Groups

Rookie most deserving of a good drive (25 posts)

Topic tags: Bruno Senna, karun chandhok, Lucas Di Grassi, Vitaly Petrov

Viewing post 1 to 15 (25 total posts)

1 2 →

mattclinch said 2 years, 6 months ago:

Which of the rookie drivers this season do you think has performed above expectations and is most deserving of a larger team drive next season?

For me, despite the obvious and deserved plaudits for Hulkenburg’s pole in Brazil, I feel Chandhok is the most deserving of a good seat. Although he has never seemed on the pace in qualifying his two classified 14th places move HRT above Virgin in the Constructors (surely rather embarrassing for Virgin with the bigger budget), one of which was in the second race where surely he deserves a medal just for keeping the dreadful HRT on the track.

Hulkenburg, despite his great lap in Brazil, has been almost consistently outpaced by Barrichello. Although that is hardly surprising, I would have expected him to get more out of the car. His ‘improvement’ over the season that was so talked about after snatching pole has really just been him getting to the level where the car should be performing.

Di Grassi and Senna have both had a fair run in their respective cars and in my eyes are both close seconds to Chandhok, but their seasons have been riddled with mechanical faults. Despite

Petrov has been a whole bag of fail and simply isn’t good enough for F1.

#
Icthyes said 2 years, 6 months ago:

Ned will be on here shortly to tell you that those 14ths were the result of not having the car blow up. Still, for someone who never drove a F1 car until Bahrain Q1, he did well and deserves a full season with a small team.

Hulkenburg should stay at Williams, they’r the perfect calibre for a driver in his second year. The other Nico did quite well from being at Williams.

Di Grassi and Senna haven’t impressed me but unless I had serious financial worries I wouldn’t swap them for rookies, not of the calibre that are coming through at least.

Petrov should move to Lotus. Being at Renault is just like Alonso and Grosjean all over again. If the big teams had kept their word about technical assistance and Mosley hadn’t rigged the entry criteria, this would have been the sensible thing to do this year.

#
Deleted User said 2 years, 6 months ago:

“Ned will be on here shortly to tell you that those 14ths were the result of not having the car blow up. “

I’ll save him the trouble. Chandhok wasn’t particularly quick and more often than not was outpaced by Senna who has been hammered by Klien. A new team making it to the end esp at the start of the season was more luck than anything.

Hulkenberg has actually outpaced Rubens quite a few times he just (until Brazil) was never anything particularly special in the race whereas Petrov was the opposite. I feel Hulk and then Petrov have the moft to offer although granted they’ve had material that actually allows them to show their worth but they don’t yet deserve a bigger team than they have.

#
Alexi said 2 years, 6 months ago:

Hulkenberg for sure. Unfortunately for your Chandhok, sympathy doesn’t translate to him being quicker or anything for that matter.

Senna, Chandhok, Di Grassi, Petrov – all should be buried in the sand and quickly forgotten. F1 doesn’t deserve pilots that bad.

#
sw6569 said 2 years, 6 months ago:

Kobayashi and Klien in my opinion. I personally don’t think the Rookies this year have been great at all.

Hulkenberg has done two laps of note this entire season.

Petrov vs Hamilton was quite fun too in China? (or one of the early tilkedromes)

#
VettelS said 2 years, 6 months ago:

Chandhok – He’s shown small sparks of promise. He’s not World Champion material, but I think he could perform well with a better car: Williams, Force India, Sauber, etc.

di Grassi – I’m not sure about him. A year or two at the new teams should give him time to prove himself.

Senna – Unimpressed by him so far. To be honest, I think the “Senna” name goes some way to explaining why he’s here at all.

Kobayashi – During the first third of the season, it looked like he was a bit of a one-race wonder and not really up to it. Since then, he’s definitely impressed- World Champion in waiting in a few years time?

Petrov – I think he has more to give, but needs a bit more time. I hope he stays at Renault next season, and if he doesn’t improve, teams like Williams, Sauber and the new teams would take him.

