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Formula Renault 3.5

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Group for discussing prominent F1 feeder series Formula Renault 3.5 (aka World Series by Renault).

Moscow Raceway

This topic contains 25 replies, has 10 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of Prisoner Monkeys Prisoner Monkeys 2 years, 5 months ago.

Viewing 11 posts - 16 through 26 (of 26 total)
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  • #205704
    Profile photo of Prisoner Monkeys
    Prisoner Monkeys
    Participant

    There are houses just North and South of the track, the only good direction to expand the track to is East, but that would make the position of the pit straight very awkward and difficult to incorporate.

    How about to the west?

    No idea why they didn’t make the track good in the first place, there was plenty of room

    Evidently not. As you say, there are houses to the north and south. You don’t just build houses wherever the hell you like – these things are planned in advance. So based on the shape of the circuit – long and thin – I’d say it’s a product of the land set aside for it. It’s a bit like the redesign of Hockenheim; it’s pretty obvious that when Tilke did it, he was only allowed to use the infield of the existing circuit, which really limited his options. I’d say the same thing has happened here.

    lenty of resources (4.5 billion!!!???) to do it

    I doubt it was 4.5 billion dollars. More like 4.5 billion rubles, which equals about 14 million dollars.

    #205705
    Profile photo of necrodethmortem
    necrodethmortem
    Participant

    What a scrappy first lap. I have no interest in watching the safety car for about half an hour, so I’m going to complain further about the track :P

    Interestingly the first thing Prost said about the track was how good his Renault Mégane was; another positive he mentioned is that it is suitable for racing schools. Right…

    In the West there’s room for a corner or two, but there’s a road not far from the track. There would have been plenty of room if the whole track was offset to the East. Yes, rubles seems more likely, but wikipedia says USD, which is about the cost of building the new locks at the Panama Canal.

    #205706
    Profile photo of Prisoner Monkeys
    Prisoner Monkeys
    Participant

    another positive he mentioned is that it is suitable for racing schools.

    Vitaly Petrov wasn’t impressed with the circuit, but he did say that the most important thing was that Russia had a circuit with FIA accreditation; until now, the only circuit of any real length has been a temporary circuit near Miachkovo Airport – and that only had a Grade-3 licence. There’s a few others like the NRING and Smolensk Ring floating about, but they’ve only just been constructed. For the past twenty years, Russian motorsport has been limited to temporary airfield and street circuits, which is strange because over the past few years, junior categories of motorsport have been inundated with Russian competitors. But now they have the Moscow Raceway, which has a licence that makes it suitable for international motorsport categories, like Formula Renault and GT1, which means more exposure for Russia and Russian motorsport.

    If the circuit is good for racing schools, then great. It won’t be long before there is a Russian Formula 3 series up and running, which means more grassroots racing events in the country.

    #205707
    Profile photo of Keith Collantine
    Keith Collantine
    Keymaster

    Le professeur isn’t a fan:

    The infield part is very similar and very difficult to overtake. I was a bit surprised that at the end of the straight, it was not also that easy to overtake.

    http://en.rian.ru/sports/20120715/174615577.html

    #205708
    Profile photo of necrodethmortem
    necrodethmortem
    Participant

    At least the next generation of Russian racing drivers will be very good at braking.

    #205709
    Profile photo of Keith Collantine
    Keith Collantine
    Keymaster

    Having watched (and commentated on) the first FR3.5 race there, I’m not keen. This is just another Korea/India-type track, albeit on a slightly smaller scale, with a designated ‘overtaking zone’ and a featureless first and middle sector of endless corners.

    Once again, complete imagination failure on the part of Tilke. Only FR3.5’s DRS (which works along the lines of IndyCar’s push-to-pass, which I much prefer) saved the race from being a complete bore. I understand race two was carnage, but I haven’t seen it yet.

    #205710
    Profile photo of Prisoner Monkeys
    Prisoner Monkeys
    Participant

    Once again, complete imagination failure on the part of Tilke.

    As has been pointed out elsewhere in this thread, he wasn’t given a whole lot of room to work with. The circuit can’t really be expanded to the north, south or west. It’s the same problem he faced when he re-did Hockenheim: Tilke only had a very limited space to work in, since he was clearly told to limit himself to using the old circuit as a boundary.

    If we want more-imaginitive circuits, Hermann Tilke needs to be brought into the design process sooner. Instead of simply being given a piece of land and being told “here, work with this”, he should be brought in as a consultant during the initial surveying phase when the land for the circuit is being selected.

    #205711
    Profile photo of Keith Collantine
    Keith Collantine
    Keymaster

    @prisoner-monkeys I would agree with you, except even when he has lots of room to work with he produces exactly the same kind of track – such as India and Korea. I know the FIA restriction are tight – probably excessively so – but notwithstanding that I’m still not convinced the circuits Tilke comes up with are any where near as good as they should be.

    #205712
    Profile photo of Prisoner Monkeys
    Prisoner Monkeys
    Participant

    @keithcollantine – I think Korea is secretly brilliant, to be honest. Each of the three sectors is very distinct in what it demands of the car; the first sector is all long straights and tight corners, while the second sector is fast and flowing and is a real driver’s section, and the third sector is tight and technical and demands a precise set-up. I think Tilke designed it to try and bait the teams and drivers into focusing on their two strongest sectors and leaving the third one be, and we saw this in effect in qualifying last year when cars were setting similar lap times, but were setting vastly different sector times. The effect was muted given that 2011 was The Sebastian Vettel Show, but with this year’s Pirellis in play and the ban on off-throttle blown diffusers (I’m expecting the FIA to amend the regulations ahead of Hungary in light of Red Bull’s slipperiness in Germany), it could be a diamond in the rough. If the regulations can make Valencia interesting, they can certainly do it for Korea.

    Ignoring for the moment the restrictive regulations and the limited space on offer, I think Tilke’s biggest problem is that he tries to break circuit design down into a mathematical equation – that a long straight plus a heavy braking zone will equal overtaking. And it probably does work; we saw plenty of moves going into the hairpin at Hockenheim. But it tends to create a clinical, soulless and ultimately joyless circuit. The best circuits always followed the lay of the land, and had a more holisitic approach than Tilke’s mathematical one. It’s the only explanation I can think of for Spa and Silverstone being equally good, despite being polar opposites in terms of elevation, which the fans often hold up as the critical factor in circuit design.

    #205713
    Profile photo of Girts
    Girts
    Participant

    What about a circuit drawing competition? FOM (or those who are about to build a new track) could organise one, set certain rules / limits and fans would then send them their drawings. Most of them would, of course, be useless but something like the 10 best designs could be published in an online survey. The most popular choice then would be put into practice. It shouldn’t become a norm, of course, but why not experiment once? Just to see if it’s possible to outdo Tilke?

    #205714
    Profile photo of Prisoner Monkeys
    Prisoner Monkeys
    Participant

    Because it’s not so simple as drawing a line on a piece of paper and saying “here is my circuit, let’s build it”.

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