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2012 – Team qualifying championship (10 posts)

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raymondu999 said 7 months, 2 weeks ago:

With my qualifying championship stuff fairly well received, I thought it would be interesting viewing to do it for teams – so I’ve done the calculations again, based on the quickest qualifier in each team, for each qualifying. As such for each team, I take the quickest single quali lap, and so there will only be 12 standings here. I do it this way because clearly, if someone is out qualified by their teammate, then they did not unlock the limit of their car.

For example, McLaren got a front row lockout in Australia. That counts as 25. Romain Grosjean gets 15 points for being the next quickest car – and because he didn’t get P2, we assume (Occam’s Razor) that the car wasn’t quick enough to qualify P2 – and take P3 as “the limit” for that car on that weekend. It wouldn’t be fair then to compare Grosjean’s qualifying 15 points against 18 points, because that was a McLaren result.

Australia
McLaren – 25
Lotus – 15
Mercedes – 12
Red Bull – 10
Williams – 4
Force India – 2
Toro Rosso – 1

Malaysia
McLaren – 50
Mercedes – 27
Lotus – 25
Red Bull – 22
Williams – 4
Force India – 2
Ferrari – 2
Toro Rosso – 1
Sauber – 1

China
McLaren – 68
Mercedes – 52
Lotus – 35
Red Bull – 28
Sauber – 13
Williams – 4
Ferrari – 4
Force India – 2
Toro Rosso – 1

Bahrain
McLaren – 86
Mercedes – 62
Red Bull – 53
Lotus – 41
Sauber – 17
Toro Rosso – 9
Ferrari – 6
Williams – 4
Force India – 3

Barcelona
McLaren – 111
Mercedes – 68
Red Bull – 57
Lotus – 53
Sauber – 25
Williams – 22
Ferrari – 21
Toro Rosso – 9
Force India – 3

Monaco
McLaren – 123
Mercedes – 93
Red Bull – 75
Lotus – 63
Ferrari – 29
Sauber – 25
Williams – 24
Toro Rosso – 9
Force India – 3

Canada
McLaren – 141
Mercedes – 103
Red Bull – 100
Lotus – 69
Ferrari – 44
Sauber – 25
Williams – 24
Toro Rosso – 9
Force India – 7

Valencia
McLaren – 159
Red Bull – 125
Mercedes – 111
Lotus – 81
Ferrari – 44
Williams – 39
Sauber – 31
Force India – 11
Toro Rosso – 9

Silverstone
McLaren – 163
Red Bull – 143
Mercedes – 126
Lotus – 89
Ferrari – 69
Williams – 45
Sauber – 31
Force India – 13
Toro Rosso – 9

Germany
McLaren – 169
Red Bull – 161
Mercedes – 138
Ferrari – 94
Lotus – 90
Williams – 53
Sauber – 31
Force India – 23
Toro Rosso – 9

Hungary
McLaren – 194
Red Bull – 176
Mercedes – 138
Lotus – 108
Ferrari – 102
Williams – 57
Sauber – 31
Force India – 24
Toro Rosso – 9

Spa
McLaren – 219
Red Bull – 182
Mercedes – 138
Lotus – 120
Ferrari – 110
Williams – 72
Sauber – 49
Force India – 25
Toro Rosso – 9

Monza
McLaren – 244
Red Bull – 190
Mercedes – 148
Ferrari – 125
Lotus – 124
Williams – 72
Sauber – 51
Force India – 37
Toro Rosso – 9

Singapore
McLaren – 269
Red Bull – 205
Mercedes – 150
Ferrari – 135
Lotus – 128
Williams – 90
Sauber – 51
Force India – 45
Toro Rosso – 9

Japan
McLaren – 284
Red Bull – 230
Mercedes – 150
Ferrari – 141
Lotus – 138
Williams – 90
Sauber – 63
Force India – 46
Toro Rosso – 9

Korea
McLaren – 299
Red Bull – 255
Ferrari – 153
Mercedes – 152
Lotus – 148
Williams – 90
Sauber – 63
Force India – 50
Toro Rosso – 9

India
McLaren – 314
Red Bull – 290
Ferrari – 163
Lotus – 154
Mercedes – 153
Williams – 92
Sauber – 67
Force India – 50
Toro Rosso – 9

Abu Dhabi
McLaren – 339
Red Bull – 308
Ferrari – 169
Lotus – 164
Mercedes – 157
Williams – 104
Sauber – 67
Force India – 50
Toro Rosso – 9

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raymondu999 said 7 months, 2 weeks ago:

Obviously the primary use of this would be comparing how each driver in each team has fared, compared to the better qualifier for each weekend. As such, as of Abu Dhabi, teams are:
McLaren – 339
Red Bull – 308
Ferrari – 169
Lotus – 164
Mercedes – 157
Williams – 104
Sauber – 67
Force India – 50
Toro Rosso – 9

Drivers:
Hamilton – 303
Vettel – 237
Webber – 197
Button – 167
Alonso – 155
Schumacher – 111
Grosjean – 110
Raikkonen – 109 Maldonado – 104
Rosberg – 98
Massa – 63
Kobayashi – 51
Perez – 39
di Resta – 28
Hulkenberg – 24 Ricciardo – 9
Senna – 3
Vergne – 0

So now, we move on to calculate how each driver has done, as a percentage of their team.

