Setback for Russian Grand Prix bid

F1 Fanatic Round-up

Andreas Sigl, Nikolay Buturlakin, Sebastian Vettel, Oleg Zabara, Sochi, 2013In the round-up: An impasse between the Russian Automobile Federation and the promoter of the planned Russian Grand Prix puts the race in jeopardy.

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Russia’s F1 Application Snarled Up in Red Tape (RSport)

“The issue at hand is a spat between the Russian Automobile Federation and the race promoter Omega Center, which is also building the 5.9km track around the coastal Olympic Park. The RAF is refusing to file a race application with the FIA until Omega, which is tied to the Krasnodar region government, agrees to bear the cost of training the 700-800 personnel required to staff the race such as marshals and security.”

Franz Tost Q&A: Vettel?s team mate has to bring a lot to the table (F1)

“Remember: when Seb left Toro Rosso to join Red Bull Racing, the team was in no way the winner that it is today – Seb has contributed a lot to make it happen. So if you want to be the new kid on the block you better have all these facts in mind – and show even more commitment to come at least close to Seb. That will be a rough ride!”

Indian Grand Prix to take one-year break (The Hindu)

Indian Grand Prix promoter JPSI managing director and chief executive officer Sameer Gaur: “October-November period suits us better, both weather-wise as well as it being the festive season. But if the Formula One Management (FOM) wants us to hold our race in March 2015, we don?t have any problem with that.”

McLaren Formula One team improving, but still struggling mightly (Autoweek)

Jenson Button: “You can run your own strategy, because you can overtake easily. As soon as you get to tracks where you can overtake you can then just run to optimum performance, and you get a better picture of where you are then.”

Maldonado expects Williams surge (Autosport)

“Before, I was completely dominated by the tyres and the car. They were not working at all in my case. Now, I think it was so clear that my level was a step forwards and I was able to fight with cars that are stronger than us.”

A miracle from Lewis (Sky)

Martin Brundle: “It was cruel that [Romain Grosjean] was penalised for completing the move on Massa while being marginally all four wheels off the track. Without doubt the drivers will see this as a disincentive to ‘have a go’ and create those magic moments people still talk about years later. The trouble is that the rules are very clear about leaving the track between the white lines and gaining an advantage or position. If it was a barrier or a gravel trap he wouldn’t have even contemplated it.”

Gary Anderson on Hamilton, Ferrari and scrapping DRS (BBC)

“The FIA has its priorities wrong in taking away the potential for drivers to do moves like [Grosjean's on Massa] but giving them the ridiculous DRS overtaking aid to create artificial overtaking manoeuvres.”

F1 flashback: Driver illegally starts German Grand Prix (NBC)

“A dismayed Heyer was just four hundredths of a second of Rebaque?s mark ?ǣ and there were two other drivers quicker than him who also fell short of qualifying. But Heyer was not to be deterred from making his grand prix debut by the inconvenient fact of having failed to qualify for it.”

Becca and Lisa?s Silverstone Adventures, Part 1 (Motorsport Muesli)

Nice cartoon.

Mark Webber: Five things I can’t live without (Daily Express)

Something tells me one of these five was inserted for PR purposes…

Snapshot

Lotus, Silverstone, 2013

F1 Fanatic reader David Wallace (Twitter: @davidhw2506) got a close look at the Lotus during the young drivers’ test at Silverstone and sent in this picture of the car.

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Comment of the day

Nick says the problems faced by the Indian Grand Prix shows F1 needs to work harder on its races in new venues:

F1 needs better entry-strategies in new countries. People aren?t going to warm up to F1 if it?s the only race to come around to their country, once a year.

Bernie [Ecclestone] and the FIA need to drag along more series and the FIA (provided that they or an affiliate are present in such a country) could try to introduce karting championships or celebrity races with touring cars. Not just go ‘Oh, well, F1 is amazing, so they will flock to us!’
Nick (@Npf1)

From the forum

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On this day in F1

The last German Grand Prix at the Nordschleife is mainly remembered for one thing: the fiery accident that almost killed Niki Lauda, which is set to feature in the forthcoming film Rush by Ron Howard.

The race was stopped after Lauda’s crash and James Hunt won ahead of Jody Scheckter and Jochen Mass. Meanwhile Lauda was fighting for his life.

