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F1

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F1 discussion

Dangerous and Non-Raceable tracks

This topic contains 14 replies, has 13 voices, and was last updated by Avatar of Keith Collantine Keith Collantine 2 years, 10 months ago.

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 15 total)
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  • #130041
    Avatar of Oli Peacock
    Oli Peacock
    Participant

    The title may be a little misleading, but what i mean by that is that can you think of any modern day race track that was too tight or narrow etc to race on

    To get the ball rolling here is one: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beijing_International_Streetcircuit

    For the inaugeral race at the Beijing street track, a new corner had to be devised overnight because the serise that was racing there (A1GP) was not able to get round a hairpin because it was too tight, once they added another, wider hairpin before the previous hairpin,the cars had to avoid the pit lane entry wall. Also there was loose drain cover and advertising boards, yet the race still went on!!

    #177933
    Avatar of George
    George
    Participant

    Are we talking for F1 cars or just in general? Pau and Macau both have very tight hairpins and limited runoff, although series like F3 still race there.

    I’m not sure what the last F1 track to be dropped due to safety issues was actually, Imola perhaps? I cant remember whether Hockenheim was neutered due to safety or just someone being criminally insane either.

    #177934
    Avatar of Tom L.
    Tom L.
    Participant

    I’m going to be a bit controversial to get some discussion going… Monaco.

    It’s generally accepted that the circuit is not wide enough compared to modern track safety standards.

    Access to and removal of cars varies between different parts of the circuit, raising questions on driver and marshal safety. The fact that DRS was banned in the tunnel this year could be interpreted as acceptance that if an accident were to happen in this part of the circuit, the safety standards would not be adequate.

    The tunnel has not only poor visibility but can cause cars to lose 20-30% of downforce.

    There are bumps, for example the one on the left after Casino Square that the drivers have to actively avoid, that wouldn’t be allowed to remain on a more modern circuit.

    Some teams have to adjust their cars’ steering lock especially for Monaco, to enable the drivers to negotiate corners like the Fairmont (/Loews/whatever you want to call it!) Hairpin and to a lesser extent Rascasse.

    The accidents suffered by Perez and Petrov in this year’s race showed that even with the safety of modern F1 cars, drivers who suffer accidents have a higher risk of injury than at the majority of other venues.

    I’m not sure what the elevation change is and how that compares to the FIA regulations, although it always struck me as being among the greatest – does anyone have any information on that?

    If Monaco were to be proposed as a new venue, it would be not be judged suitable for modern F1. Is its “rich heritage” a good enough reason to overlook this fact and perhaps put safety at risk?

    #177935
    Avatar of Keith Collantine
    Keith Collantine
    Keymaster

    I caught some footage of the Lithuania 1000km race on Motors TV the other day.

    I don’t know who sanctioned it but the track did not look very safe. The cars were blasting around a dual carriageway and pulling into a petrol station for refuelling stops!

    Here’s some amateur video from what looks like one of the support races:

    http://youtu.be/oEnhQ9q2NU0

    #177936
    Avatar of Ratboy
    Ratboy
    Keymaster

    Thanks for that Keith, best racing video I’ve seen on there

    in terms of dangerous tracks I’ll say the Isle of Man track, theres always fatals there. im not saying its a bad track or they shouldnt go there. I love the track. its just a dangerous one.

    Un raceable I’d say Valencia. it should be banned and forever removed ;)

    #177937
    Avatar of Icthyes
    Icthyes
    Participant

    At 1:18 in that video you can see someone with something that says “acme”, says it all really!

    I’m going to agree with Monaco (the gradient of the run down to the chicane is just one concern) and also the Manx TT course.

    #177938
    Avatar of Ned Flanders
    Ned Flanders
    Participant

    I’ve always wondered what MotoGP would be like racing on street circuits like Monaco. Obviously Monaco is way too dangerous for modern bike racing so we’ll never know, but I imagine it would be a fantastic spectacle

    #177939
    Avatar of Zazeems
    Zazeems
    Participant

    Oh I don’t know Ned, they race superbikes round Macau, and it’s an absolutely electrifying (and nail-biting) spectacle.

    #177940
    Avatar of 91jb12
    91jb12
    Participant

    Keith that race is the Omnitel 1000km race in Palanga, Lithuania. I have the track on a pc game and it literally is one half of a motorway with a tyre chicane, a hairpin onto the other set of lanes then another tyre chicane into an uphill slip road with a sharp left onto the road (which that sliproad leaves) and then a 270 degree right down a sliproad under the bridge and then a chicane onto the start /finish lane of the motorway.

    it is chaos and the pitlane is ridiculous

    #177941
    Avatar of Ratboy
    Ratboy
    Keymaster

    @91jb12 so in Lithuania for a motor race they shut a motorway? That is fantastic dedication to motorsport :D

    #177942
    Avatar of smifaye
    smifaye
    Participant

    Yeah I saw that race on Motors TV also and thelack of safety was really really shocking. It was funny listening to the commentators as they had absolutely no idea about the race but that it was the 12th race that had been held. It was funny to see the cars down the motorway.

    #177943
    Avatar of Prisoner Monkeys
    Prisoner Monkeys
    Participant

    For the inaugeral race at the Beijing street track, a new corner had to be devised overnight because the serise that was racing there (A1GP) was not able to get round a hairpin because it was too tight

    See also the Beijing International Street Circuit (wow, the Chinese are not very imaginitive when it comes to naming things):

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beijing_International_Street_Circuit

    Stupid Football Thing raced there last year, but because a stretch of circuit across the back of the track was too narrow, the circuit was downgraded at the last minute and was considered a “national” event, which meant it became a non-championship round. The officials even considered permanent yellow flags at the section in question so that it could be a points-scoring race, but the FIA said no.

    #177944
    Avatar of Juan Pablo Heidfeld
    Juan Pablo Heidfeld
    Participant

    How do you find that kind of thing Keith? :P

    #177945
    Avatar of chcs82
    chcs82
    Participant

    watching the spa 98 race on the red button a couple of weeks ago…..you realise how far safety has come on at spa. at that point, parts of the track were still closed public roads with little to no run off.

    Now of course run off areas like pouhon have been de gravel trapped but i still think the fences aren’t high enough. IF (AND ITS A BIG IF) webber and alonso had made contact in the compression of eau rough, the positioning of the fences in front of the stands overlooking this immense corner would have made it difficult to contain the debris from the crowd.

    I know this will bring up the age old ‘motor racing is dangerous….it says so on the ticket’ argument but should there not be an FIA fund for sorting these issues out, with all the technology available we should be looking at improving these issues.

    motor sport has been lucky recently with a number of accidents on what the FIA deem safe circuits but we can never get complacent in terms of safety. apologises for the length of this post but raised a few issues in my mind…..but back to point did anyone else see the safety truck heading towards graham rahal on the exit on turn 1 at baltimore…..MOMENTS from disaster. Street circuits represent the most dangerous circuit, but the new ones (mainly f1) are being designed in a way to use runoff where possible. i think i got out what i wanted to say but apologises if i rambled on a bit

    #177946
    Avatar of Keith Collantine
    Keith Collantine
    Keymaster

    How do you find that kind of thing Keith?

    The wonders of Motors TV!

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