F1 testing at Valencia concludes today.
Find more details on today’s test here:
Here’s today’s round-up:
Links
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“Suresh Kalmadi, the politician and sports administrator who initiated the nation’s F1 project, has been dismissed after 16 years as the president of the Indian Olympic Association (IOA) for allegedly trying to hinder a major fraud inquiry by the nation’s Central Bureau of Investigation (CBI) that potentially could involve the Grand Prix promoter.”
“Pastor talks to the media!” …including yours truly.
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Comment of the day
A lot of people still have reservations over the adjustable rear wing, such as 1978_Racer:
If we do see more passing generated by the adjustable rear wing it will only be because of one car suddenly having a big speed advantage over another because they were able to press a button.
What’s the point of getting excited over a potential fight for a position when you know that the car behind has a big speed boost available at the push of a button to pass the car he’s following?
I go back to Spa 2009. Restarts are usually pretty exciting as you never know what could happen. Yet the restart at spa 2009 wasn’t that exciting because you knew Raikkonen was almost certainly going to pass Fisichella on the straight as soon as he pressed the KERS button.
Everyone knew Kimi was going to make the pass as soon as he hit KERS and that to me wasn’t good racing, it was an artificial gimmicky pass which was neither exciting nor interesting to watch.
1978_Racer
From the forum
The eternal question: can you really read anything into F1 test times?
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On this day in F1
Virgin launched their first F1 car ‘digitally’ on this day last year. Unfortunately it didn’t go entirely to plan – technical hitches meant the first pictures of the car appeared several hours late.
mcmercslr (@mcmercslr)
3rd February 2011, 0:05
Are there any studio pics of the new renault and torro rosso?
Prisoner Monkeys (@prisoner-monkeys)
3rd February 2011, 0:08
Yet the difference is that this year, everyone’s got it. Or at least most people have KERS. Everyone does have the ARW, though.
I think it will be impossible to say with any certainty that a pass was directly the result of the ARW or KERS. Let’s say Hamilton and Alonso are going at it around Silverstone. Hamilton is within a second of Alonso going onto the Hangar Straight, and so uses the ARW. Sure, he can get by Alonso, but what if Alonso has saved his KERS to defend his position? It’s not going to be so easy for Hamilton to get by. And once Hamilton is past Alonso, Alonso falls into the ARW range. He could then use KERS to keep within one second of Hamilton for the rest of the lap and then use the ARW to have a go next time around.
The ARW – and when used for overtaking, KERS – are not designed to replace overtaking. They’re designed to supplement it. There is still going to be an element of driver skill involved.
Mike
3rd February 2011, 0:32
HRT?
Klon (@)
3rd February 2011, 1:19
Ladies and gentlemen, dear students. This post by Mike has been a brilliant example of how to not approach reading comprehension; completly ignoring the immediate clarification of the quoted statement in the following sentece.
Don’t do it like this on the exam and you are assured to not lose points in an embarrsing manner.
electrolite (@electrolite)
3rd February 2011, 2:59
He’s not in an exam. Just forgot to read something properly on a motorsport forum that’s all.
Maciek
3rd February 2011, 8:13
You might as well stand there pointing your finger shouting: hey everybody look at the stupid thing THIS guy did. Way to make someone feel bad for no good reason. You never make mistakes or something?
Kiwi F1
3rd February 2011, 5:12
My understanding is that the ARW will not be able to be used on the entire track. It will only be used on certain areas, such as the end of a straight etc. These areas will be pre determined by the FIA.
Does anyone know anything more about this? Which areas this will be used upon? I hope they don’t limit them too much.
Henry
3rd February 2011, 9:22
Well PM, sure in your hypothetical example, Alonso may have used the Kers Button, but hen again Hamilton may also have saved his Kers button…I really dont think there is any way around seeing this as a push to pass, in one section of the lap.
The fact that the FIA have restricted the use of the wing to one section of the lap, also means it will reduce alternative overtaking moves because there will be no point in risking binning it when you could wait half a lap and press a button on a straight. It also means there is a smaller chance of a re-pass, because the overtaken car will have to wait another lap before using their rear wing to attempt another go.
but, reservations aside, lets just wait and see how it works in practice. Who knows what might happen!
BasCB (@bascb)
3rd February 2011, 10:09
Well, you could use the ARW to get a move going and then the KERS to make it stick through the corner.
Surely drivers will see more of an incentive to follow other cars close, so it might mean we get a return to dogfights where the cars switch positions on the straight several times, until one of them makes a bit of head start on the other and drives away.