Here’s some footage from the race:

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142 comments on Setback for Russian Grand Prix bid

  1. Max Jacobson (@vettel1) said on 1st August 2013, 0:22

    Q: Sebastian comes across as every mother in law’s dream: he is so well behaved, so accessible, so polite. But with just these qualities you’re unlikely to make it to the top – there must be something under the surface; a completely different side of the same coin. What is it?
    FT: His fighting spirit. Yes, he is open and honest, friendly and accessible, but behind his façade there is a massive fighting spirit and, if that sets in, his opponents have a problem.

    That’s what I admire so much in Vettel, the way in which he so peerlessly switches between “mother in law” mode to “eye of the tiger” mode!

    All that aside though the interview is actually very interesting I felt and it will be intriguing to see how Ricciardo would react if he were put in the same team as Vettel I think.

  2. JackySteeg (@jackysteeg) said on 1st August 2013, 0:25

    Surprised to see Webber back on Top Gear! They seem to be bringing in an F1 driver every series now!

  3. minnis (@minnis) said on 1st August 2013, 0:26

    For some reason she wasn’t on the birthday list, so I’d like to wish a very happy 21st birthday to my amazing girlfriend (and also fellow F1 Fanatic reader!) @Ldawson.

  4. Daniel (@collettdumbletonhall) said on 1st August 2013, 0:50

    Is that stuff about Alonso really true? I’d like to know how he knows all that.

    • BasCB (@bascb) said on 1st August 2013, 6:53

      I guess it came out after poking around about potential talks now? German press has always had a good inside line into Red Bull (and Mercedes)

      • Blackmamba (@blackmamba) said on 1st August 2013, 11:56

        It’s been out there for a while now, but at the time nobody took notice because no one considered RedBull to be a threat. Certainly, even if they had offered Alonso more money the seat to be in at the time was Ferrari.
        Anyway, I don’t see how Alonso would even contemplate joining now with the new rules coming. He would be better served to wait another year then see who has got the best baseline in performance and then make the switch, or not as the case may be. He would hang himself to switch next year and find that Ferrari were better than Redbull.

        • @blackmamba you could say the same of Hamilton to an extent but look how well that move’s turned out. I highly doubt Alonso would make a move to Red Bull but they have Adrian Newey and a whole fleet of other great engineers – I wouldn’t bet against them remaining competitive.

  5. sato113 (@sato113) said on 1st August 2013, 1:05

    at the end of the day, the indian track has produced 2 boring races, so i find it hard to care.

    • OmarR-Pepper (@omarr-pepper) said on 1st August 2013, 2:54

      But I don’t think contracts have a “boring –> sacked” clause. I think it can be for what the other day was published, said by Jaipee race organizers, that they still need ot improve a couple of things. (it can be a statement to diminish the shame though). However, I would have liked it to still have the race next year. It was a grand Chelem for Vettel :P

  6. HoHum (@hohum) said on 1st August 2013, 1:26

    I guess Bernie forgot to mention the 7-800 track personell required when he was explaining how much money the organizers would make from holding the Russian GP. Does seem like a lot though.

    • Prisoner Monkeys (@prisoner-monkeys) said on 1st August 2013, 1:44

      Oh, I imagine that he would have mentioned it, or that everyone involved would have at least been aware of it from the start.

      No, it’s more likely that this is just a case of both sides trying to dodge an expense by trying to pass it off to the other party. It happens in business all the time.

    • BasCB (@bascb) said on 1st August 2013, 6:56

      700-800 sounds like a lot, but I think I remember reading at the time that there were about 400 marshals from Bahrain to help out/train people at the first Indian GP, and I think they mentioned looking for about 600 volunteers for the next indian GP too @hohum

    • Luis O said on 1st August 2013, 10:37

      It is not a lot and they will possibly do something to make it happen. But I have to say that I won’t miss if this GP is cancelled. I don’t sympathise with a country with that amount of hate and discrimination.

  7. PMccarthy_is_a_legend (@pmccarthy_is_a_legend) said on 1st August 2013, 1:35

    When Brundle left the BBC for SKY he left a big void in the Beebs commentary team. However I think the BBC has struck gold with Gary Anderson. His insights during the race and his written articles are always well informed, interesting and relevant. He brings credibility and is a racer through and through. I always look forward to his contributions both written and during the race.

