Webber – Turkey – No Rear Upgrades – Why?
14th May 2011, 3:38 at 3:38 am #129387
Apparently on formula1.com they suggest that Webber did not run the rear upgrades in Turkey after Vets P1 crash. Can anyone else confirm this and also why would this be?
The Australian commentators said Webber would run the new rear upgrades in Qualy/Race & Vets obviously wouldn’t…14th May 2011, 3:51 at 3:51 am #168734
Perhaps they thought it would be safer to stick to the known quantity of their existing system than to gamble on an upgrade which could not be adequately tested due to Vettel’s crash. That’s all i can think of. If this is the case, I suspect we’ll see plenty of RBR running on Friday in Spain to test the as yet unraced rear upgrades you refer to.14th May 2011, 8:20 at 8:20 am #168735
A fair point but I am still sceptically… I think it shows once again that RBR did not want Webber to have the upper hand over Vets. If true i wonder who’s decision this is. Webber should have enough credit & say to take the gamble to run the new parts… I just wonder how this would have been handled if Webber put it in the wall.14th May 2011, 9:42 at 9:42 am #168736
I think you’re trying too much to support your preconcieved idea of RBR evilness. Vettel currently has too much of an upper hand over Webber that even if he’d won over Seb in that race it wouldn’t make much difference in the championship.
Very unlikely that Newey would disregard finished upgrade just to avoid Webber from catching Vettel. Don’t forget there’s also Constructors Championship which is as important for the team as Drivers Championship, and it will only help them to boost Webber’s performance.
Also, testing the upgrade would give them essential data for the next races and we know how important it is to take every opportunity to test theese days.14th May 2011, 16:38 at 4:38 pm #168737
Firstly RBR have shown favoritism in the past to Vets on more than one occasion. What makes you think this could be any different?
Secondly a win over Vets does make a difference, physiologically and also on the scoreboard. Points are points. If it makes no difference then he and all might as well not show in Spain.
Thirdly Newey doesn’t call all the shots. Formula1.com are reporting that Webber did not run the upgrades in which were supposedly worth up to 3 tenths. Makes no sense to me why he wouldn’t have the opportunity to run them. Can you prove he did run the upgrades?14th May 2011, 17:04 at 5:04 pm #168738
Is there a link to where the official website suggests Webber didn’t run upgrades?14th May 2011, 17:05 at 5:05 pm #16873914th May 2011, 17:09 at 5:09 pm #168740
Also if RBR only had parts for one car (Vets), pathetic and more evidence to support favoritism towards Vets.14th May 2011, 20:32 at 8:32 pm #168741
I think they treat them equally… but even if they dont… wouldnt you favour the reigning world champion who is by far better than Webber?14th May 2011, 21:03 at 9:03 pm #168742
Can’t really blame them for putting their weight behind Vettel. Look what he’s done this year compared to Vettel.14th May 2011, 21:05 at 9:05 pm #168743
“Also if RBR only had parts for one car (Vets), pathetic and more evidence to support favoritism towards Vets”
They don’t really need to favour Vettel he’s waltzing off to his second title all on his own. If they only had one upgrade then the best thing would be to give it to Vettel because he’s picking up all the wins and Mark’s pretty much been nowhere so far.14th May 2011, 23:15 at 11:15 pm #168744
I don’t suggest that he did, but there as well could be different problem with this upgrade that we’re not aware of, which made them abandon it.
I just struggle with the notion that it’s conspiracy just to hamper Webber’s performance. IF they had option to run it or not and chose not to just to avoid giving advantage to Webber it would be as you say pathetic. But i will say again – giving it to Webber also helps Vettel in the long shot, they would gather data by testing it and prepare tweaked version for Vettel for Spain.
As for bringing upgrade for only one car – there’s ample example that the teams just may not have enough time to prepare upgrades for both cars before the race weekend, most teams did this in the past, and rear upgrade isn’t a small one.
One more thing – Webber was reasonably happy after the race, do You think he would be if he knew that the upgrade that could provide him with race win was laying around unused in the garage?
Don’t put bad will as an explanation when there could be other, simplier reasons.15th May 2011, 0:30 at 12:30 am #168745
Also if RBR only had parts for one car (Vets), pathetic and more evidence to support favoritism towards Vets.
It’s called a blind test. Because there’s no in-season testing, it’s difficult to assess aero parts. So you put the upgrade on one car and leave the other alone. Then you run them over the weekend to see which package performs better. It’s a tactic used by all the teams – Renault infamously did it to Alonso when they wanted to drop Piquet, but Piquet’s contract dictated that he couldn’t be dropped unless he and Alonso had the same parts on their car – and the driver who is ahead on points usually gets the upgrade to maximise his chances.
It’s fairly obvious you’re just looking for reasons to hate Red Bull. But upgrades or no, Sebastian Vettel has already proven to be light years ahead of Webber this year. And when it comes down to crunch time and one driver has to step forward and be openly favoured by the team, it will be on the basis of his results; again, this is something that all the teams do. So if Red Bull start to favour Vettel at any point this year, it will be because of his results. Because so far, Mark Webber hasn’t shown them a single thing that makes him stand out from Vettel’s shadow.15th May 2011, 14:23 at 2:23 pm #168746
There is no conspiracy, it is simple, so far RBR have failed to give Webber the tools he needs to adequately fight for WDC and this is just another example. I also disagree that Mark has shown nothing. 18th to 3rd in China shows a lot more than cruzy uncontested victories up front.
You guys don’t have to school me on how F1/Testing work as I haven’t missed a race in over 20+ years ;] It is only the forth round and when you have two drivers that are both adequate and in a good position to fight for the WDC then they should both be treated equally and should both have the same opportunity to run upgrades else it is a farcical and not a fair fight. I wonder how it would go down if Lewis only had the upgrades in Melbourne & JB didn’t…
I also think it is very naive to think that teams don’t pull shifties. Every year there is at least one dodgy situation that doesn’t quite sit right with the fans. The recent crash gate shows the lengths teams will go to win and protect there million dollar investments. RBR is nursing Vets bubble and are more than happy if Mark doesnt win all year else they could find themselves in another awkward situation like they were last year.
Whilst we are on the topic of parity I also think the rules are unfair for heavy drivers. I still cannot understand how Vets can have some 17KG more ballast to play with and distributed on his car compared to Mark. In a sport that comes down to the most minute measurements this rule still seems odd to me. I just wonder if the qualy results in Japan & Korea would be any different if this rule was cleaned up. I think all drivers should be weighed prior to each session then ballast should placed in a generic location(under race seat) which when added to the drivers weight should all equate to an even 100KG.
I want to see drivers & team mates being beaten by talent, not machinery and inconsistent rules.15th May 2011, 14:56 at 2:56 pm #168747
Ming Mong” Probably the best reply I’ve ever read of a post so far.. Absolutely right..
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