature race in GP2, and it was only his third weekend in this series.

      By the way, I’m massively disappointed by Gutierrez. I didn’t expect him to be faster than Hulkenberg, but he showed flashes of good pace in his GP2 carreer. And not only he is quite far from Hulkenberg, but he is making some silly mistakes (which I expected from him, to be honest).

    2. @omarr-pepper
      I dont get why people are recommending Kovalainen, The guy had his time in f1 and really didn’t make much of an impression. Instead, you would rather replace a rookie driver who is just 5 races into the season and is yet to show what he is made of.

      I just dont get it

  1. I know it sounds silly but surely a reprimand would be more appropriate for both of them seeing as neither Raikkonen and Webber were actually affected in the long run.

          1. @david-a

            It was too late and damage was made, the lap of Alonso was influenced, so he blosck him…intentionally or not, is another question

            But as usually, anyone see what he wants to see.
            This is a double standard.

          1. @john-h what I see there is a Vettel going well beyond the usual turn-in point to get out of Alonso’s way. I think the reprimand was only really because he probably could’ve committed himself to doing that earlier, instead of languishing in the middle of the track until Alonso was fast approaching.

    1. @davef1 that’s not the point. They should’ve moved out of the way and didn’t, so the penalties were justified. Webber showed how it was supposed to be done when he let Massa (ironically) by into turn 3: get off the racing line and don’t deviate.

      1. @vettel1 It’s entirely the point. Penalties should be applied when it has a direct affect on the results. Of course Gutierrez and Massa were in the wrong and it does act as a deterrent for other drivers but its not liked their actions had any affect on the results. What’s even funnier is that Maldonado was told to get out of the way by his team and failed to do so yet he somehow got away with it. What’s the difference between Maldonado blocking Button and the Gutierrez/Massa incidents.

        Also what’s the point of reprimands then. I always thought that they are applied when its the drivers first few minor mistakes of the season. Sure there’s a case with Gutierrez as he’s being quiet reckless so far but there’s no real justifiable reason for Massa. That was his first error all season and it now could potentially cost him a good points haul.

        1. @davef1 not it isn’t: the point is slower drivers (on out/in laps) are supposed to get out of the way of drivers on flying laps. It doesn’t matter if it was their fastest effort or if they were doing it on used tyres, you are just supposed to get out of the way regardless. I shall stress further, whether it makes a difference to the results is not the consideration, it’s whether they impeded a driver on their lap (which Gutierrez and Massa did).

          What’s even funnier is that Maldonado was told to get out of the way by his team and failed to do so yet he somehow got away with it.

          Maldonado didn’t really have much place else to go: he was in the middle f the chicane already I believe about to start a lap, so that didn’t justify a penalty in my eyes or in the stewards. As for reprimands, perhaps I agree they would’ve been more appropriately used in Massa’s case at least but Gutierrez definitely deserved a grid penalty for that effort. Massa still definitely merited a telling off of sorts though as he quite significantly obstructed Webber.

          1. @vettel1, @all, the fact that we saw 3 incidence of this nature shows that reprimands have had no effect, therefore penalties are required. I think it is highly unlikely we will see any similar incidents anytime soon now that grid place penalties have been applied.

  2. Gutierrez’s penalty is rightfully so as he blatantly blocked Raikkonen who was on a bloody fast lap. I didn’t see Massa holding up Webber, so I can’t comment on that accident.

    1. He was driving much slower on the racing line at turn 12 (?, the long 180-degree corner at the third sector) and Webber had to slow down much as well, before Massa let him go on the run to next corner.

  3. I was thinking with the Massa situation it may have been smart (though very risky and difficult) for the team to try and orchestrate Massa qualifying ahead of Alonso by one place, that way when he is bumped down he puts Alonso back up and he only looses 2 places technically. He was so close to actually getting ahead, it’s a shame.

  4. I thought it was a bit unfair on Massa. He was half-way through a long corner which would be quite difficult to come to the outside after being on the inside without risking going off. Although it could be argued his team should have been on top of it.