  8. David-A (@david-a) said on 1st August 2013, 2:16

    Q: But we’ve also seen that two ‘alpha dogs’ in a team can lead to headaches…
    FT: I would love to have these headaches! I would even skip aspirin!

    Good answer Franz. Go on RBR for the Seb and Kimi dream team.

    • Prisoner Monkeys (@prisoner-monkeys) said on 1st August 2013, 2:46

      Red Bull would be the last team on the grid to hire two drivers who could actually race each other.

      And if they dud, it would only be fir show. They would manipulate things behind the scenes to favour Vettel.

      • Keith Collantine (@keithcollantine) said on 1st August 2013, 7:47

        @prisoner-monkeys

        Red Bull would be the last team on the grid to hire two drivers who could actually race each other.

        No, the last team to hire two drivers who could race each other would be Ferrari. Webber has been a far more competitive team mate to Vettel than Massa has been to Alonso:

        2012 in statistics part one: The year in context

        Which is hardly surprising given that Christian Horner has repeatedly made it clear he wants a strong driver to partner Vettel, whereas Ferrari stated last year they don’t want ‘two roosters’ in the same team.

        • James (@iamjamm) said on 1st August 2013, 8:31

          Which is hardly surprising given that Christian Horner has repeatedly made it clear he wants a strong driver to partner Vettel

          Unless that partner is Lewis Hamilton, @keithcollantine ;)

          • TMF (@tmf42) said on 1st August 2013, 8:57

            @iamjamm there is a difference – Webber wanted an extension and he was always on Mateschitz’s short list. There was simply no chance for any other driver to get that seat last year.

        • Prisoner Monkeys (@prisoner-monkeys) said on 1st August 2013, 8:56

          @keithcollantine – Webber has been far more competitive than Massa, but I think that Massa, at least, is allowed to compete with Alonso. Red Bull have never really let Webber race Vettel, except for when Vettel has won the title. So I think Ferrari would happily take two competitive drivers before Red Bull ever would.

          • Keith Collantine (@keithcollantine) said on 1st August 2013, 9:18

            @prisoner-monkeys

            I think that Massa, at least, is allowed to compete with Alonso.

            Not at the 2010 German Grand Prix, when he was ordered to let Alonso past to win.
            Not at the 2012 United States Grand Prix, when Ferrari pretended his gearbox was damaged to give him a five-place grid penalty to move Alonso up one place.

            When Red Bull have used team orders they have been “hold position” instructions and they have been used against both drivers. Webber was given one at Silverstone in 2011 and Vettel was at Malaysia this year (not that either driver obeyed them on either occasion, but the intent on the team’s part was clearly there).

          • TMF (@tmf42) said on 1st August 2013, 9:21

            @prisoner-monkeys
            With this you just disqualified yourself from being taken seriously. Massa who had to concede a win in Germany 2010 – taken a grid penalty to promote Alonso on the grid (Austin 2012) – had to stay behind in South Korea 2012 – is the guy allowed to race his teammate but Webber isn’t?

          • Prisoner Monkeys (@prisoner-monkeys) said on 1st August 2013, 10:20

            @tmf42 – The incident in Germany happened three years ago. I don’t really see how that’s relevant, unless you’re assuming nothing has changed within Ferrari.

            As for the Austin and Korea events, you will note that Alonso was still in contention for the championship at the time. Massa was not. There’s a big difference between supporting on driver’s title bid when his team-mate is out of contention, and favouring one driver over the other from the start if the season, as I believe Red Bull do.

            All if this is a moot point, though. I never said that Ferrari would take two competitive drivers – only that they’d do it before Red Bull. They’d probably be the second-last team to do it.

          • BasCB (@bascb) said on 1st August 2013, 11:53

            I think you are kidding yourselves there @prisoner-monkeys if you think Massa has a fair chance in the world at competing with Alonso.

            Sure, they let him set some quick laps last year, and it helped get at least some points in. But as far as strategy calls, friday program, which parts go on what car, as well as development routes taken, all of that is focussed on getting Alonso to the top step.
            How often have we seen Massa drop back during the race, even afte a strong start, because the team either used him to test the water or kept him out longer because they were minding Alonso?