Hulkenberg – I think he seems worse because of all the hype around him, but he definitely has potential. Another few of years in the mid-field and we could see him at McLaren or Red Bull.

#
Fer no.65 said 2 years, 6 months ago:

Karun deserves a good chance with a small team, just because the team replaced him for Yamamoto… he should’ve raced the whole season with the team.

he was not that fast anyway, but then Senna wasn’t either.

Kobayashi did very well. I thought Pedro, with all his experience, would get the most out of the car, but he was really beaten by Koba. His race at Suzuka, Valencia and Silverstone was very good. He’s aggressive, yet he brings points. Probably the best Japanese driver ever IMO (yes, Taku… sorry!).

Hulkenberg was good. His pole was awesome, tho I have to admit I was hoping a bit more from him, in comparision to Barrichello. But then, Barri is the most experienced guy, surely someone that must be one of the most difficult guys to be if you’re a newbie. But he’s a great addition to the team. Barri+Hulkenberg are a nice line-up.

All in all, Koba 1st, Hulkenberg 2nd. Petrov crashed too much.

#
Icthyes said 2 years, 6 months ago:

Chandhok wasn’t particularly quick and more often than not was outpaced by Senna

The qualifying battle ended at 6-3 in Senna’s favour. But one of those is hardly surprising when Bahrain Q1 was Chandhok’s first outing in the car. Chandhok also often qualified only a tenth off of Senna. The other gaps are quite big, but you have to look at the circumstances: Bahrain we know and in Canada there was a technical problem. In two races – Monaco and Turkey – Senna convincingly out-qualified Chandhok by a second. But Chandhok out-qualified Senna by 4/10ths in Barcelona. Given how much better Senna is meant to be, it wasn’t all that convincing.

What about the races?
Bahrain – Chandhok retires on first lap
Australia – Senna falls out early
Malaysia – similar pace, Chandhok does better
China – similar pace until Chandhok fell out, Senna being better on this occassion
Spain – Senna bows out early
Monaco – close pace until Chandhok and Trulli collided
Turkey – Senna has the edge before both bow out
Canada – pace similar until Senna conks out
Valencia – similar pace

Conclusion? If Chandhok’s not that great, Senna is hardly much better. I think if the pair had stayed together for the whole year we would have seen them quite close.

#
Icthyes said 2 years, 6 months ago:

Hmm…something went wrong with my post, probably too many links (I linked to all the race charts Keith did for HRT), so I’ll have to paste this with the links gone. You can take my word for it or check for yourselves! (Here’s a hint: http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/charts/201001rl2021.html is Bahrain, just replace “201001″ for “201002″ and so on)

Chandhok wasn’t particularly quick and more often than not was outpaced by Senna

The qualifying battle ended at 6-3 in Senna’s favour. But Chandhok also qualified only a tenth off of Senna in 2 of those races. The other gaps are quite big, but you have to look at the circumstances: Bahrain Q1 was his very first time in the car and in Canada there was a technical problem. In two races – Monaco and Turkey – Senna convincingly out-qualified Chandhok by about a second. But Chandhok out-qualified Senna by 4/10ths in Barcelona. Given how much better Senna is meant to be, the data isn’t all that convincing.

What about the races?
Bahrain – Chandhok retires on first lap
Australia – Senna falls out early
Malaysia – similar pace, Chandhok does better
China – similar pace until Chandhok fell out, Senna being better on this occasion
Spain – Senna bows out early
Monaco – close pace until Chandhok and Trulli collided
Turkey – Senna has the edge before both bow out
Canada – pace similar until Senna conks out
Valencia- similar pace

Conclusion? If Chandhok’s not that great, Senna is hardly much better. I think if the pair had stayed together for the whole year we would have seen them quite close.

#
Deleted User said 2 years, 6 months ago:

Icthyes I never rated Senna much.

