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F1

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F1 discussion

Where is this F1 heading?

This topic contains 22 replies, has 14 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of moshbeard moshbeard 3 years, 4 months ago.

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 23 total)
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  • #129351
    Profile photo of Ivan Vinitskyy
    Ivan Vinitskyy
    Participant

    Where are safety cars? Engine failures? Flat out racing?

    #168355
    Profile photo of Doance
    Doance
    Participant

    We’re seeing more wheel-to-wheel racing. F1 has never been about cars breaking down, thats a problem… not a good thing.

    #168356
    Profile photo of Ivan Vinitskyy
    Ivan Vinitskyy
    Participant

    I mean it is too conservative, not about pure speed as it was before. Wheel to wheel action is also not quite real.

    #168357
    Profile photo of Ral
    Ral
    Member

    Very cerebral now, less about all-brawn physical racing.

    In the after-race interviews, both Hamilton and Rosberg admitted to being confused about what was going on in the race.

    #168358
    Profile photo of Tco
    Tco
    Member

    In a sport which is supposed to represent the pinacle of engineering excellence, 75 pits stops in an hour and half is too many. Jensen Button remarked that he was just cruising round to the finish at the end.

    I think Pirelli have ruined the sport by producing poor quality tyres. It has degenerated into the race of the pits stops with more emphasis on the strategy of the race than the speed, handling and performance of the car. I know that Pirelli were asked to offer a tyre that was better for racing but I think they have blown it. What would really be good is for a second company to arrive like we used to have and give Pirelli something to think about.

    #168359
    Profile photo of pepsiperfect
    pepsiperfect
    Member

    Indeed I could not agree more.

    The racing has been lost, it is essentially now all about the pit stops.

    Not just about the strategy, Jenson were on a different strategy 2 others.

    Other than the car, the tyres are the most influential attribute.

    A REAL tyre war is required, not just a single supplier.

    A number of suppliers to mix things up. Or a number of options

    from Pirelli, not just the current formst of prime and option tyre.

    Something like p1, p2, p3 – o1,o2, 03.

    It is consistent that when it is wet this adds another variable.

    #168360
    Profile photo of George
    George
    Participant

    I disagree, without the tyres degrading we would be back to the situation we’ve had for the last few years where barely anything happens during a race. Complaining about the lack of pitstops is frankly rediculous, during the refueling era 3 stops was a common sight. It has nothing to do with engineering excellence either, in fact it’s quite an achievement for Pirelli to get the tyres almost exactly where they were asked to be.

    There might be more engine failures when the new regs are introduced in 2013, it’s obvious that if the engines are frozen in spec than the only way to improve them is through reliability.

    If you want safety cars go watch NASCAR.

    I think Keith did an article where he put the case against a tyre war, I suggest you go take a look at that.

    #168361
    Profile photo of Tco
    Tco
    Member

    I definitely do not want to see more safety car situations. That implies crashes. If you want crahes go and watch banger racing. There is nothing more boring than NASCAR racing. Cars are designed to go round corners, not circles.

    Ever since Formula 1′s inception it has prided itself on it’s engineering excellence and innovation. If it loses that, it is just another formula.

    Refuelling, having to use two different compounds of tyre, are just two examples of gimmics introduced artificially as a marketing ploy. Poor quality tyes are just an extension of that. How does having to use tyres which may only last five laps enhance the engineering achievement of producing a fast, well handling car?

    I feel this could backfire on Pirelli as their brand may be damaged because they make tyres out of sh1t. In the past many innovations introduced on F1 cars have found their way into (ordinary not supercars) production cars. I’m thinking (say) disc brakes, car safety and yes!, tyre development. Where is the advantage in producing substandard products which have no development potential?

    Designing in engine failure is not in the interest of true racing fans. By all means, have a limited number of engines per season as now, because that stimulates steps forward in engine reliability. It also introduces an element of competition which is exactly what a tyre war would do. Two (or more) manufacturers in competition to provide a product which beats the other guy could not be anything but a benefit for all concerned.