            I know that Webber probably did not have all available resources Vettel had, and its clear that at least part of the team leadership are geared towards Vettel getting everything. But ITs certain that Mateschitz, and to an extent, Horner, want a strong driver there who can both challenge for results, as well as push Vettel forward by challenging him often enough.
            Massa has no hope of winning a race, or even getting points in front of Alonso unless Alonso would be out of it at an early stage. Webber knows that he gets the car to show that he can do it, even if its with the odds stacked a bit against him (which seems to beat him into greater focus).

          • petebaldwin (@petebaldwin) said on 1st August 2013, 13:20

            Webber is more competitive than Massa but you can’t say Massa is allowed to race Alonso! If Massa was 1st and Alonso 2nd at Hungary, they would have been ordered to switch places. 100%. Massa would have pulled over and let it happen.

            If Webber was 1st and Vettel 2nd, the orders wouldn’t have happened. If they did, Webber would have ignored them anyway.

            Massa knows he will only remain in F1 as long as he is 2nd driver for Ferrari. No other teams would be interested in him now surely so if he refused to follow orders, he’d be without a seat.

          • Prisoner Monkeys (@prisoner-monkeys) said on 1st August 2013, 22:40

            @bascb – There is a difference between not having the talent to compete with your team-mate, but the team allowing you to if you can (as I believe is the case with Massa), and having the talent to compete with your team-mate, but not being allowed to by the team (as I believe is the case with Webber).

          • BasCB (@bascb) said on 2nd August 2013, 10:04

            I am convinced your belief is wrong there @prisioner-monkeys, because the odds are all stacked to not even allow him to try and challenge Alonso, but lets not lose ourselves in endless discussion, it was a nice exchange of opinions :-)

          • Johnny Five said on 2nd August 2013, 13:03

            @bascb, @prisoner-monkeys
            Isn’t the better interpretation that Massa is totally allowed to race, but just not allowed to beat Fred?

          • David-A (@david-a) said on 2nd August 2013, 15:22

            @prisoner-monkeys – Well, with Massa, there are clear examples you’ve been given of him not being allowed to compete. That is not the case with Webber.

            And let’s face it, both Webber and Massa do not have the talent to compete with their champion teammates on a regular basis.

        • JCost (@jcost) said on 1st August 2013, 11:56

          @keithcollantine I think after “Multi 21″ both Horner and Dietrich Mateschitz became very assertive on hiring a top driver to pair with Vettel, but I’m afraid they will pick Ricciardo (with all due respect) over Kimi or Fernando because Marko will flip the “Red Bull Academy card” and, somehow, hiring someone outside their development program would be a huge blow to the program itself for failing to produce a “good enough” driver in years.

          • Guilherme (@guilherme) said on 1st August 2013, 18:51

            @jcost I couldn’t disagree more. I don’t buy this “Red Bull Academy relevance” argument one bit. There is not a single reason why Red Bull should pick one of its junior drivers when there are better, more experienced drivers around. If Red Bull still was the midfielder it was in 2008, then fine, I don’t see why they couldn’t take another driver from their programme, but they are F1′s top team now, fighting constantly for both titles. They can’t afford to take the chance with a (with all due respect) slower driver just to validate they driver development programme which, if you ask me, has already served its purpose with Vettel.

          • BasCB (@bascb) said on 2nd August 2013, 10:10

            I get your argument there @jcost – but I think your view is slightly overlooking the role of Mateschitz in all this.

            From what I understand, its Marko pushing promotion of Ricciardo VS. Horner pushing for the best available driver (probably Kimi). But ultimately it will be Mateschitz who decides. And while he certainly rates Makro highly, for Didi its the more important question what he wants to achieve with his team, rather than the driver program. If the program does not achieve what it was meant to, he can bypass it for his team to be successful.
            Lets not forget that Mateschitz had been in the know about Webber leaving/being interested in Porsche since late last year, neither Horner nor Makro figured in their discussions about RB backing Webber in a sportscar bid.

