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Congratulations to Lewis and Mercedes on their World Championship.
Looks like my post last week wasn’t allowed, I congratulated Britain on their best driver since 1996.
Not only was it a GP Sunday, but I got to lap my S2000 at High Plains Raceway. A good day.
[img]https://highplainsraceway.com/wp-content/uploads/hpr-track-map.gif[/img]
Let’s hear it for the Superstar of the USGP, the track! Kudos to Hellmund, Schwantz, Tilke, et.al. Stringing together the best corner sequences from around the world, and at the same time leaving the track wide enough to race–just genius. A real “Drivers Track”.
I think the last few laps showed who the better drivers were, and they weren’t driving Mercedes. Hamilton vs Verstappen and Vettel vs Botas. All in the corner complex where driving skills trumped motor power.
I think it’s wonderful for all the British fans to finally have a Championship driver for the first time since 1996. At the same time, I think many Brits (including SKY sports) have lost all objectivity. Hamilton is good, but not better than Verstappen, Ricciardo or Vettel, who can (almost) hold their own again that amazing Mercedes power-plant. I’m a driver (with the SCCA), so I notice things like driving lines. I appreciate driving skill. What I see race after race (especially in Sochi) is Hamilton NOT taking the curbs nearly as wide as the other front-runners. Instead, he drives a moderate line and makes up time between corners. This decreases lateral-loading but increases radial-loading of the rears, which promotes much longer tread life. Don’t we notice that Hamilton tends to wear out his rears first? More power, NOT better tire management by the driver. His start this week showed an EXTREME lack of skill.
Mankster–Mercedes power in the back ranks? I agree with you. If I were paying Mercedes for their engines, then got detuned engines so as not to be as competitive, I’d be miffed.
I keep reading over and over again from this forum’s fans (& Keith) about “Ferrari had the quickest car” and such. Based on what? Quali? Not when Hamilton keeps taking pole. Even the SKY commentators admit Mercedes has a “Party Mode”, or “Qualifying Power at 11” admitting they have so much power they can sand-bag the rest of the season and use full power on special occasions, unlike the rest of the field who need full power 100% of the time just to keep up. I’m bored reading about cars being quicker than Mercedes in this race or that race. Objectivity!
I wonder how the FIA might react if the bottom six teams said, “Why spend 100’s of millions of pounds next year just to finish most races a lap down again?” “Let’s just stay home and let the top three teams compete.” Honestly, what’s in it for them? With Ricciardo going to Renault, and Kimi going to Sauber, hopefully, we’ll see some better competition in the back ranks. Mostly, I’m sure we’ll see Hamilton ace another season–spelled r-u-b-b-e-r s-t-a-m-p.
Sorry if this sentiment doesn’t coincide with the British fan base, but to the rest of us, it’s Formula Hamilton (Yawn) again. Cheers!
Congratulations again to Mercedes! What an amazing car. Winning another race by 20 seconds over the next closest team at Suzuka. I imagine we’ll see another rubber stamp in Texas in two weeks. Let’s engrave the 2019 Constructors and Drivers World Champions trophy now, there’s very little doubt about who’ll win those.
Far superior power, chassis that works above and beyond all others in wet or dry, and literally extends tire life by radial loading (as opposed to lateral loading) just makes this car head and shoulders above the rest. Very well done Mercedes.
I predict Mercedes will win in Texas next week with another 20 second margin, undoubtedly take pole again, and lead a majority (if not all) laps AGAIN. I strongly suspect Red Bull and Ferrari will be the next in line, then the other eight “also ran” teams. I’d like to be wrong, however this is the modern era of Formula One.
I could be wrong, but I would expect better comptetion were FOM to entertain the idea of “tech sharing” between the teams…
CONGRATULATIONS AGAIN TO MERCEDES/HAMILTON following Sochi!