“Chandhok wasn’t particularly quick and more often than not was outpaced by Senna who has been hammered by Klien”

Chandhok and Senna may have been close but if Senna is being trounced by someone who has just came back to the sport than neither are worth a better drive just yet

#
Red Andy said 2 years, 6 months ago:

being trounced by someone who has just came back to the sport

And who was entirely useless in his first attempt at F1, even unable to keep up with an ageing David Coulthard despite crucially being more Austrian than the other drivers in his team.

#
Deleted User said 2 years, 6 months ago:

Don’t worry Andy, I don’t rate Klien much myself which just means I’m even more disappointed by Senna’s performance at the mo’

#
Icthyes said 2 years, 6 months ago:

Klien wasn’t much use but in comparison to HRT he’s a skilled veteran. It doesn’t really surprise me that he’s better than Senna and worse than everyone else. Two seasons of racing and another in the last year of old testing would give him quite an advantage on car set-up. Toro Rosso last year had basically the RB5 with a Ferrari engine but their relative lack of quality (especially in the drivers) made the difference more than simply not getting the updates for a while.

I don’t see the point in any team junking anyone unless they need the money, because it’ll be another season of average rookies in rubbish cars.

#
Picasso 1.9D FTW said 2 years, 6 months ago:

Well it has to be Kobayashi, his speed and his confidence both in terms of giving novel strategies a go (ones that would require overtaking in order to work) and in terms of the sheer ballsiness of his moves – plenty of older hands don’t come close, let alone any other rookie. De La Rosa was experienced and stable, but never a stand-out driver (a great tester, though. At least he didn’t do a Badoer on his return to the track). Heidfeld is a better test and Kobayashi is still showing just fine.
If we’re counting guys doing their first full season, Alguersuari is starting to show his potential (alternative take: Buemi is slipping backwards), but he’s no standout. Hulkenberg is doing very respectably, even disregarding Brazil. He’s in that midfield where most 1st lap crashes seem to happen and he’s had his share of bad times there but alongside the learning there have been good shows of speed. Petrov too – he’s made plenty of mistakes this year, which isn’t really unusual in the first year (although we can all think of honourable exceptions), but in Kubica he’s got the toughest pairing of any rookie (with all due respect to Glock and Barrichello, two more fine drivers). It must be pretty trying being up against RK, but Petrov has still left marks in the memory for good reasons – that pass on Hamilton, for one. Perhaps the fighting spirit will be matched with a little more skill and judgement next year, perhaps not.
For the rest, it feels harsh to judge guys who fared well in other series then come to F1 with zero testing and struggle to impress – it’s a bit like how I felt leaving school as one of the bright ones and getting to uni to find that I would actually have to work in order to seem bright there (I realised that way too late to make a difference…) I like Chandhok personally, so I’d like to think he was a standout, but he wasn’t. If I could give him another chance I would, perhaps he’ll mature like any of them might.
I must admit that I was not one of those who spotted Alonso’s potential when he first raced with Minardi. I think I was unimpressed when Renault took him. So perhaps I’m also missing the talent in Di Grassi or someone. We can do another “Humble Pie Cafe” thread in a few years’ time when he’s world champ!

#
lucasowen85 said 2 years, 6 months ago:

Comfortably Kobayashi. His drive at Suzuka was brilliant to watch, although the fact he needed to perform so many overtaking moves proves that there’s still something to be learnt about strategy. He’s squeezed more points out of that Sauber than it deserves (especially considering the truly shocking start they had to the season) and has made Hulkenberg look slow and Petrov truly amateur.

That said, I’m a fan of Hulkenberg. He’s been fast and has generally delivered the pace that the Williams has been able to. Petrov could be exciting but he’s maybe just too green for F1 yet. Too many mistakes.

Conversely, di Grassi and Senna are a waste of space. Crashing on the warm-up lap? Please. Chandhok has been better, in so much as he’s consistent. I can’t ever see him lighting up the time-charts though.

#