        • Tifoso1989 (@tifoso1989) said on 1st August 2013, 15:32

          No, the last team to hire two drivers who could race each other would be Ferrari. Webber has been a far more competitive team mate to Vettel than Massa has been to Alonso

          @keithcollantine
          you forgot to mention that last year Ferrari made a serious offer to Mark Webber but Red Bull extended his contract after his win in the British GP

          • Mike Dee (@mike-dee) said on 1st August 2013, 21:27

            And the deal did not happen – probably because the contract would have said that he would have been the number 2.

      • iFelix said on 1st August 2013, 8:05

        I am sorry, but your comment is totally wrong and has no basis in reality and can only come from an unjustified hatred and understandable jealousy towards Vettel.

        You forget that Red Bull is a business and Dietrich Matechitz is a business man.
        Why on earth should he value the son of a German (bear in mind that Austrians don’t like Germans anymore than Brits do) carpenter so much? Vettel is only valuable because he could deliver so far. If in order to deliver, they need to literally sabotage his teammate, then he is not worth the money anyway and a new top dog is required.

        Finally, there is no guarantee that Vettel would stay in Red Bull after 2015. Should he win a 4th title this year, and perhaps one in the next 2 years (I doubt the 2014 Red Bull car would be a match for Mercedes and possibly McLaren), he might want a new challenge as Schumacher did. So it makes even less sense to demolish your other driver for someone you are not sure to keep.

        • iFelix said on 1st August 2013, 8:30

          The comment was obviously a response to @prisoner-monkeys!

          • Prisoner Monkeys (@prisoner-monkeys) said on 1st August 2013, 9:03

            Vettel is, and always has been, a Red Bull-backed driver. Mark Webber had not. It’s in the team’s interests to favour Vettel.

          • RAMBOII said on 1st August 2013, 11:03

            Webber had been driving for Red Bull for two years until Vettel came along in the team. He was already a complete Red Bull member by then. If it was in the interest of the team to have Red Bull-drivers, why did they keep him for 7 seasons long?

          • iFelix said on 1st August 2013, 11:42

            @prisoner-monkeys:
            I guess RAMBOII answered you. Vettel was in the Red Bull academy and went to the junior team, but so did Bourdais, Buemi and Alguersuari and they ended up nowhere. Why is so hard for you to accept that Vettel earned his position because he prevailed to deliver where others couldn’t??

            Also, if Red Bull was so protective and biased towards Vettel, why didn’t drop him and go for a more meek No. 2 much earlier, even when Mark’s contract was on a 1 year basis for a while now??

          • Prisoner Monkeys (@prisoner-monkeys) said on 1st August 2013, 22:42

            Because they knew they could control him whilst establishing Vettel as a front-runner.

          • David-A (@david-a) said on 2nd August 2013, 15:24

            @prisoner-monkeys – Control? I think Vettel established himself as a front runner, by winning races so early in his career, and finishing 2009 as runner-up (well ahead of Webber anyway).

      • That’s carrying the rampant fan personiism well past the bounds of good taste.

  9. OmarR-Pepper (@omarr-pepper) said on 1st August 2013, 2:50

    How come that Ricciardo has more races than Vergne. I thought they joined the team the same race.

  10. OmarR-Pepper (@omarr-pepper) said on 1st August 2013, 2:56

    A simple example: if the car is not perfect, you override it and don’t lament. You work with what you’ve got as what you got is probably down to your own mistake – so go out and fight!

    Hear it F1 racers! Tost said it.

  11. Deepak (@thenameisdeepak) said on 1st August 2013, 5:28

    “#F1 Did you know: Alonso was in talks with Red Bull 2008, but wanted to much money. So RB took Vettel 2009. Alonso stayed at Renault. ”

    Is this really true ?

    If so, I don’t blame Alonso. I mean come on. Who would’ve thought a company that makes sugar water would give a good pounding to the cornerstones of a vastly different business.

  12. sumedh said on 1st August 2013, 6:39

    If that Alonso-Red Bull story is true, that makes it at least three bad career decisions from him now:
    1) Going to Mclaren for 2007.
    2) Turning down Red Bull for 2009.
    3) Going to Ferrari for 2010.

    He needs to find a better manager. I believe Briatore was behind most of these decisions, right?