No honor, no pride, no glory. A very dark cloud cast over the sport. No joy on the podium. Another rubber stamp season with Mercedes/Hamilton dominating with their overpowered cars. Just as I predicted on starting this forum post.
To those fans who have to cheer on the obvious winners: argue to your heart’s content. Winning vicariously will be your legacy. Good on you, not looking forward to reading your weak rebuttals.
Here’s hoping that enough complaints about the lack of competition will help the future formulas focus on better racing. Watching the same team (or even top three teams) consistently dominate the league gets downright boring.
‘Nuf sed.
Please excuse possible multiple posts, I’m having difficulty with my table, and it doesn’t appear after I submit it…
It may well be that Mercedes have the best car but that doesn’t make them dominant, and it certainly isn’t borne out by what we’ve seen so far.
@vettelfan17
The dominance finished in 2016,…
Not sure what have been watching, but Merc haven’t been dominant since 2016.
These are Mercedes statistics mostly from this web page, Race Fans:
Year. Wins. Podiums. Poles. Laps Lead
2014. 16. 32. 18. 978 of 1134
2015. 16. 32. 18. 936 of 1149
2016. 19. 35. 20. 1010 of 1213
2017. 12. 22. 14. 714 of 1196Definition of dominant
1 a : commanding, controlling, or prevailing over all others, the dominant culture
b : very important, powerful, or successful, a dominant theme, a dominant industry, the team’s dominant performance–Merriam-Webster OnlineI think this shows Mercedes dominance, even in 2017, where they took more than half the wins, poles and total laps lead. Per Merriam-Webster, that constitutes “commanding, controlling, and prevailing”.
Not sure what have been watching, but Merc haven’t been dominant since 2016.
It may well be that Mercedes have the best car but that doesn’t make them dominant, and it certainly isn’t borne out by what we’ve seen so far.
@Vettelfan17
The dominance finished in 2016,…
Here are Mercedes statistics since 2014, most numbers taken from this web site, Race Fan:
Year……Wins….Podiums…..Poles….Laps Lead
2014…….16…….32………18…….978 of 1134
2015…….16…….32………18…….936 of 1149
2016…….19…….35………20……1010 of 1213
2017…….12…….22………14…….714 of 1196Definition of dominant
1 a : commanding, controlling, or prevailing over all others the dominant culture b : very important, powerful, or successful, the team’s dominant performance–Miriam Webster Dictionary OnlineI hope this puts to rest any doubt about Mercedes dominance since 2014.
@David Not Coulthard
TIL F1 in the ’80s (and the DFV era before) was not real MOTORsports. Because there’s no replacement for displacement and even V8’s simply didn’t cut it.
Which ICE would you like to see today? What are your thoughts regarding displacement vs. voltage?
the year of the BGP001.
That was an excellent car, and took 1st & 3rd that year, with Vettel in the Red Bull taking 2nd, so, not as dominant as Mercedes with Hamilton & Rosberg taking 1st & 2nd in 2014, 2015 & 2016 (immediately following an engine change).
You’d be REALLY disappointed with the world championship’s F2 era.
Probably. I don’t watch any other sport except F1. Sitting in front of a TV for 3+ hours on race weekends is a lot for me.
I don’t see why insulting Rory Byrne, JEAN TODT (of all people), and I guess Brawn like that is a good idea.
Insult, complement, suggestion, whatever. Lets not read too much into anothers thoughts. By F-16 fighterjet, I’m implying the Mercedes has an unfair power advantage. Argue all you want (and you will!), but I’m NOT the only fan who feels this way.
Indycar? F1 has always been an engineering contest as well, even with Lotus/Williams/McLaren/Ferrari/Brackley domination.
“Standardizing components and design parameters” is a phrase I took out of the link in that post. It’s an FIA proposal for the next power formula change in 2021. No, I don’t want to see F1 become a spec car formula, cutting edge changes are necessary to improve the sport. But at the same time, I’d like to see the FIA keep the sport competitive. Why bother watching if I knew it will be a Mercedes/Hamilton-fest week after week?