BBT
3rd February 2011, 13:01
This argument falls apart to SOME degree as only the car behind can use it MRW, so same situation applies as KERS in 2009. People will use the KERS at roughly the same points just as they did in 2009
Fixy (@)
3rd February 2011, 14:53
Can you use ARW and KERS at the same time?
George (@george)
3rd February 2011, 17:51
I think the ARW would probably be better on Wellington straight, maggotts and becketts tend to spread the cars out quite a lot
Ned Flanders (@ned-flanders)
3rd February 2011, 0:18
This is probably a bit too much to expect, but imagine if the rear wing meant that even after a driver had overtaken his rival, as long as he was unable to extend his advantage by a second in the next lap he would just get reovertaken at the same place the following lap. (I hope that makes sense?!)
Mabye the process would repeat itself again and again throughout the race, leading to race long battles like the legendary Jackie Stewart vs Jochen Rindt duel at Silverstone 1969, with the positions swapping again and again.
OK, so the rear wing probably isn’t going to make that big a difference- and if it did the FIA would presumably tone it down to compensate- but if that’s the sort of spectacle it might create I’m not complaining
electrolite (@electrolite)
3rd February 2011, 3:00
I suppose in that sense, the drivers have to do more work in the corners to get away from whoever they’ve overtaken before the next ‘big’ straight. Good point though! Can’t wait to see what’ll happen during such battles :)
BasCB (@bascb)
3rd February 2011, 10:10
Ha Ha, I just wrote exactly the same above, did not see your post!
I agree, this is a possible thing to see back, would enjoy it.
jake
3rd February 2011, 0:29
So how much do we trust this?
Victor.
3rd February 2011, 0:38
Scarbs is usually spot on, so I’d say it’s likely.
jake
3rd February 2011, 0:46
ok, thanks. I just wish people would reveal their sources!
Michael
3rd February 2011, 0:53
If people revealed their sources, those sources would no longer feed them info.
jake
3rd February 2011, 0:55
true
Keith Collantine (@keithcollantine)
3rd February 2011, 7:50
We’ll find out tomorrow.
Calum
3rd February 2011, 7:56
How would he know though?
Henry
3rd February 2011, 9:23
He is at the Valencia test in person, and knows many of the engineers. And he has often (not always though) been correct in the past.
BasCB (@bascb)
3rd February 2011, 10:12
It’s only a day till we find out. McLaren might have done something like Red Bull though (another one nicely uncovered by ScrabsF1 today!).
GQsm (@gqsm)
3rd February 2011, 10:42
McLaren might not have front exit exhausts but I’d guess at a blown floor somewhere along the same lines as RBR or a unique take on it.
I expect the McLaren to be one of the most extreme car changes from last year. Even if we don’t see the most interesting bits until Bahrain.
Looking forward to seeing it on track rather than in a studio.
BasCB (@bascb)
3rd February 2011, 15:12
I suppose they’ll ditch the sharkfin altogether now they do not need it to build the F-ducting into ;-)
Hamish
3rd February 2011, 1:28
Just on a side note, has anyone else noticed the rapid decline in quality on grandprix.com? I don’t know what is the worser form of comedy – Maurice Hamiltons columns or Bob Saget standup.
verstappen (@verstappen)
3rd February 2011, 10:27
Agreed, grandprix used to be one of my favourites. But these latest collumns…
*starts recorded laughing*
sato113
3rd February 2011, 1:50
great work out there in the field Keith! really enjoying your testing coverage this year. (and last!)
TomD11 (@tomd11)
3rd February 2011, 11:26
I’ll second that. For some reason though I find that picture with Maldonado rather amusing.
http://img225.imageshack.us/i/maldonado.png/
Robert
3rd February 2011, 1:51
I reckon Kimi would’ve passed Fisi with or without KERS. He was right on his gearbox coming out of Eau Rouge.
Dev
3rd February 2011, 2:35
and fisi would have passed back, either on the same lap or in next few laps on the long straight. only KERS boost helped Kimi save/gain that position.
Icthyes
3rd February 2011, 7:52
I agree. Perhaps the “only when attacking” rule for the ARW was put in because they remember KERS’ powers as a push-to-defend system; for example, Barrichello getting stuck behind Massa at the Nurburgring, ruining the chance of a battle for the victory, or the denial of Force India’s first victory.
