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  • #215801
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    Personally it irritates me that they keep going on about the fact he only “raced” 18 out of 20 races. Firstly if you starting 7-8th on average, surely at some stage in a very long season you going to be caught up in a first lap incident? Secondly, relaiblilty is a massive part of building a championship winning car, I think this season showed that it is more important than outright spped if you compare them to McLaren. In many ways the Ferrari was the car to have – specially when the entire team is focused totally on you.

    Just another point, I have read on this site comments saying mechanical failure is not bad luck, i can not agree in Vettels “alternator” case:

    Renualt supply 8 cars engines
    There are 20 races in the season
    160 starts – 4 Alternator failures
    97.5% success
    2 of 4 those alternator failures on Vettels car
    Add to the fact that Renualt had a fuel pick-up problem which probably cost Vettel a win – was that 1 in 160?

    #215514
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    A few year back Alonso (Renualt) says he would help Massa (Ferrari)

    “‘Yes, without doubt. If I can help, I will help Massa,’

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/othersports/article-1077284/Ill-help-Massa-win-F1-title-says-Hamiltons-bitter-rival-Alonso.html

    #215484
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    I suspect you’re just making a knee-jerk claim based on the fact that Toro Rosso and Red Bull share the same owner without bothering to consider the details of the race. Nor realise how preposterous it is to allege that Toro Rosso were sufficiently prepared to help Vettel by ordering their drivers to dive out of Vettel’s way, yet not sufficiently prepared to make sure Ricciardo didn’t catch Vettel out with his braking behind the safety car.

    I am afraid you will have to give me a English lesson, it was never my strong point anyway so no offense will be taken. I still believe Toro Rosso were sufficiently prepared to help Vettel by ordering their drivers to dive out of Vettel’s way (look at Vergne after the first saftey car). I doubt they where sufficiently prepared to plan for the event of Vettel being behind Ricciardo or even thought it would be necessary to tell Ricciardo how to drive in such a situation. Nor do I think imy comment was a knee-jerk reaction but a fair comment to make – judging by what i saw when Vergne nearly drove off the track to allow Vettel through.

    #215441
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    Because Red Bull have had a fairly reliable car and very consistent team. Vettel has made more mistakes than either Alonso or Hamilton, and has had less bad luck than Hamilton. The reason to why he is leading the championship, is because when you factor in all speed, consistency, reliability and team mistakes – Red Bull has undoubtedly the place to be at this season. Everything is laid out perfectly for Vettel. Red Bull have been as quick as Mclaren yet as consistent as Ferrari; he has had the best of both worlds this season. The fact that Alonso can still possibly beat him this year shows just how good Fred has driven.

    If what you say where true and the Redbull had in fact been as reliable as the Ferrari this year, then Vettel would already be World Champion (He would not have retired this year due to any mechanical difficulties). Further if there car was more reliable it could be argued that it would not be quite as fast. If Ferrari win (and even if they do not) it could be argued they actually had the right ratio between speed an reliability (2 DNF’s for Alonso from accidents). The way the championship works is that it rewards consistency over speed, so Ferrari in fact have the right formula – just the Lotus’s upset the plot a little.

    #215479
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    Nor realise how preposterous it is to allege that Toro Rosso were sufficiently prepared to help Vettel by ordering their drivers to dive out of Vettel’s way

    I am not sure I understand you then, looks to me that is exactly what Vergne did…..

    #215475
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    @Keith Collantine

    Watch again when Vettel comes up to Vergne after the first safety car, he jumps out the way. You can not honestly still believe that Vergne was treating Vettel as he would any other driver – even the commentators where joking about it.

    There is nothing preposterous about Torro Rosso looking after Redbulls interests – in fact I find it preposterous that they would not.

    #215470
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    @ Keith Collantine

    Toro Rosso moving over for Red Bull two races ago

    I’ve no idea what you’re referring to there.

    In Abu Dhabi when Vettel came up to the the Torro Rosso drivers they could not have left the door wider for Vettel too pass.

    #215469
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    I think we getting sidetracked on the Glock issue, stirring the pot a little. I was just trying to make a point that other drivers have in the past moved over for a driver (and I freely admit not Glock v Hamilton) that was not in there teammate – and no action was taken against them – the one I remember was Jerez 97.

    #215465
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    Well it is a good conspiracy….

    #215463
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    or Glock giving Hamilton his championship??

    #215462
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    @Keith Collantine

    It has been done in the past – Williams I remember handing McLaren a win. And what about Torro Rosso moving over for Redbull two races ago, article 151 (c) did not get a mention….

    #215460
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    Well he might not give up the win – but would he give up second or third place if necessary? And does he really “admire” Alonso or does he hate the fact that Vettel is accomplishing what he believes he should be accomplishing (3 World Championships)? Could it be the only reason that he wants Alonso to win so his own legacy is enhanced? Or does he just think Alonso to truly more deserving? Personally I think it is mind games against Seb as he see’s him as his biggest rival.

    #215382
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    Button beat Hamilton last year but I no one was thinking that for pure pace Button was faster.

    #215381
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    It is also pointless comparing “stats” – Webber might of lost out to Coulthard when it came to championship points but that does not mean Coulthard was necessarily faster than him – Webber might have suffered x3 the car failures etc. The stats do not tell the whole story about who was “faster”.
    Extrapolating this Vettels F1 Stats are great – in ten years’ time no one will be talking about Newey’s cars – people will look back and say Vettel dominated and he is a (or perhaps “the” by then) time great, just look at 2011 and how he blew a field of champions away! I think his biggest threat (Hamilton) may have just given him a few more years to cement his place by signing with Mercedes…

    #215277
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    GREAT read! What a season, I think Buttons championship win would have earned him alot more “credit” in alot of circles if it had gone down like this – would have been legendary!!

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