    Briatore also managed Webber if I am not wrong. Not very effective there too. Webber spent most of his prime in midfield cars and when he finally got a fast car, along came Vettel.

    • Todfod (@todfod) said on 1st August 2013, 7:10

      Alonso also turned down a drive with Brawn for the 2009 season if I remember correctly. But you couldn’t blame him for that… Honda were a mess at the end of the 2008 season.

      Its sad.. because Alonso could easily have been a 5 time WDC right now if he had been at Red Bull… and a very likely candidate to beat Schumacher’s record

      • Kimi4WDC said on 1st August 2013, 7:20

        You dreaming mate, he is lucky he got two.

        • Todfod (@todfod) said on 1st August 2013, 8:45

          Yeah .. because Alonso would be able to seal a championship in a championship winning car.

          Heck, he came within a couple of points of winning it in 2010 and 2012 with the 3rd fastest car on the grid. But you’re right… he would have failed miserably with the fastest car on the grid.

          Any logic behind you’re thinking?

          • Optimaximal (@optimaximal) said on 1st August 2013, 9:34

            I think @Kimi4WDC’s username gives away where his misguided logic comes from.

          • JCost (@jcost) said on 1st August 2013, 13:12

            @todfod obviously your logig considers a team of Webber and Alonso because, IMHO, Vettel is good enought to beat him once or twice in the same car.

            Alonso did not beat a rookie Hamilton back in 2007, who knows Seb could not upset him.

          • Tifoso1989 (@tifoso1989) said on 1st August 2013, 15:58

            @jcost
            you did forgot that Alonso was racing Hamilton in McRON team , another thing Vettel has never been as good as Hamilton ask him if you want

          • David-A (@david-a) said on 1st August 2013, 16:12

            @tifoso1989

            Vettel has never been as good as Hamilton ask him if you want

            Hamilton has never been as good as Vettel, ask the team bosses over the last 4 years if you want.

          • Tifoso1989 (@tifoso1989) said on 1st August 2013, 16:28

            @david-a

            ask the team bosses over the last 4 years if you want.

            Which you clearly missed 2 of them

          • David-A (@david-a) said on 1st August 2013, 16:32

            @tifoso1989 – You said “Vettel has never been as good as Hamilton”. Vettel was ranked 1st, 2nd, 1st, 2nd by the team bosses from 2009-2012. Ranked 1st in 2010 and 2012 was Alonso, not Hamilton.

    • BasCB (@bascb) said on 1st August 2013, 7:39

      I don’t think the McLaren move was a bad one persé, it just turned out that way when McLaren felt confident enough in their new double WDC signing to risk giving a rookie a drive and that rookie turned out to have quite the racing spirit!

      By the way, Alonso decided on the McLaren move without telling Briatore up front (who was afterall the team principle of the Renault team at the time). And Webber has mentioned it several times, that Briatore stongly adviced him against first the Williams move as well as against the Jaguar drive

    • iFelix said on 1st August 2013, 11:51

      I don’t think his decision to go Ferrari in 2010 was wrong. That was the best seat available to him and 2010 Ferrari wasn’t too bad. That being said, while my respect for Alonso’s driving skills and strategic approach in race is increase, I never liked him for snapping the 2005 WDC from Kimi (admitted, the main contributor was rather the reliability of Newey’s McLaren). So it gives me a certain pleasure that Kimi is the last Ferrari champion :)

    • Tifoso1989 (@tifoso1989) said on 1st August 2013, 16:02

      Briatore also managed Webber if I am not wrong. Not very effective there too. Webber spent most of his prime in midfield cars and when he finally got a fast car, along came Vettel.

      What do you want Briatore to do if Vettel beat Webber in Red Bull, to drive for him ,this is absolutely ridiculous just like blaming a football coach for a player that missed a penalty

    • JackySteeg (@jackysteeg) said on 1st August 2013, 21:13

      I disagree, there. I don’t think any of those decisions were poor, just unlucky.

      He signed with McLaren shortly after the end of the 2005 season, when they had built the quickest (albeit an unreliable) car. He was unlucky to end up with a competitive teammate in 2007. If he had someone more submissive in a clear #2 position as a teammate (as he had expected), he would almost certainly have won the championship.

