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F1 discussion

Will Massa ever be served his poetic justice?

This topic contains 21 replies, has 14 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of himmatsj himmatsj 1 year, 1 month ago.

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 22 total)
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  • #133873
    Profile photo of himmatsj
    himmatsj
    Participant

    I look back at 2007 and 2008, and in both years I feel the WDC was served poetic justice, and in both cases I felt the runner up deserved to have won the title instead.

    In 2007, no one can argue Lewis was the class of the field, and considering he was a rookie, that’s no mean feat. However, due to not issues of his, he blew the last two races. I reckon he’d have been 16 points richer at the very least with the troubles.

    Alas, Raikkonen won. I didn’t feel he deserved it though, but too me, it was karma. He lost 2003 and 2005 when I felt he was the best racer, but the McLaren gave up on him way too many times.

    Same with 2008. Hamilton won, though I felt he was thoroughly inconsistent that year compared to 2007 (which was admittedly a bad too high he set for himself). But to me, it was justice served for 2007.

    So this bring me to my question. When will justice be served to Massa? Can he get a drive at Lotus or Sauber and win the WDC next year?

    #244764
    Profile photo of Diceman
    Diceman
    Participant

    I once had a dream where Massa won championship with Williams. Who knows, everything is possible ;-)

    But it’s not very likely unfortunately.

    #244765
    Profile photo of Michael
    Michael
    Participant

    Very unlikely, if he can score a podium with Sauber that’d be impressive. If he can score a win with Lotus, he should be happy.

    As for the WDC, it means that Sauber and Lotus would probably also have to win the WCC since the two go hand in hand, like 80%-90% of the time, so here’s to wishing the best for both those teams, not just Massa!

    #244766
    Profile photo of Iestyn Davies
    Iestyn Davies
    Participant

    I guess Massa is unlucky, and will go down as the loser of one of the tightest championships ever, and also most controversial – it includes Singapore 2008 amongst other things. By karma I always gave JPM 2003, Kimi 2005 & 2008, Alonso 2006 & 2007, Lewis 2012. Vettel now 10, 11 and 13..

    He’s up there with Reutemann, Villeneuve, Peterson, Moss, Montoya, Barrichello and Coulthard as those unlucky to never win the title. I have a feeling Rosberg might join that list in a few years time. I hope Hulkenberg and Grosjean don’t, but you never know, Vettel may get 8 titles and then a new generation has come along.

    #244767
    Profile photo of Roald
    Roald
    Participant

    Even if he had a dominant car next year, he wouldn’t win the title – his teammate probably would. He’s a shadow of his former self. It’s a shame he won’t win a title, but as pointed out in the post above me he’s not the first to come close but never actually win the title during his career.

    #244768

    I think people forget that Massa has achieved far, far more in his career than the vast majority of drivers could ever hope to. I don’t think he really ‘deserves’ anything more, given that he has had a huge amount of success as it is.

    After he leaves F1, he will be remembered for the peaks in his career, not the troughs.

    #244769
    Profile photo of Roald
    Roald
    Participant

    @magnificent-geoffrey I doubt that to be honest. He’s had just a few peaks throughout his career compared to his troughs. His title challenge in 2008 was impressive, but being mediocre in 2010, 2011, 2012 and 2013 is a long time…

    Besides, who knows how much longer he’ll drive around in F1 failing to impress.

    #244770
    Profile photo of Prisoner Monkeys
    Prisoner Monkeys
    Participant

    Poetic justice is the one thing everyone wants, but nobody gets.

    #244771
    Profile photo of Max Jacobson
    Max Jacobson
    Participant

    I think he has to be better than Vettel, Alonso and Hamilton to merit his poetic justice, which he isn’t doing.

