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F1 discussion

Lotus Renault vs Team Lotus

This topic contains 40 replies, has 27 voices, and was last updated by Avatar of Icthyes Icthyes 3 years, 6 months ago.

Viewing 15 posts - 16 through 30 (of 41 total)
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  • #159130
    Avatar of Aetost
    Aetost
    Participant

    Exactly what is real? It surely isn’t defined by neither a name nor a paintjob. Chapman’s Team Lotus was famous for certain reasons, with the biggest being their on-track successes, of course! It was the ground breaking ideas, the excellent conceptual engineering, the lightweight (and flimsy!) cars and the high death toll… You may forget it was one of the teams that showed how F1 racing is done, setting the trends everyone followed.

    Unless any of the two “new” Lotuses achieves that (while keeping their drivers safe & sound!), they have NO right to claim Chapman’s legacy. They are -at best- dubious marketing exercises.

    #159131
    Avatar of Cyclops_PL
    Cyclops_PL
    Participant

    I tend to put myself against Team Lotus and not for Lotus Renault. The former is just a tremendous PR stunt which lead many fans to the brink of madness and pure hatred towards the other party. The latter would be well off without the Lotus sticker and I accept it just because it means more money for creating a winning car for Kubica. As for the whole “who’s real” thing I still say: neither, but Fernandes is more cynical and misleading. He reminds me a populist politician who’s just playing on emotions, not facts, in order to complete his purely material goals.

    #159132
    Avatar of
    Anonymous

    What Scribe said.

    #159133
    Avatar of Ned Flanders
    Ned Flanders
    Participant

    I’d like to support “Team Lotus” as they are a small team and I always support the underdog, but the longer this naming controversy has dragged on the more ambivalent I have become. So, it’s a ‘meh’ from me too

    #159134
    Avatar of Prisoner Monkeys
    Prisoner Monkeys
    Participant

    I support Lotus Renault GP for two reasons:

    First of all, they come with the backing of Lotus Cars, a respected sportscar manufacturer, at a time when Formula 1 is desperately short of marques. Between the full departure of Honda, BMW and Toyota and with Renault stepping back to an engine supplier role, Formula 1 has just two established manufacturers competing: Mercedes and Ferrari. While the grid also has McLaren and Marussia, they are both in theur infancy as car makers. Lotus Cars establishes more credibility on the grid.

    Secondly, Lotus Renault have been completely civil in the way they have conducted themselves. Compare this from Gerard Lopez – http://adamcooperf1.com/2011/01/31/lopez-team-lotus-fight-is-about-fom-money/ – to the following from Team Lotus – http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/89154 – and you’ll see that while Lotus Renault clearly want an amicable resolution to the dispute, almost everythig Team Lotus says or does is a declaration of war.

    #159135
    Avatar of Ned Flanders
    Ned Flanders
    Participant

    But it’s hard to see Lotus as a manufacturer when their sole link to the team is their name on the rear wing. If, in 5 years time, they’re fully fledged team owners and maybe even producing their own engines, then I’d see them as a proper manufacturer

    #159136
    Avatar of Ned Flanders
    Ned Flanders
    Participant

    A quick tally:

    10 don’t seem to care

    5 support “Team Lotus”

    2 support “Lotus Renault”

    #159137
    Avatar of Icthyes
    Icthyes
    Participant

    Is PM…being sarcastic?

    #159138
    Avatar of Prisoner Monkeys
    Prisoner Monkeys
    Participant

    No, I’m not.

    #159139
    Avatar of Hare
    Hare
    Participant

    *shakes head* People keep quoting this comment from Mike Gascoyne as arrogant, disrespectful, blah blah. Rubbish. Autosport took one word, made it a headline, and there you have it. In my eyes, MG said nothing more than the truth about the matter. I can imagine any number of teams saying the same thing. This is RACING! It’s all about determination.

    If his team finishes above another established team it would be embarrassing for them, good for Lotus. So lets all grow up and stop making mountains ouf molehills, it’s making me wince.

    The Lotus car company had then been sold off to General Motors and Team Lotus had been offloaded to employees Peters Collins and Wright for $6 million. They are two separate entities started by the same chap(man).

    As far as I’m concerned, let them race as they are. I don’t care, I want both to do well. The company names both have ‘genuine’ legacy legally, so whats the problem? It’s not like Chapman was squeaky clean, he was full of dubious deals like the Delorean fiasco. He’d be having a laugh right now I’m sure, especially as he died before he spent 10 years in jail.

    Group Lotus want to be all self-righteous, that’s up to them. They don’t own the Team Lotus brand, they never have and sounds like they never will. Not my problem. I want both to do well, but now I know the history of the whole sordid affair a bit better, suits me fine that they both stay as they are, cos I understand it, and in a way, I’m a bit nostalgic about it.

    #159140
    Avatar of Hare
    Hare
    Participant

    you’ll see that while Lotus Renault clearly want an amicable resolution to the dispute, almost everythig Team Lotus says or does is a declaration of war.

    Any kid getting bullied by a giant in the playground is gonna be squealing loudly. I would if I were them. Yeah I don’t like some of the things they said either, but someone’s come along (Bahar) and spoilt their good spirited party, without much recourse to a conversation by the sound of somethings. Seriously, a t-shirt started the branding argument? Naah. The desire was there to start with, that just was the straw the broke the bubble.

    FYI : I don’t particularly favour one over the other, I like both.

    #159141
    Avatar of Eggry
    Eggry
    Participant

    I has supported Team Lotus(Lotus Racing last year) and also like Renault F1 Team too. in terms of former one, Tony Fernandes and Mike Gascoyne have done jobs with all passion and the latter, I like team itself(except Flavio). I think Lotus Renault GP would outpace Team Lotus this year but I don’t like their name because it’s just marketing scheme of Group Lotus and cover story of pullout of Renault.

    #159142
    Avatar of Prisoner Monkeys
    Prisoner Monkeys
    Participant

    Yeah I don’t like some of the things they said either, but someone’s come along (Bahar) and spoilt their good spirited party, without much recourse to a conversation by the sound of somethings. Seriously, a t-shirt started the branding argument?

    Looking back over some of the stuff that has been said, it’s obvious Lotus Cars didn’t simply jump into Formula 1 and try to steal the name away because Team Lotus was already there.

    #159143
    Avatar of Hare
    Hare
    Participant

    Looking back over some of the stuff that has been said, it’s obvious Lotus Cars didn’t simply jump into Formula 1 and try to steal the name away because Team Lotus was already there.

    I think Bahar and co, wanted control of the brand, with someone who potentially wasn’t going to try and buy the Lotus Group. He would have been a management competitor… We can probably guess that TF and DB haven’t seen eye to eye for some time.

    #159144
    Avatar of Klon
    Klon
    Participant

    Well, I for my part really have stopped caring. And it’s not like being on either side does really matter, since it is pretty obvious that the courts will change nothing at all with only the possibility that “Team Lotus” must always use the full name and Renault has to use “Group Lotus”, i.e. the full name of the car producing company Lotus. So until the FIA says anything about this matter we won’t see an end of it anyhow. But if you’d really held me at gunpoint and say I would have to choose, I would go with Team Lotus. Firstly because they seem to be a bit more sympathic and because my opinion about manufacturers is the subversion of PM’s, namely the less manufacturers, the better.

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