Modern F1 at Hermanos Rodriguez
25th February 2013, 18:45 at 6:45 pm #132744
After reading the recent article about Bernie’s views regarding a potential Mexican Grand Prix in 2014, I took the liberty of firing up rFactor and taking a Renault R26 around the Hermanos Rodriguez circuit. I put this under F1, but I’m not quite sure which group this belongs in.
My choice of car was simply because CTDP F1 2006 is regarded as the best F1 mod for rFactor in terms of physics, to get the best possible impression of an F1 car that I can with the equipment available. And that Renault is a beauty.
My opinion? Peraltada is still REALLY scary. I feel like I could do it flat-out but there have been instances in practice laps where I took a slightly wrong line through there and flew into the tyre barrier on the exit. Having said that, a chicane beforehand would ruin the circuit. F1 needs scary corners IMO.
And the esses will be a challenge as ever – reminds me of Suzuka, but slower.
Of course, this won’t be a 100% accurate representation of a modern Formula 1 car at Hermanos but I think we are looking at laptimes that are faster than those at Monaco, and speeds in excess of 190mph.
Opinions?25th February 2013, 19:32 at 7:32 pm #225761
Well Peraltada now has a concrete barrier running round the outside of the corner, so it’s now a more similar corner than that of an oval. Disadvantage, there’s no run-off. Advantage, there’s less risk of a car flipping from a gravel trap like there was from the early 90s F1 days.26th February 2013, 4:00 at 4:00 am #225762
Considering the speeds that are done at Indianapolis Motor Speedway and other big ovals, I have a hard time understanding why the lack of space for run-off is a problem at Peraltada. Especially considering that the catch fencing used for F1 tracks is of a higher caliber than that used at some of the United States oval tracks (According to Dario Franchitti’s tweet after the big accident at Daytona last weekend).
I am aware that FIA has calculations that severly limit various aspects of track design that keep features like Peraltada from existing, but if anyone has the money and the knowledge to find a way to make banked turns safer than they are today it would be F1.
Until then, replace the wall with a SaferBarrier, update the catch fencing, and let’s go racing.26th February 2013, 6:23 at 6:23 am #225763
I think oval turns are a little less sharp than Peraltada, and their banking makes them safer. I don’t have any solid argumentation to support this, but my feeling is that if you lose the car on Indianapolis, chances are you have a minor impact and then graze along the wall for some distance, whereas in Peraltada, it’s more likely to be a big impact.
In anyway, I seriously doubt the powers that be will allow the Peraltada to be part of the circuit without any serious run-off, which I understand is not easy to do as there is a public road right behind the corner. Of course, they could knock everything down between the circuit and the road, and use the road as run-off, but it’s more likely we will have to close our eyes once every lap as the cars negotiate a hideous chicane.26th February 2013, 6:43 at 6:43 am #225764
Here is a potential solution to the problem. I just did it very quickly, so it looks quite crude:
Yes, it’s a chicane, but it’s styled as an extension of the Esses. It’s designed to slow the cars down enough to make the Peraltada safe, but without completely robbing them of their speed.
Of course, they could knock everything down between the circuit and the road, and use the road as run-off
I’m afraid that’s not really an option. For one, there is virtually nothing between the corner and the road. And secondly, the road itself is a major arterial route that connects many of the southern suburbs to the airport.26th February 2013, 7:05 at 7:05 am #225765
my feeling is that if you lose the car on Indianapolis, chances are you have a minor impact and then graze along the wall for some distance
Ralf Schumacher would suggest differently ;)26th February 2013, 7:39 at 7:39 am #225766
@prisoner-monkeys Your solution is much better than the actual layout that the CART Series used.
I used to play this track in the game F1GP (yes I’m getting old)… Back then, I thought it was just a boring circuit, only going left right, left right, left right and left again… But now understanding more of the physics of a F1 car, I think this will be an awesome circuit for modern F1.26th February 2013, 7:57 at 7:57 am #225767
I think that chicane that you put in there does not look too bad @prisoner-monkeys. At the same time, I am afraid it still won’t be enough, but let us hope something like that can be done.
