Lauda: Ferrari will get a pasting from WMSC

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Former world champion and Ferrari driver Niki Lauda has said he expects the Italian team will be heavily punished by the FIA’s World Motor Sport Council (WMSC) next month for their use of team orders at the German Grand Prix.

"What they did in Hockenheim was against all rules," Lauda said in an interview with the official Formula 1 website.

"Either the rules are changed or everybody observes them. What they’ve done is wrong and they got an immediate punishment – and they will get a pasting from the World Council, that is for sure."

Ferrari received a $100,000 fine for breaking the Sporting Regulations during the German Grand Prix.

The WMSC will meet to consider the matter on September 8, just two days before the start of Ferrari’s home Grand Prix.

The three-time world champion added that in his view Ferrari’s actions were an insult to the intelligence of Formula One fans:

You have two models of how to race in Formula One as a team. If you approach it politically then you are in the Ferrari mould. Or you try to give both your drivers equal opportunities and the fans an exciting sport, as Red Bull are doing in letting their drivers compete with each other.

That is what makes this sport a crowd puller because they see the best guys in the best cars racing each other with a ‘may the best man win’ philosophy – and not mocking the fans with a collusive result.
Niki Lauda

Fernando Alonso passed Felipe Massa to win the German Grand Prix after the team had been heard instructing Massa that he was slower than his team mate. Massa later admitted he let Alonso past but said he did so of his own choosing.

The stewards found Ferrari guilty of breaking article 39.1 of the Sporting Regulations which forbid team orders that influence the outcome of the race.

They additionally adjudged it to be a transgression of article 151c of the International Sporting Code, relating to bringing the sport into disrepute, the same section that McLaren were famously found in violation of in 2007.

64 comments on “Lauda: Ferrari will get a pasting from WMSC”

  1. Full on its 630am in Aussieland and F1F is awake. My Goodness.Ferrari might just get away with this one.

    1. Um, how? Because the forum was active at 6.30 in the morning local time?

      1. Yeah and based on an article that says that Ferrari will get a severe penalty?

  2. Alonso only talked on the team radio to state a fact : that he was faster than Massa. Then the team called Massa to notify him of Alonso´s opinion.
    I don´t see how this can be interpreted as “team orders”.

    It´s about time that Lauda has something cheerful to say. He only talks about bad news.

    1. Have you been drinking?

      1. No, but Ferrari fans have this incredible ability to justify everything the team does.

        1. Way to generalise. I’m a Ferrari fan, but didn’t like or justify the events of that race. Don’t throw me or other rational fans in with the likes of Bartholomew.

          1. Fair enough. Unfortunately when some fans are as mad as that it is far to easy to forget that there are rational ones. The same happens in every discussion. There are enough crazy Hamilton/Alonso and Ferrari/McLaren that when anybody speaks in favour of a group, they are assumed to be one of the mental fanatics.

          2. I´m a hardcore McLaren fan, not a Ferrari fan !
            but I also like Alonso very much

    2. So Rob Smedley was just stating the facts aswell then was he? I think not.

    3. If Alonso was faster, why didn’t he manage to build up a gap of more than a few seconds after ~20 laps?

      A) Because he wasn’t being held up at all.

  3. broke EVERY rule? yeah you right old man…
    they got a fine, they won’t get anything more serious than that. The irony is that they can only blame massa for the manouver, he is the one who did something, ferrari and alonso just minded their own business, but it would be the most unfair decision ever to pentalise Massa. Anyway, alonso WAS faster, no doubt, he is faster throughout the season, so no big deal, the mclaren fans didn’t like it.
    After the last GP, that 7 points will mean a LOT, and u know it!

    1. Yes, he was faster and is the only Ferrari in the title race, so Ferrari made the right call.

      1. daykind, remember that in old money, Alonso was only 8 points ahead.

        … LSL, let me make this absolutely clear, they can blame team management for the bit where THEY BROKE THE RULES…

        Sorry if the caps made your eyes bleed, I just thought it needed it.

  4. In the council, the British linked members will vote for Alonso’s points to be removed. Luckily every other nationality will vote otherwise.