    It is clear that some people are not interested actual racing cars any more, they seem to favour strategy games, with artifical hindrences to the actual racing,(just like video games). We saw today how the DRS made an overtake soooo easy as to make it impossible for the driver in front to respond. Some of the best racing today was at points of the circuit where it could not be used. Kers has it’s uses commerically but it is not new. A variation of it has been in use on commercial vehicles for decades. I remember regularly travelling on a coach that had it’s forerunner fitted in the 1970′s. There could be some development potential there if weight could be reduced to make it of more use for the ordinary motorist – That is what F1 racing used to be about and I am old enough to remember racing in the 1950′s, when it was much more exciting, (but sadly a lot less safe, which is where development comes in)and the drivers had a definite input into the outcome.

    I am still a fan of motor racing of all kinds, the recent club meeting at Castle Coombe provided an excellent day’s racing, free of the artificial constraints now employed to benefit “The Show” in F1. I fear the formula is being taken out of the hands of skillful technicians and designers, by those who lack the talent of those who they seek to control.

    BTW George, to which Keith are you refering and where is his article? I would be pleased to read it.

    Bring on quality tyres and tyre competition!

    #168362
    Profile photo of DavidS
    DavidS
    Participant

    Just to clarify, disc brakes are a product of Le Mans, not F1.

    #168363
    Profile photo of TommyB
    TommyB
    Participant

    I mean it is too conservative

    Previous years being conservative was saving tyres because they couldn’t overtake. Now they overtake.

    Also, where are the DNF’s? Are you mad. There was a classic race on the other day and there were about 6 runners left with 20 laps to go. The leader was a lap ahead of the field and the others were separated by about a minimum of 30 seconds so nothing happened and it was boring.

    We’ve had four brilliant races, can’t believe people are moaning about this.

    #168364
    Profile photo of George
    George
    Participant

    Here you go Tco, took me a while to find :) http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2010/02/16/f1-needs-a-tyre-supplier-for-2011-and-a-new-tyre-war-isnt-the-answer/

    also take a look at this one:

    http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2011/04/20/pirelli-deserve-credit-f1s-terrific-start-2011/

    F1 hasn’t been about complete innovation for a long time, they tend to focus on one or two aspects at a time, especially recently thanks to cost cutting. Right now KERS and the new engines are at the top of the list thanks to fuel shortages.

    You ask “How does having to use tyres which may only last five laps enhance the engineering achievement of producing a fast, well handling car?”, well that’s pretty simple, if they can make their car easier on the tyres (see sauber, ferrari) then they gain a performance advantage.

    I see what you’re trying to say but F1 isn’t CanAm, it’s just not possible anymore to have a totally unrestricted series. Things like DRS and the two tyre rule belong in a different discussion I think.

    #168365
    Profile photo of Icthyes
    Icthyes
    Participant

    Where is this F1 heading?

    On current form, into the history books as one of the best seasons ever (if you hide the championship table).

    #168366
    Profile photo of Ell
    Ell
    Participant

    We’re in a great condition. Remember, we have just have quite possibly the greatest season ever in f1. So why complain abou the racing? I have a good idea, if you don’t like the racing, go back to 2004 and watch races then. That is boring racing. All the gps this season has been great. Especially China, which is one of the greatest races of all time. Next time you want to complain, go and watch f1 2004.

    #168367
    Profile photo of bytorr2112
    bytorr2112
    Participant

    apart from all that dose any one think that hamilton and vettle get the best cars while jenson and webber seem to all ways finish be hind there team mate i mean JB should have not been passed by Lewis but it all ways seem to happen and Mark only comes good near the end JB should have stayed with Ross Broune but I thimk Mercedes only took over the team and wanted Schumi and Nico all German

    wot u all think about my comments

    #168368
    Profile photo of Icthyes
    Icthyes
    Participant

    I think Mercedes would be doing better with Jenson Button. Not only is he good at setting the car up (not saying Schumacher isn’t but JB has had more recent experience), but the 2010 car would have a driver whom it was designed to be driven by and they wouldn’t have had to junk it for effectively a brand new car this year and as Red Bull have proven, evolution of a concept (unless it’s a dog) is vital to staying ahead of your rivals.

    I don’t think nationalism had anything to do with it though.

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