<b>Here is a related point</b> (sorry ‘Vettel fan 17) <b>I’d like to make:<b/>
The FIA rules state:
–A maximum of 4MJ per lap can be transferred from the ES to the MGU-K (and then in turn to the drivetrain).
–A maximum of 2MJ per lap can be transferred from the MGU-K to the ES.
–An unlimited amount of energy can be transferred between the MGU-H and the ES and/or MGU-K.
(ES=Energy Store, or battery)1. This is all new tech, and advantages can be realized and masked. Can components and sensors be flashed and reflashed between inspections? Aren’t cars self-reporting these values?
2. Regarding the third rule listed above, is it possible that Mercedes has an overwhelming power advantage if they are harnessing and releasing more MGU-H into the MGU-K (drivetrain output)? Given that these are electronic components covered from view, the competition may never discover this and catch up, like mechanical advantages in the past.I think of this possiblity when I hear Mercedes talk about “dialing up” or down their power for a race. In fact, there may be rumor that Mercedes suspect Ferrari of bypassing a sensor to create more than the approved MJ/lap this season.
In the FIA “standardized components” proposal for 2021, is it possible that the FIA realize and will level this advantage, the same as providing standardized ECU components currently?
Electronic power production/storage/delivery is all new technology to F1, and, I believe, difficult to monitor and regulate as yet. Perfectly legal loopholes and workarounds exist that are beyond the average fans’ understanding. This is why I prefer the good old V8 formula of 2006.
“Nice try, but I don’t think they’ll notice unfortunately (still possible though). Good thing however is that you’ve made a new debating point :).”
No, same point, still discussing the dominance of Mercedes power and how it’s hurting the competition.
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“I didn’t watch F1 back in 2009 but could the McLaren from that year (at least early on) be compared to that type of performance.”I think the cars were much closer in performance then, and left more of the outcome to driver skill.
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“lets check back on gthis 11-26-18”Sorry. “Lets check back on this 11-26-18”, the day after the season ends. Lets see how many victories Mercedes/Hamilton takes throught the season, check winning margins, and let my complaint about dominance be revisited then.
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I just think that since the new power formula, Mercedes has had enough domination. I’d like to see better competition. I think The FIA does take note of fan feedback.Well, I’m glad that you’re all so enamored with the league as-is. I wrote this piece to hopefully get the attention of the FIA (who occasionally monitor fan forums), in hopes that something can be done to improve the competition. While I understand that no one replying to my post agrees, my single voice here represents many of my local F1 fan friends, not just my own, so probably a percentage of the entire F1 fan-base.
So, in the traditional-forum-response-protocol-method, lets do this:
Keith Collantine:
[quote]”Ferrari have led more laps and taken more pole positions.”[quote/]
True, but only the first few races of the season. Isn’t this how many seasons have started, until Mercedues “turns up their power”, and totally dominates the rest of the year? Check it out. Overall, Ferrari hasn’t led laps or taken more pole positions at all, since 2014. It’s been an All Mercedes Show.
“It may well be that Mercedes have the best car but that doesn’t make them dominant, and it certainly isn’t borne out by what we’ve seen so far.”
Really? You don’t think Mercedes has been dominant? Are we watching the same F1 league? Maybe we have different definitions of “dominant”.Jere:
“2014, not 2013.”
Really? You’re going there? Proposed, planned, implemented…I think most of us got the basic idea. Thanks for your keen insight.FlatSix:
“-Hamilton is certainly not mid-level.”
This is popular opinion. Many of us Not-Hamilton-Fans believe that Vetel, Ricciardo, Verstappen, Raikkonen and maybe Alanso are all better drivers, and would have set as many or more records if given the Mercedes power dominance. Several of us would LOVE to see Ricciardo driving the number one Mercedes.“-Hybrid engines are certainly not bad at all. The fact they’re hybrid doesn’t influence the balance one bit, for that see 2000-2005, there was no hybrid.”