    1. I think that’s a bit unfair. It’s a bit like blamely D Hill solely for Schumi’s Monaco punishment

    2. Not again Peekoc

    3. See my point on generalisation above. Just because some people are British and may hate Alonso, not all are. I’m British. I don’t particularly like Alonso. Would I necessarily jump at giving the harshest punishment I could just because of it? No, I’d give a punishment that reflects the crime.

  5. if FIA want a hard punishment for Ferrari, it can’t be harder than the one they applied to Renault after Singapore 2008, F1 is not a joke.

    Lauda seems more interested in praising his Austrian compatriots of Red Bull, but he forgets how much Vettel is favoured in comparison to his team-mate Webber.

    1. Yes, but Rd Bull don’t go issuing team orders. Sure, they swapped the front wings at Silverstone, but they at least gave a justification for it: Vettel was ahead on points and had been faster across the weekend at a crucial stage in the championship. Red Bull couldn’t take the fight to Brawn last year because they were too busy taking points out of one another. They wanted to avoid that this year.

      1. Mark Webber was leading the championship, and the race at Istanbul. Did they show a similar level of favouritism for him then?

      2. I’d say that Red Bull alse used illegal team orders.

        Helmut Marko was pretty clear that it was vital that Vettel got ahead of Webber and that the only fault was that the race engineer forgot to inform Webber of this.

        Besides, telling one driver to save fuel and informing the other that he has 3 laps to go and overtake the fuel saving one, is a team order that interferes with the race result as well.

        1. I also noticed Lauda praising Red Bull for giving both guys the same opportunities, something i seriously doubt.
          Why not praise McLaren instead, where both drivers and the team feel they do their best to be impartial this year?

          As far as punishment is concerned, you state the obvious problem FIA has with their penalties. They can hardly be consistent, as the only consistency in their punishments so far has been an incredible unconsistancy!

          Toyota got Ferrari data – not even prosecuted by the FIA. McLaren has Ferrari data – 100M fine and points stripped. Renault has McLaren data – no penalty at all. And so on.

          1. Red Bull’s problems are clearly not in the same league…

      3. Its clear RedBull favour Vettel, your blind if you can’t see that.
        With McLaren, its hard to say, Hamilton is so much faster than Button, that even if the team were more behind him (Button), that would just not work.
        Its a team sport, two drivers, the “team” wants the best possibly out come, for the “team” of course they are going to favour a driver who has more chance of winning the championship than the other!
        Its just sad that Massa missed out on winning, if it was the first race of the season it would have been so different.

  6. Sometimes its hard to be from that little island just off the coast of europe. Right or wrong, we’re always wrong. Hahaha. Im off for a pint…..

  7. To be honest, almost everything I’ve heard Lauda say has been rubbish. After numberous team orders since 2003, in my opinion, it would be wrong to punish Ferrari heavily, when we’ve seen many teams get away with team orders.

    1. “To be honest, almost everything I’ve heard Lauda say has been rubbish”

      I was just about to say the same thing, its a shame such a great driver gets a case of verbal diarrhea every time there’s a controversy in F1.

      1. I’m with you guys, I rarely agree with anything Lauda has to say.

        Also, am I just imagining this or does Lauda often speak negatively of Ferrari (especially considering he drove for them) or is it just me?

        1. Yes, I also have the feeling he has a grudge against them. Altough I used to put it on not liking Schumi for years, but that can no longer be the reason.

          1. Lauda certainly didn’t leave Ferrari under the happiest of circumstances.

            After his near-fatal crash at the Nurburgring in 1976, Lauda strongly felt that Ferrari had written him off as a competitive prospect and was looking to replace him as team leader with Carlos Reutemann – signed for 1977 in place of the more affable Clay Regazzoni. He had some grounds for this, as Ferrari under Enzo’s leadership was never sentimental about its drivers. I also seem to remember Ferrari sacked one of Lauda’s favourite mechanics for no apparent reason.

            Lauda was once asked whether he saw Reutemann as a team mate or a rival – devastatingly, he simply replied “neither”. For 1977, he pushed hard to wrap up the title as quickly as possible and then left for Brabham before the end of the season.