Hamilton – 303 (McLaren 339) –
Vettel – 237 (Red Bull 308)
Webber – 197 (Red Bull 308)
Button – 167 (McLaren 339)
Alonso – 155 (Ferrari 169)
Schumacher – 111 (Mercedes 157)
Grosjean – 110 (Lotus 164)
Raikkonen – 109 (Lotus 164) Maldonado – 104 (Williams 104)
Rosberg – 98 (Mercedes 157)
Massa – 63 (Ferrari 169)
Kobayashi – 51 (Sauber 67)
Perez – 39 (Sauber 67)
di Resta – 28 (Force India 50)
Hulkenberg – 24 (Force India 50) Ricciardo – 9 (Toro Rosso 9)
Senna – 3 (Williams 104)
Vergne – 0 (Toro Rosso 9)

And based on these – we get the following:
Hamilton – 89.4%
Vettel – 76.9%
Webber – 64.0%
Button – 49.3%
Alonso – 91.7%
Schumacher – 70.7%
Grosjean – 67.1%
Raikkonen – 66.5% Maldonado – 100% (!!!)
Rosberg – 62.4%
Massa – 37.3%
Kobayashi – 76.1%
Perez – 58.2%
di Resta – 56.0%
Hulkenberg – 48.0% Ricciardo – 100%
Senna – 2.9%
Vergne – 0%

Sorted by highest to lowest: Maldonado – 100% (!!!) Ricciardo – 100% (!!!)
Alonso – 91.7%
Hamilton – 89.4%
Vettel – 76.9%
Kobayashi – 76.1%
Schumacher – 70.7%
Grosjean – 67.1%
Raikkonen – 66.5%
Webber – 64.0%
Rosberg – 62.4%
Perez – 58.2%
di Resta – 56.0%
Button – 49.3%
Hulkenberg – 48.0%
Massa – 37.3%
Senna – 2.9%
Vergne – 0%

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raymondu999 said 7 months, 2 weeks ago:

The higher the score, the better the qualifier. In theory.

Of course, we have to take into account that some drivers have teammates who haven’t been very good qualifiers in 2012 (Ricciardo, Alonso and Maldonado come to mind) and this will inflate their scores.

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Bob said 7 months, 2 weeks ago:

Just goes to show how far McLaren have squandered their advantage in qualifying with errors and mechanical failures on Sunday, and how Ferrari have capitalized on their strong race pace to make up for their poor Saturday form.

Team – Qualifying Points – Actual Points – Points Difference
McLaren – 339 – 318 – -21
Ferrari – 169 – 340 – +171

That McLaren is topping the qualifying standings, yet slipping in the actual WCC, is galling.

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raymondu999 said 7 months, 2 weeks ago:

@bobthevulcan that’s not how this works – it only takes 1 car from each qualifying hour – the fastest car of each team. If you wanted qualifying standings, they’re here

McLaren is dominant at 470 points. Ferrari at 218.

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Bob said 7 months, 2 weeks ago:

@raymondu999 – Ah, I see, apologies.

In which case, Hamilton, Alonso and Ricciardo (not entirely surprised – Vergne has always been caught out in Q1) seem to be doing the lion’s share of the qualifying work at their respective teams.

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raymondu999 said 7 months, 2 weeks ago:

Yep. Basically, if we assume that in every qualifying session, at least one car achieves “the limit” – ie the maximum quali lap, then this is a percentage of how close they generally get to it.

Doing it via quali times (rather than doing it via qualifying points as such) is probably better methodology – but then again it needs someone who has even more free time :P

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the_sigman said 7 months, 2 weeks ago:

@raymondu999 Thank you. Brilliant job once again.

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raymondu999 said 7 months, 2 weeks ago:

@sigman1998 why thank you. Always nice to be appreciated :)

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raymondu999 said 7 months, 2 weeks ago:

To be honest – I WOULD do a lap time analysis if I could, but there are too many questions in terms of methodology.

For example, which time should I get? Q1? Q2? Q3?
Say Driver A and Driver B are teammates. One gets to Q2, one gets to Q3. Which time do I take then?
Track evolution could make a car slower into Q3, so it’s not quite as simple as just getting the last qualifying time. For example in China a lot of cars went slower in Q3, than their Q2 laptimes.
Q2 also could be a case of “pushing just enough to get through to Q3″ – in which case it wouldn’t be a good reflection of the limit. Then your teammate who’s more in trouble could be pushing there while you’re not.

Ferrari in Monaco presents a good example of this conundrum. Note that Alonso ultimately ends up outqualifying Massa

Massa Q2 Monaco – 1:14.911
Massa Q3 Monaco – 1:15.049 (slower than Q2)
Alonso Q2 Monaco – 1:15.128
Alonso Q3 Monaco – 1:14.948 (faster than Q2)

So in that case, were the Q3 track conditions faster or slower for Ferrari? Ultimately Massa did the quickest qualifying lap – but was Alonso pushing in Q2?

Methodology is very difficult in that sense.

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