Can Hamilton beat Vettel on Top Gear?
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16th February 2013, 12:28 at 12:28 pm #225224
I work at a kart track, and I know that small changes even in humidity and temperature can drastically affect a cars performance.
The only way to be sure who is quicker would be to get them both at the TG track at the same time, and get them to drive 2 indentical karts; they can agree on which engines they would use, etc…
Anyway, Button showed that when a track is greasy, the car doesn’t exactly lose a lot of performance; the difference between his 2 laps at TG; one in damp conditions and one in dry conditions was only 0.2 seconds.16th February 2013, 14:44 at 2:44 pm #225225
Exactly: Hamilton’s lap was undoubtably highly impressive but the four seconds quoted that a wet track loses you doesn’t apply, especially with F1 drivers. I actually believe the conditions were exaggerated with Hamilton’s lap so people who are expecting him to be a second faster should prepare themselves to be disappointed…16th February 2013, 15:34 at 3:34 pm #225226
You can’t compare lap times done on different day, month of the year etc. Track conditions will be different, surface will have different level of grip. Even the engine might be a bit stronger thanks to cold air. There is no way Hamilton took more than 1sec just cause of skill. Sure, he is only of the very very fastest drivers in F1, but so is Vettel.16th February 2013, 15:52 at 3:52 pm #225227
The track when Hamilton set his first lap wasn’t even fully wet; it was damp at most.16th February 2013, 17:05 at 5:05 pm #225228
@xjr15jaaag – exactly. I do feel that his lap was blown out of proportion for the sake of public appeal. As I have said though undoubtably it was a good lap, but it hardly equates to what some people are claiming is a 1 second advantage in the dry.
I doubt those claims are actually true and I am reserving any judgement on times until I’ve actually seen the genuine lap on Top Gear tomorrow: as far as I’m concerned Hamilton is equally as likely to have beaten Vettel as Vettel has Hamilton at this stage so the debate continues!16th February 2013, 17:23 at 5:23 pm #225229
the reasonably priced car is about as close to an F1 car as a musket is to a 50 cal. sniper rifle. Just because one may be better in the reasonably priced car doesn’t mean they’ll automatically be better in an F1 car
Max, although I agree with you that the Liana is in no way a comparison to an F1 car, you still have to understand that in a reasonably priced car, the driver would make the difference. Both drivers have to shift the gears, both drivers have to perform, etc. So basically what I mean is that, this is the closest we will ever get to seeing Hamilton and Vettel performing in a “same” car. That is all I´m saying and according to the spoilers posted on page 1, it seems that Hamilton in fact did beat Vettel. By how much, I have no idea… I´ll be happy with even 3 or 4 tenths… it just goes to show what a difference a RBR car makes… Simple as that. Sure track conditions might vary just a bit but it shouldn´t make that big of difference.