            Niki was certainly on the receiving end of some fairly harsh treatment from the Scuderia. But whether that would explain a grudge…

    2. The problem is not with “team orders”, but with “team orders which interfere with the race result”.

      Agreed though, I think McLaren got away with their illegal team orders in Monaco 2007. The FIA just wasn’t able to find enough evidence to penalize them.

      Obviously McLaren held Hamilton back. They gave him 5 laps extra fuel on each stint so he was slower than Alonso and then did not let him use that strategic advantage to pass Alonso.

      In the end those points they took from Hamilton would have given them the WDC. Guess by then they still assumed that Alonso was their best bet for the title.

      Still, that wasn’t nearly as blatant as what Ferrari did in Hockenheim though.

      I do expect Ferrari to get penalized harshly too.

  8. “Alonso only talked on the team radio to state a fact : that he was faster than Massa. Then the team called Massa to notify him of Alonso´s opinion.
    I don´t see how this can be interpreted as “team orders”.

    It´s about time that Lauda has something cheerful to say. He only talks about bad news.”

    baaaahahahahahahaha :) sorry I don’t normally do that, but…

  9. I hope he’s right. At the very least their points towards the constructor’s should be stripped. Monetary penalties clearly mean nothing to Ferrari. For the fine they received they only have to sell half a car and it’s paid for. If they’re given a fine that they actually feel, maybe they’ll think twice about breaking the rules again next time.

    1. Or, just ban them from the Italian Grand Prix and make it known that they only have themselves to blame.

      1. A Ferrari ban at Monza? The British, German, French, Indian and Austrian governments would have to send troops to Monza to protect their teams from the Italian fans !!

        1. Now that I’d like to see!

        2. maybe only anti-G8/no-global protests could be worse…

          1. Yeah, good luck with that one.

      2. Was your dog run over by a Ferrari when you were a kid? Just asking… I’ve read some of your comments and to me it looks like you are suffering from a severe case of Scuderiaphobia.

        Anyway people asking for a a point penalty, a race-ban and whatnot are just deceiving themselves. They’re probably going to get a larger fine and maybe a suspended race-ban, nothing more.

    2. What’s the point of taking the constructors points away? That will hurt them even less than a monetary fine.

      The whole point is that their illegal team orders did noting for their constructors championship, but that they favoured Alonso over Massa.

      If the FIA want to hurt Ferrari they will need to take Alonso’s points away.

      1. Patrick, that won’t happen. Technically, Alonso didn’t do anything. The team told Massa to move (kind of) and he did. If they get more punishment it will be the ‘team’. Similar to Renault in Singapore…Alonso didn’t get punished even though he was the one that benefited.

        I personally think 3 things 1) Ferrari wont have current points stripped (the team orders were just vague enough to make this a hard sell for the FIA) 2) Alonso will not be punished at all, and 3) I’m sick of old F1 drivers mouthing off about F1 drama, even when they are correct…

      2. You have a point, but it’s highly unlikely they’d do anything to Alonso, whether or not he had a hand in it.

      3. Unfortunetly Patrick is right,

        Ferrari have clearly broken the rules, that’s pretty much obvious, but to punish them, you kinda have to take away what they broke the rules in order to acquire.

        Which in this case, is Fernando Alonso’s championship points.

  10. Unless Lauda has inside informationen this is just another tongue wagging.

  11. The worst may be that Ferrari are strip from the Constructure championship just like Mclaren were in 2007.I don’t think that they will be ban for some races. Will they be fined more money? May be but I doubt.

    1. I expect more something like a suspended race ban and maybe constructors points stripped. But it might end without any further penalty or a far bigger penalty, depending on the point the FIA want to make.

  12. I’ve said this before and I’ll say it again…

    Singapore 2008 – Renault issues a team order (granted – not during a race) for their driver to purposely crash his car to fix a race, endangering the lives and well-being of fans, marshals, and possibly other drivers.
    For this they received a monetary fine and a suspended race ban.

    If Ferrari are given anything greater than this than everyone will now that F1 is truly a farce.

    Anyone who expects or demands any greater than this has a clear grudge against the name ‘Ferrari’.

    BTW… I’m not overly optimistic about them not being a farce.