    #244772
    Profile photo of OmarR-Pepper
    OmarR-Pepper
    Participant

    No. Massa got that unlucky accident in 2009 that just vanished what he really was or what he would be. Hollywood sells us tons of “true stories” where a person recovers from big burdens till they get the glory in the end. But in F1 new guys with lots of talent appear more often now, or no talent but big money. Unless you have both (tons of money and tons of talent) you can’t get the F1 champioship these days. Can you imagine Vettel, Alonso or Hamilton getting the championship in a Marussia? No way. Can you imagine Di Resta champion in a Red Bull or Ferrai? At least I cant. Even Webber can’t in a red Bull. So Massa won’t get karma giving him “poetic justice”

    #244773
    Profile photo of dot_com
    dot_com
    Participant

    Massa had the privilege of spending 7 years in a Ferrari – that’s more than most F1 drivers get. He had his chances in a top, some may say he had more than his share of opportunity, and didn’t win a WDC. I can’t see it happening in a midfield team.

    #244774
    Profile photo of Kingshark
    Kingshark
    Participant

    In both 2007 and 2008, Massa lead more laps than any other driver on the grid. In total, he won more races than any other driver on the grid, and had more pole positions than any other driver on the grid. All that despite the fact that he had more bad luck than any other driver on the grid.

    Yeah, the Ferrari’s during this period of time were competitive, yet both Kimi and Lewis drove cars which were just as good, yet were not as impressive as Felipe.

    In total, throughout 2007 and 2008, Hamilton, Alonso, and Raikkonen all made more costly driving mistakes than Massa did, and had less misfortunes.

    Anyone who denies the fact that Massa in his prime was undoubtedly one of the best drivers of all time without a championship, is kidding themselves.

    #244775
    Profile photo of Fixy
    Fixy
    Participant

    Gilles Villeneuve never had his “poetic justice”, yet he is remembered with more love than drivers like Schumacher and Alonso. Maybe the same could be said about Regazzoni, Alesi and maybe Ickx (regarding Ferrari drivers), so I think Massa is in a good group. A sad one, because to be honest I think he and the previous four I mentioned deserved a title, but life isn’t fair with everyone. I’d like to see the title won by a different driver every year so everyone has a chance, provided they deserve it, but this won’t happen. Massa had bad luck (Hungary ’09) straight after he was returning to form after his bad luck (Brazil ’08). Fate was particularly cruel with Felipe, but he is the driver with the second-longest career at Ferrari, and will be remembered with love by Ferrari fans (and many others) – unless, of course, he beats Alonso/Raikkonen to the title next year in another car. His career isn’t over yet, but success isn’t the only way to have “poetic justice” served: in fact, I think the opposite is more true, as I tend to feel for, and support, unlucky drivers more than winners. Felipe’s behaviour towards his team has been remarkable and he will be remembered as a vital part of it unless he openly criticises them in the future, which I don’t think he will.

    #244776
    Profile photo of OmarR-Pepper
    OmarR-Pepper
    Participant

    “Poetic justice” could not necessarily be becoming a champion, let’s imagine this scenario:
    Vettel and Alonso are (again) going for the WDC until the final race. And Alonso only needs to get 5th to win (remember 2008?) But in the final laps in Brazil, it starts to rain, and a ruthless Massa displaces Alonso from the exact fifth to a worthless sixth, while Vettel wins both race and WDC, and we can see Alonso waving his hand against his former teammate, who celebrates this moral victory in his country.
    If you don’t like the story, change Vettel for your (not Alonso) favorite driver.

    #244777
    Profile photo of Fixy
    Fixy
    Participant

    @omarr-pepper I actually think a more suiting end to Felipe’s Ferrari career would be to let his own team mate beat him as he will help his team take the title, while 5th or 6th changes little for him. Only provided he visibly surrenders to overtake Alonso rather than struggle to catch him. I prefer a moral loser than a ruthless winner.
    Even if he were at a rival team, he could still show respect to Ferrari by helping them over Red Bull, showing gratitude rather than revenge. But this would make him less appreciated by Red Bull fans…

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