Sure enough if they keep the corner in, they would outline the whole of the bend with those SAFER barriers (or maybe TecPro, but that is better against frontal impact, where SAFER is perfect for oval like brushes of the wall) and bring the catch fencing up to F1 spec.26th February 2013, 8:52 at 8:52 am #225768
The other alternative that I can think of would protect the Peraltada, but would be extremely expensive: demolish it, and make the corner compeltely flat.
Then, rebuild it somewhere in the infield – you’d have to demolish some of those football fields to make it work – and reconfigure the circuit to include it. It might have to be a bit smaller, but the banking could probably be tweaked that the smaller size wouldn’t affect the corner that much.26th February 2013, 10:50 at 10:50 am #225769
I don’t see how this circuit will work in Modern F1, the esses will be great in terms of testing the cars and the drivers, but I fail to see where the overtaking will be. The problem with the esses is that they will string the cars out pretty quickly, and I can envisage Vettel getting pole, and being 1.7 seconds ahead by the end of the first lap and staying there26th February 2013, 11:03 at 11:03 am #225770
Yep, I can see that too. It needs a couple of really sharp corners at the end of the straight like Monza.26th February 2013, 11:09 at 11:09 am #225771
I don’t see how this circuit will work in Modern F1, the esses will be great in terms of testing the cars and the drivers, but I fail to see where the overtaking will be.
And yet if the circuit was recongifured to include more overatking opportunities, people would undoubtedly criticise it.26th February 2013, 11:25 at 11:25 am #225772
Okay, here is an attempt to address the issues with the circuit:
Firstly, I tightened up the first corner ever-so-slightly – and smoothed out the next two – to try and encourage overtaking.
Secondly, I reprofiled the southern end of the circuit. Where it was a sweeper into a sharp corner, now it’s a sharp corner into a sweeper n the hopes of offering a secondary overtaking point. As a result, I’m not happy with the next corner, but it was a sacrifice that had to be made. I straight-lined two of the Esses to let the cars build up a bit of speed in the hopes of remedying it.
Next is the msot radical departure. I didn’t want to do it, but I had to turn the circuit into a figure-of-eight. Without natural elevation – like at Suzuka – I’m not sure how the fly-over could be done. But it was necessary to create the “Nueve Peraltada”, that 180-degree bend in the middle of the infield. It’s smaller and tighter than the original, but I imagine that you could play around with the banking to minimise the impact. There’s also some space to make it larger; i just drew this up quickly.
Finally, I wanted to create another major overtaking point. I had to throw in a pair of extra Esses, which I modelled on the fast chicane in Melbourne (I call them Ricardo and Pedro, after the Rodriguez brothers). Not only does this offer a challenging pair of bends, but it lines up perfectly for the gap in the old baseball stadium grandstand. The gives a sharp right onto the old Peraltada, which is now flattened given the presence of the new corner.
There are a few issues with the circuit, though. There isn’t enough run-off on the outside of the right-hander before the new Peraltada. It might need to be redone as a slower, double-apex bend. The circuit also cuts out a fairly large slice of the paddock area, but I imagine that this would need to be enlarged to accomodate the modern Formula 1, anyway. For novelty value, the paddock could cover both sides of the circuit; I think it would be pretty neat to see the cars tearing along between the team transporters and motorhomes.26th February 2013, 12:52 at 12:52 pm #225773
My attempt at using the space and existing track as much as possible and keeping the Peraltada intact, the new sections try to emulate the original track as much as possible, and some corners are made shaper to make better braking zones, like the first corner26th February 2013, 13:33 at 1:33 pm #225774
How much run off area realistically would you need at Peraltada?
Would it not be possible to create a slightly tighter version of Peraltada before the current 1st corner and then double back and go in-between the esses and your new Peraltada and rejoin before what was the 4th and 5th corners, carry on along the esses and then do some arrangement of going through the baseball stadium?
Looking at the plan I made I don’t think I have left enough run off near the exit of my new Peraltada.
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