      With Red Bull, he turned them down in mid-2008, at which point they were a clear midfield team with only a couple of podium finishes to their name. It was either sign with them or stick with the team with which he had won 2 championships. And yes, Red Bull did already have Newey on board, but he hadn’t built a championship-winning car for a decade. His stock was probably as low as it’s ever been. How could Alonso have possibly predicted the meteoric rise of Red Bull Racing?

      As with his 2010 decision… well, as Tobias’ Tweet says, the chance to be a Red Bull driver had already been and gone. So other than that, I struggle to see how he could’ve found a better place than at Ferrari. With Ferrari he has been the only driver to really challenge Red Bull over the length of a season.

      Hindsight is a wonderful thing but you can’t blame him for not being able to predict the future.

  13. BasCB (@bascb) said on 1st August 2013, 6:59

    Seems Ferrari might be considering using a slightly adapted version of their 2014 engine to enter LeMans again with an LMP1 car, so they can compete with their automotive peers (Porsche, Audi, Toyota, Nissan, …) instead of “a fizzy drinks company”.

    • Keith Collantine (@keithcollantine) said on 1st August 2013, 9:21

      @bascb I’d love to believe that was true. Ferrari back at Le Mans with an LMP1, going up against Audi, Toyota and Porsche, that would be epic.

      • Fisha695 (@fisha695) said on 1st August 2013, 10:36

        I don’t expect VW to keep both Audi & Porsche in LMP1 for much more then next year.

        • That also never made sense to me. Why would Audi even be there next year?

          Back in 2003 when VW were promoting newly acquired Bentley the Audi team had suddenly (and very successfully) become the Bentley team.

      • BasCB (@bascb) said on 1st August 2013, 11:59

        It sure would @keith-collantine, that would really make endurance racing the thing to look at.
        Would be nice to see Mercedes joining in too, although they are probably going to focus on F1 until they at get a championship (or pull out as a full fledged team and go back to supplying engines)

    • Guilherme (@guilherme) said on 1st August 2013, 18:58

      @bascb Although the remark about the “fizzy drinks company” sounds like sour grapes. I mean, if they can’t beat the fizzy drinks company, what business do they even have with Audi, Toyota and Porsche? ;)

      • BasCB (@bascb) said on 2nd August 2013, 6:34

        Good point. But you know its often easier to walk away from solving one thing, when you can go and try something different @guilherme.

        It defenitely is a sour grapes comment, but from Ferrari’s perspective it does make sense. They want to be better than their competitors in the sports car market, and they won’t find most of them to beat in F1. In that sense Red Bull was never a competitor it made sense beating for the Ferrari brand as such (not that it made sense beating a clothing company in Benetton, but I guess thats long ago now :-) )

  14. arki19 said on 1st August 2013, 7:07

    Regarding Brundle and Anderson articles referred to above: Personally, I find the on track overtaking done without the aid of DRS to be so much more memorable and meaningful. When Hamilton got past Webber on the second occasion during the Hungarian GP, I was looking forward to seeing him take on Alonso next – only to see the Ferrari head into the pits for new tyres.
    There seems to be so many rules about how a driver must act when overtaking, not to mention the swiftness of stewards to intervene when a complaint is made, that it must at the very least, play on the driver’s minds. As a spectator, I want to see more on track passes. (Not kamikaze moves obviously but please don’t put them off giving it a red hot go.)

  15. mnmracer (@mnmracer) said on 1st August 2013, 8:32

    Interesting thing to ponder: what would Red Bull have done with Sebastian if they had hired Fernando the year before? Leave him in Torro Rosso for another year, or say goodbye to Mark?

    • Todfod (@todfod) said on 1st August 2013, 13:00

      Yeah definitely an intersting thought. Also have to wonder what effects that would have on the rest of the grid.. In 2009, the top teams could have had a line up looking something like this –

      Red Bull
      Alonso
      Webber

      Mclaren
      Hamilton
      Vettel

      Ferrari
      Raikkonen
      Massa

      Brawn
      Button
      Barrichello

      What a great season that would have been.

    • @mnracer I would think Toro Rosso would’ve retained him for another season and if he kept up the excellent performances then they’d ditch Webber (provided Alonso behaved himself ;) ), so Alonso and Vettel in 2010. That’d be truly epic!

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