Well, I appreciate your opinion, but I disgree regarding hybrids. Yes, we all remember the 2009 to 2013 V8, and remember that lovely high-pitched, 18,000rpm tone and it will be missed. I THINK (my opinion) that the MGU-H & MGU-K provide too many “black-box” variabilties related to power expenditures, and probably accounts for Mercedes advantages. Many of my friends voice the opinion that hybrid power is European reaction to political correctness. We think the current ICE sounds like a well tuned lawnmower.Vettel fan 17:
I agree with Garns, nice job! And not just becasue I’m a huge Vettel fan also, but it appears we generally agree on many points.Yes, V6 hybrids do produce more power. But there’s more to it than that, right? Other venues in other times have seen diesel and even rotary power dominate. But few are as clean as an N/A V8 or V10.
Mid-level driver too harsh? Yeah, probably. But his drivng skills certainly aren’t Driver World Champion, and this would be proven if he were relegated to a (very good) Renault/Red Bull car. You mentioned “he is human after all, they will make mistakes and errors”, but isn’t this what separates the Vettels from the Hamiltons? Sure, Vettel makes a very rare mistake, as shown in Baku, but that was a desperation effort, not a typical lockup or bad start as we expect from Hamilton.
“Formula E is electric, not hybrid”…
“Technically speaking (as far as I know), a motor is something that can generate power to, for example, … that spin the wheels.”…
“Also, motorsport is about cars racing each other, whether it’s a N/A engine, hybrid or electric. “…
“Also, if a new engine formula was to be introduced, chances are some other team would start to dominate and we’ll be stuck in the same situation we where on 2014″…
Yes, I agree with everything you say. Especially your agreement that someone has dominated since 2014. Exactly my ORIGINAL POINT, thank you!“I also fear Hamilton and Mercedes will win the title again, but to dominate is exaggerating.”
Okay, that’s fair, but lets check back on gthis 11-26-18, and see how it went. I know where my money lies, and I’m not thrilled with the way the league is headed.–Also, I wish I had your mastery of forum reply protocol, very neat!
After Note:
On researching my replies, I see that possible changes for 2021 and beyond include “plug & play MGU units on the front axles. “Standardizing components and design parameters” may bring driver skill more to the forefront, which is my greatest hope. See below link for more:I agree with a lot of what you say…..
DRS was supposed to alleviate boredom by increasing passing, much like “Push-To-Pass” in other series. However, it only enables more powerful cars to pass near the end of straightaways (Mercedes advantage, as if they needed more).
I’ve witnessed engine changes from V10s to V8s to V6s during my watch. Turbos have been banned, and reintroduced. Tires went from slicks to grooved and back to slicks. Traction Control was allowed, banned, reintroduced and banned again. Mercedes, Honda and Ford left, now Mercedes and Honda are back. Many changes in the rules make for a slower, stronger car to promote safety. Tracks have introduced chicanes mid-straightaways and decreased banking to make them slower and safer. The sport has been watered down so much since the 1980’s that it’s hardly the same.
Driver standards have changed. James Hunt (1976 World Champ) used to show up before a race, hungover, or still drink, smoking a joint and bending a Japanese flag girl over a stack of tires just prior to jumping into his car late for the pace lap. He stole lit cigarettes from spectators before he started his post-race victory speeches. Now, Kimi looks like a boy scout by comparison.
Still, look at the changes introduced into NASCAR and Indy racing. They are nothing like their roots either. NASCAR has become a restrictor plate, carbeurated spec car spectacle, and Indy put fenders around the rear wheels (NO LONGER open-wheel), that is provided you can tolerate watching cars circle all afternoon. Even American NFL football is a shadow of it’s 1980 former self.
Get used to it, because very shortly you’re going to be the guy saying “I remember when….”