    1. Renault the F1 team got away with it seemingly lightly because it was the action of a few people directly involved and they were forced out of F1.

      Ferrari continue to deny any wrong doing and are effectively sticking two (or one depending on your preference) fingers up at the FIA. I have no idea which way it will go, but nothing will surprise me in this case.

    2. In a way you are right, giving harsher penaty for this than for Singapore seems bad. Difference is, that Renault clearly made steps to ensure something like that can not happen again and admitted it was wrong, while Ferrari will not do something like that now.

      But most likely, the punishment (if any) will be completely unrelated, as the FIA has never looked at consistancy in their punishments.

      1. The other difference is that the Renault issue was investigated a year after it happened, making it hard to punish.

        1. Jarred Walmsley
          22nd August 2010, 9:50

          Yes, thats a very good point, also as BasCB said, Renault showed remorse for what they did and got rid of the people who orchestrated that event, and also admitted they were wrong.

          In this case Ferrari are not admitting they were wrong, I can’t see them firing De Monte over this, and they certainly won’t say they are sorry

  13. Lauda will say anything to get his name in the ‘paper’. I’ve learnt to pay no attention to what he says.

    1. thank you! that guy loves shooting of his mouth

    2. maybe Lauda Air market share had dropped this quarter. :)

      1. Well as I recall he did drop a plane… :P

  14. Smedley even apologized to Massa over the radio… of course it was a team order.

  15. Lauda yet again lets rip. He has been a very bitter man for as long as I can remember. He disliked Ferrari (both the team and the man) he fell out with Ron Dennis, Prost, Senna and Regazzoni and has not had a good word to say about the sport for 30 odd years. This has very little to do with what team you support, it’s about what is a fair punishment for being obvious. What’s the point in saying Mclaren did this and RBR did that. This is about Ferrari and the German gp. I can’t see anymore than an increased fine and a suspended sentence but with the WMSC anything could happen.

    1. Hope I don’t get sued , but I think he should change his name to Niki Loudmouth

  16. What a hypocrite ! He was doing something close to that when he was a Ferarri driver ? Team orders have to be allowed – the entire F1 crowd told you that ! Ferarri won’t get more punishment – there are no strict evidence of team orders – Felipe took the blame on his shoulders – “I did it, because I wanted to” – that’s it. 100k$ for insulting the prestige of F1 (it’s gone for a long time?) and nothing more. This is the most normal thing – to push one over other – honestly, I don’t think that Massa has championship abilities this season, so favoring Alonso is the only chance for the Scuderia.

    1. So, cheating is the only chance for the Scuderia and that’s ok?

    2. Jarred Walmsley
      22nd August 2010, 9:53

      Yes, but the difference is in Lauda’s era team orders were LEGAL this is the key point

  17. So Stefano Domenicali is not wrong about the “hypocrisy” that goes on in F1.
    Lauda is clearly favouring the Austrian team and Vettel. We all have our say so I guess it’s ok, win some lose some.

    Must move on after hearing as many are expecting points removed from Alonso and Massa. Just Ferrari’s bad luck as they’re fighting for the championships. If it’s a midfield team who would have bothered.

  18. I don’t really expect much. Being that it is mad F1 if they go by exactly what was said it may be hard to say it is team orders. It blatantly was but apparently there was already an agreement in place, if Ferrari and their drivers keep their mouth shut then they can hide behind Massa and just say it was his choice. It’s pretty much the only chance they have of using the ‘not guilty’ plea. If they accept it and face it then I’m guessing there will be a fine or suspended race ban.

    The two things that would perhaps make up would be A/ Alonso losing his points or B/ an actual ban for a race(s). The problem with the former is that Alonso didn’t actually do anything it was Ferrari and although that would hurt Ferrari and their intentions the most it would be like denying it ever happened. The problem with the latter is Ferrari not at Monza will probably make the team appear martyrs, be a bit overly harsh in my opinion, probably mean the grandstands are empty which is unfair for the fans, possibly cause an even bigger row and certainly influence the title (although some would agrue that’s what Ferrari deserve).

    However, this new regime seems to be a bit more sensible than the last so maybe we’ll actually see a punishment and them apply common sense.

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