With regards to the car, well, I believe they maintain them fairly well and must give everybody new tyres. Clarkson is really a petrol head and would not give somebody an edge for the sake of entertainment… he might do that with celebrities, I doubt he would do that with F1 drivers, because he, I feel, really wants to know who is faster than the next guy…
Well sir… you might think it was something valid to say and others including myself read into you claim as excuses… Sort of like what happens when I try to say something valid and you and a fellow friend of yours gang up on me… and I don´t mean Max. The truth of the matter is that the spoiler pic shows Hamilton winning the lap, by how much, I don´t know but like I said before, even if it´s 2, 3, 4 tenths or even a second… I will enjoy this just for the sake of Hamilton seting things straight… Of course the Liana is no F1 car…. but then the driver is the one that really matters because he is the one shifting the gears, etc… And in my country we have a saying: “That who is a rooster will, sing in any henhouse…” Translation…. if one is quick in an F1 car, he could be quick in any car regardless…16th February 2013, 17:55 at 5:55 pm #225230
On the spoiler pic, it looks like he did a 43.916th February 2013, 18:02 at 6:02 pm #225231
@catracho504 What do you think I’m making excuses for? And I really don’t know what you’re talking about regarding me and my ‘friends’ ganging up on you, so can you either explain it in a private message or drop it?16th February 2013, 18:02 at 6:02 pm #225232
I haven’t looked at any of the spolier’s and I wouldn’t be certain that they are representative of what actually happened, that’s all I’m saying!16th February 2013, 19:16 at 7:16 pm #225233
This realistically is the only time we get to see F1 drivers in equal machinary, yes the conditions for Hamilton and Vettel are not going to be identical, but hey they are driving a reasonably priced car, not a cutting edge high tech f1 car that is sensitive to the smallest of changes in air temp, tyre pressures etc. Its annoying seeing these excuses justifying why Hamilton has possibly lapped quiker before the show has been aired, one of the spoiers is a guy claiming Hamilton smashed Vettel by more than a second (not very believable), the other is a picture with Hamilton standing next to the timing board, its an unclear picture and you can’t be sure its Hamiltons name at the top. Tommorow we’ll find out find out for sure (you’re not an f1 fan enthusiast unless you use this phrase) who is quicker given the same machinary. Weather its Hamilton or not, one thing is for sure (done it again), these two are undoubtedly the quickers over a single lap currently in F1.16th February 2013, 20:52 at 8:52 pm #225234
Its sad that the anti-Vettel brigade diminishes Hamilton’s talent so much by acting like this is the thing that shows his talent. It’s a fun thing, no more, no less. Otherwise, I would be very interested in hearing the explanation of how, if Hamilton being 0.1/1.1 seconds faster is indicative, how come that Hamilton’s hardly ever been 0.8s faster than Button in the same car.
Let’s just wait and see and enjoy the show tomorrow!16th February 2013, 21:14 at 9:14 pm #225235
Do they air the show in the US?17th February 2013, 1:49 at 1:49 am #225236
It´s even sadder that the RBR/Vettel bandwagon are making up excuses talking about track conditions, clutch, tyres, etc…. Why is it so hard to accept that Lewis is faster than Vettel?? This is as close as we are going to get to see them driving equal machinery… and like @mclaren said, these aren´t F1 cars that are sensitive to the smallest of changes in air temp, tyre pressures; they weren´t designed by Newey for Christ´s sake! These are real life cars that you or I could drive… And the comical thing about this is that the RBR/VETTEL bandwagon are already trying to play this down by saying that “It’s a fun thing, no more, no less.” … News flash: ANYTHING having to do with any driver, may it be a Kart driver or an F1 driver is a competition… You consciously set out to the track to beat a set lap… Fun… yeah right… that´s what a loser would say if he got beat fair and square. If you think otherwise, you must be a mediocre competitor… If you don´t aim for the top, get out!
Otherwise, I would be very interested in hearing the explanation of how, if Hamilton being 0.1/1.1 seconds faster is indicative, how come that Hamilton’s hardly ever been 0.8s faster than Button in the same car.
It´s for the same reason that Webber´s performance seemed to “drop” after he signed his contract…17th February 2013, 2:18 at 2:18 am #225237
@freelittlebirds – I believe they show it on BBC America. If that’s not available/applicable, it shouldn’t be long before the interview segment is uploaded online. The official Top Gear YouTube channel has lots of content from the show as well.17th February 2013, 7:35 at 7:35 am #225238
This is as close as we are going to get to see them driving equal machinery
Yes but that equipment is a Liana. It could just as well have been a shopping trolley. It would be equally far from driving an F1 car.
I think you are reading far too much into the laptimes in a Liana, one done several months after the other. Its a bit of fun. That’s it. The drivers might do as well as they can on that day, but the conditions can be very, very different from one day to the other. So it won’t truly show how much better or worse they are compared to each other in a Liana.
How good they are in an F1 car will be shown IN the F1 car. Not in a Liana. No matter how much both vehicles have four wheels, its just not comparable.
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