    1. @james_mc, by his own admission Massa was totally aware of Webber being on a run and he not only knew what tyre Webber was using he knew that they were used not new, as for the difficulty of getting out of the way, he should have been on the outside even before Webber appeared in his mirrors, it’s not like he is new to F1.

  5. This is disappointing. We’ve seen before drivers not getting penalised because the affected still got through to the next stage of qualifying.

    I can see the argument that Massa should still be punished, but, can there at least be consistency if they are going to go down that route? Just write it out in black and white in the sporting regulations. Anyone caught blocking gets a 3 place penalty or whatever regardless of if the driver got through Q(1,2,3).

    As for Massa not realising what he’s doing, well that’s for another discussion. Comments like this:

    On top of that, he was on worn tyres at the time and I don’t think he was doing a quick lap

    just sound stupid. Did he observe the quality of the tyre in his mirror as well?… come on, pay attention to those around you when you’re not on a flying lap, simple as that.

      1. @vettel1

        Of course the stewards need to discuss whether or not a penalty is required. That’s not my point. I’m saying that once they have done so and (potentially) agreed that the person on the flying lap lost time because of the other driver’s actions, there should be a consistent penalty applied.

        It’s actually one of the rare things in F1 where we can have some objectivity in the regulations.

  6. I don’t like the quali result (or race results, for that matter) being affected after the event is over. And I think people are getting a bit prissy about this whole thing. It was never a problem when we had a 60 minute open pitlane qualifying format, but people now [cliche alert] want to save tyres by doing only one flying lap, and leave it as late as possible to get the track at its best. Its really sad to hear drivers insisting on penalties for each other down the radio. If you don’t want to get caught out, it should be your responsibility to do your best to avoid the situation. If someone is particularly dopey, give them a telling off, but keep it behind closed doors. It does the sport a disservice to but these behaviors in the public eye.

    1. @splittimes there is nothing I can disgaree with in that comment: well put sir!

      The only real thing I think is worth mentioning is that I don’t think it’s at all the fault of the qualifying format (in fact, I think that generally improves the traffic situation) it is just as you’ve said: the tyres. Everyone wants to do their lap at the same time, which inevitably leads to these problems.

      1. @vettel1, Max such gentlemanly (and ladylike for @celeste) toothless regulation is what lead to a red car “accidentally” hitting the wall at Rascasse in Monte Carlo on the last lap of qualifying, a regulation without a proper penalty just leads to abuse, the Stewards made the right call.

        1. @hohum I do agree that drivers need to be punished actually otherwise the rule will just be abused so yes I concur with you also in that the stewards did indeed make the right call.

          However, I do feel the problem is being exasperated by all the running coming close to the end of the session, so perhaps that is one of the major problems here which could do with resolving. Quite how I don’t know but maybe there is a fix for Q1 at least (Q2/3 tend not to be too bad for traffic with the decreased number of cars on track).

          1. @vettel1, yes the tyre/track situation does make qualifying difficult which is, I believe, why it was important for Webber to put in a good “banker” on what should have been a clear track, in case, as happened, traffic prevented a good last minute lap.

        2. You call me a lady, I like you @hohum ;)

          I understand both points. Reulations needs a punisment, but If I remember the rule about impeding is old, so is not something that has to be with the actual format of qualifying. The fact that now we have a limit of time mades qualy excited.

          I agree with Max, the situation with tyres has complicated the problem with traffic. Since everybody wants to be the last one late in the session to take chequered flag. But is not necessary Pirelli´s fault. Since last year they offered to introduce qualy only tyres, but it was a mussure that it was rejected.

    2. Yes, it’s like footballers waving imaginary yellow cards at the ref, trying to get him to caution another player. I’m sure Alan Jones isn’t having any of that, judging by what I’ve read about his reputation. And some of these incidents were early in qualifying where the guy easily made it through to the next part.

      I’d give all the whinging drivers penalties too, goodness knows what they’ll be like at Monaco.

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *

You may use these HTML tags and attributes: <a href="" title=""> <abbr title=""> <acronym title=""> <b> <blockquote cite=""> <cite> <code> <del datetime=""> <em> <i> <q cite=""> <s> <strike> <strong>