F1 Fanatic

Taking a contradictory line for the sake of argument, having no run off areas would mean grass? a wall? gravel? I’m not sure any would have changed Senna’s particular angle or impact significantly.

I think they do overall, make circuits safer, but they bring the thrill factor down and the need to be so cautious about a turn incase you go over the limit and drop it.

Ultimately, it’s the strength of the cars that save the drivers these days imho. The one clear factor that hasn’t changed massively since Senna’s death is the amount of wheels that go bouncing around the place. That’s much more a danger than the impact from the walls it seems, because it’s an uncontrollable factor. However I think there are 2 tethers per wheel coming in for 2012, but not this year ( correct me if I’m wrong ), due to the redesign costs.

Personally I want to see the RB X2010 prototype racing around in an exhibition league. But that’s not likely to happen unless some sheik somewhere decides he’s fed up of looking at all his money and needs to be a bit more flamboyant than buying another pimped up Ferrari, or building another glassy curvy tower somewhere on the desert that remains 90% empty for the next 20 years.

I think run-off areas are for spectators. Only gravel traps and I mean “traps” stop cars. Felipes accident in 09 was another example, while the run-off was gravel, due to the sheer speed the car left the track, it just skated across the gravel into the wall.

Massa didn’t go across gravel, the run off was tarmac.

Run off areas are imperative for safety..Without run off areas then a driver would have no time to reduce speed before impact..YES Tamburello had a run off area BUT it was terribly designed..If it had been a very deep gravel trap and a very deep tyre wall instead of concrete, then Ayrton would probably have survived..One thing i do agree with is that the new circuits run off areas can be far too large, making it less and less likely that mistakes will be punished and the driver will damage their car..

Tumborello run-off in ’94 was tarmac/concrete if I remember right. Anyway, wall was just too close, I don’t believe that any type of run-off at that speed would help.

Run off doesn’t just slow down speeds (which it probably barely will in some situations) but it gives the driver a chance to correct a mistake so it is safer than just having a wall there. When a car suffers a failure or the driver is unconscious heading for the barrier like Felipe (as already noted) then that extra tarmac probably does very little to slow the car down.

They make some situations safer but not all.

Gravel is a lot better at slowing the car down of course but there is always the risk that it will dig in and then roll.

I have seen some ideas by users such as Red Andy that if the tarmac in the run off area was abrasive then that would wreck the tyres and punish the drivers more for making mistakes and without increasing the danger. I doubt that would slow the cars down much either but I do think it’s a good idea.

The reason street circuits don’t need run off is because of their relatively slow speed. We have seen though, how the lack of run off on street circuits can really hurt a driver (Alex Caffi Monaco 1991, Karl Wendlinger Monaco 1994 who had run off but not enough, Mark Webber Valencia 2010 (look at full speed version of webbers crash) Although Webber wasn’t hurt, that speed was really scary. Just imagine if that happened in Monaco! But still, crashes like Senna’s and Berger’s at Imola and Kubica’s at Canada prove that sometimes runoff isn’t enough. I think that putting one set of tire barriers in the middle/three fourths of the way down the gravel trap would help reduce injury, and still make the drivers have something to worry about. If you hit first tire barrier at 140 mph and drag them along to the next tire barrier, you would hit the second one with a MUCH slower speed, like 40 mph. The only problem is that getting the tires back in place would be time consuming and would call for long yellows.

Wouldn’t haystacks cause some sort of fire maybe?