BBC’s Top 20 F1 drivers ever (list) (365 posts)

Topic tags: F1
  • Profile picture of raymondu999 raymondu999 said 10 months, 3 weeks ago:

    How do you mean “the” three current WDCs? There are 6… and 1 of them is already on the list.

    Being a Villeneuve Sr. fan, I think 12th is too low to be honest…

  • Profile picture of CarnivorousPope CarnivorousPope said 10 months, 3 weeks ago:

    The three being the others on the list I presume. Also if you think 12th is too low maybe it is on driver ability but this list doesn’t really seem to be rated solely to ability but also number of wins and titles as well as whatever else Murray sees fit at the time.

  • Profile picture of Bullfrog Bullfrog said 10 months, 3 weeks ago:

    Good to see talent and charisma, and not just statistics, getting a driver well into the top 20.

    I liked the quote from Prost:

    “the last great driver – the rest of us are a bunch of good professionals”

    Hadn’t seen that one before. I guess he said it before Senna came along, and he’d be the only other “great” I’d add – today’s lot are all “good professionals” for me.

  • Profile picture of Kingshark Kingshark said 10 months, 3 weeks ago:

    #12 is Gilles Villeneuve

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/18690210

    Very interesting choice. I’ve always wondered what supposedly set Gilles apart from all other drivers with minor success. Was he really that good? I’ve never seen him race, but for a driver with 6 GP wins he’s rated damn highly.

  • Profile picture of Marvel Man Marvel Man said 10 months, 3 weeks ago:

    For the remainder of the list, this would be a viable choice, IMO.

    11 Ronnie Peterson
    10 Fernando Alonso
    09 Ayrton Senna
    08 Niki Lauda
    07 Jackie Stewart
    06 Stirling Moss
    05 Alberto Ascari
    04 Michael Schumacher
    03 Alain Prost
    02 Jim Clark
    01 Juan Manuel Fangio

  • Profile picture of mnmracer mnmracer said 10 months, 3 weeks ago:

    @Marvel Man
    Either Kimi Räikkönen, Jenson Button or Sebastian Vettel are still included on the list, as “4 of the current WDCs are in the top 20″, and we’ve only had Lewis thus far.

    I’m gonna go out on a limb here and predict:

    11 Ronnie Peterson
    10 Niki Lauda
    09 Jackie Stewart
    08 Juan-Manuel Fangio
    07 Fernando Alonso
    06 Sebastian Vettel
    05 Alain Prost
    04 Alberto Ascari
    03 Ayrton Senna
    02 Michael Schumacher
    01 Jim Clark

  • Profile picture of Marvel Man Marvel Man said 10 months, 3 weeks ago:

    @mmracer

    vettel in, fangio out? no way
    vettel is vastly overrated, he doesn’t belong in the top 10

  • Profile picture of S.J.M S.J.M said 10 months, 3 weeks ago:

    @Kingshark all those questions, and more, about Gille Villeneuve are answered by the excellent biography done by Gerald Donaldson. Sadly Gilles died 2 years before I was born and know only of him from books, videos and what other people say. But his talent is summed up nicely by Harvey Postlethwaite post ’81 when he talked about Gilles and the Ferrari 126C.

    “That car…had literally one quarter of the downforce that, say Williams or Brabham had. It had a power advantage over the Cosworths for sure, but it also had massive throttle lag at that time. In terms of sheer ability I think Gilles was on a different plane to the other drivers. To win those races, the 1981 GPs at Monaco and Jarama — on tight circuits — was quite out of this world. I know how bad that car was.”

    His place on the list doesnt bear thinking about, its an automatic and empthatic yes from me. What he could have done in F1 had he not be killed is to my mind, one of the big “what if” questions of the sport. Immensely popular, phenomenally quick and exciting. A (film) quote that comes to mind on him is “The light that burns twice as bright burns for half as long”.

    Regarding the next 11, I doubt Peterson will be in it now and I say that only because Villeneuve has come in at #12, so I cant see Ronnie being there. I would like to think the names Lauda, Surtees, Alonso , Ascari, Moss, Prost, Stewart ,Fangio ,Senna, Schumacher, Clark are the top 11. Probably in/around that order (although top 3 could be anyones guess).

  • Profile picture of mnmracer mnmracer said 10 months, 3 weeks ago:

    @Marvel Man
    First of, you fail to address the fact the Vettel (or Button or Räikkönen) WILL be on the list, per BBC’s own citation.
    Second, I submitted too early and forgot to put Fangio back.

    What’s the difference between Fangio and Vettel in your view then?
    Both won almost everything from the front in fast cars.

  • Profile picture of Marvel Man Marvel Man said 10 months, 3 weeks ago:

    @mmracer

    i do not rate vettele high, cuz in 2010 he bareley managed to win world championship edging his teammate (webber, an average driver) only in the last race. you have alos to take into account that vettel was clearly (and still his) horner darling… and yet, webber was on the verge to outscore him! How can we rate vettel as one of the greatest ever?

  • Profile picture of ME4ME ME4ME said 10 months, 3 weeks ago:

    You did notice the fact that his car broke down at least a couple of times which lost him a great amount of points in 2010? Besides, he was very young, still got lots to learn .. something that he already improved upon greatly on in 2011.

  • Profile picture of Dizzy-A Dizzy-A said 10 months, 3 weeks ago:

    @mnmracer , @plautus Why is everyone assuming Ronnie Peterson is on the list? Have I missed something?

    i do not rate vettele high, cuz in 2010 he bareley managed to win world championship edging his teammate (webber, an average driver) only in the last race. you have alos to take into account that vettel was clearly (and still his) horner darling… and yet, webber was on the verge to outscore him! How can we rate vettel as one of the greatest ever?

    Not a good justification at all, given that Vettel lost the most points due to mechanical failures: http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/groups/f1/forum/topic/alternative-history-the-2010-championship-without-misfortune/

  • Profile picture of S.J.M S.J.M said 10 months, 3 weeks ago:

    @David-A
    Because Ronnie Peterson, like Gilles Villeneuve and Stirling Moss, is a driver whose stats and accomplishments in the sport go nowhere near justifying how good a driver he was. Even Mario Andretti has said that Peterson was quick and had it not been for team orders, would have passed him for wins on occasions. Id swap him into the list over Hamilton and/or Vettel each and everytime however.

  • Profile picture of Dizzy-A Dizzy-A said 10 months, 3 weeks ago:

    @sjm – I understand that (though I do not agree, especially with being ahead of Gilles and many multiple champions like G. Hill, Brabham and Piquet already having been listed), but I don’t remember him being shown in any of the preview clips at the beginning of the videos, and he didn’t seem to be mentioned at all as being on the list before this page. That’s why I thought I had missed something.

  • Profile picture of S.J.M S.J.M said 10 months, 3 weeks ago:

    Thats very true @David-A If the list was a top 25 drivers, then he warrents a mention. Top20 is a push, and some drivers have to be cut. Not sure its only now people are mentioning him for the list, perhaps its a case of the more names are mentioned, the fewer guesses we need to make for the remaining spots. ;)

    And I wouldnt have him infront of Villeneuve either, just behind perhaps but its not our list is it :(

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