BasCB (@bascb)
3rd February 2011, 10:13
Exactly. That move would have never worked if both cars would have either had or not had KERS.
bananarama
3rd February 2011, 6:08
Well, actually I thinkthe FI was the faster car that day. I was there (as every year, its just the best track in the world) and I have to say the overtake by Kimi looked quite spectacular and the way he had to fight every single lap to keep the FI behind him was a great piece of driving. I agree it was only possible because of KERS but to say Kimi only won that day because of it is pretty ridiculous. The car was struggling all around the track but he held it together until the finish line.
Give a tool in the right hands and you’ll see what can be done (unless of course the tool is rubbish, but we can’t judge that at this point in time yet).
Paulo
3rd February 2011, 12:52
I don’t think Kimi would have made the pass without KERS. Once in the lead he couldn’t even pull away from Fisi with the benefit of it
Icthyes
3rd February 2011, 7:43
It’s stupidly artificial, but then, isn’t the sensitivity of the cars to aerodynamic wakes also artificial?
There wasn’t enough time to change the rules to minimise the wake for this year, which is why they’re coming in in 2013 instead; we just had a major regulation change two years ago, after all I would rather the Mario Kart gimmicks had not come in at all, but it’s significant the next big rule changes were announced after the huge negative reaction to these gimmicks. In this respect, at least F1 is listening to its fans’ concerns.
OEL
3rd February 2011, 9:18
“It’s stupidly artificial, but then, isn’t the sensitivity of the cars to aerodynamic wakes also artificial?”
No, it’s just physics. It’s not created to give an advatage to the driver who is behind because he was slower in qualifying or at the start. I can accept slipstreaming because it’s physics, but to by the rules giving the driver behind an unfair advantage is just redicilus. Remember: The driver behind is behind for a reason. You can’t overtake if you’re lapping slower than the driver in front.
Aetost (@aetost)
3rd February 2011, 12:44
Well, if you’re lapping slower than the driver in front, you can’t get close enough to activate the ARW!
I get the feeling that a lot of people think that the ARW is going to have an effect akin to the “Turbo Boost” button in the old Knight Rider TV series…
Icthyes (@icthyes)
3rd February 2011, 17:46
Perhaps the guy was ahead of him and on an extra-stop strategy. Perhaps they’re not intended to stifle this, but everyone can see the aero rules do this.
Todfod
3rd February 2011, 21:37
@OEL. I agree with the gimmicky aspect of the ARW, but think about this … whenever a car is behind another car around high to medium speed corners, it loses a certain amount of aero-dynamic efficiency. The ARW just negates the amount of time lost by the chasing car due to the effect of the turbulent air generated by the car in front.
As Aetost mentioned.. if a driver is really quick enough, he will be able to take advantage of the ARW, or else, the gimmick is useless.
OEL
4th February 2011, 8:40
Well, let’s hope you’re right.
Mark Hitchcock (@mark-hitchcock)
3rd February 2011, 8:00
Would I be right in thinking that raising or removing the rev limit would aid overtaking in a much less artificial way by allowing cars to slipstream properly again?
BasCB (@bascb)
3rd February 2011, 10:15
That would only do about the same job you get from KERS. But the cars would still struggle to get/stay close enough to pass, something the ARW will provide a bonus for.
Dev
3rd February 2011, 10:50
i think ARW will allow top teams to move ahead more quickly if stuck behind a slower car & it will be interesting to see top teams fight it out for the win. Also since drivers are aware that ARW will be in place once the other driver comes within the required limit will not allow the driver to take it easy at any stage in the race. most of the time things will be on the limit. which is good in my view.
GQsm (@gqsm)
3rd February 2011, 10:52
With the ARW I am concerned that drivers won’t need to attempt any passes in braking zones and on corners. It will be a big negative for me if there is only one point on a straight where people bother to try an overtake.
In this case if I was the FIA I would allow the AWR to be used once every 10 laps, that would encourage conventional overtaking but still allow a faster car held up by a poor overtaking circuit.
I actually guess that the FIA will make the AWR zone small enough that passing with it is only a sure thing in a much faster car so it won’t make for an easy pass where cars are similarly matched. This should mean drivers have to still attempt passes in other places.
TBone
3rd February 2011, 11:52
Is the ARW allowed to be used on the first lap? Imagine the carnage when all the cars are that close at the start (except HRT as they’ve either run out of money, broken down or Kolles hasn;t decided which drivers will race even after the green light…)
S.J.M
3rd February 2011, 12:00
No, from the 3rd onwards.
S.J.M
3rd February 2011, 12:01
But il add, that KERS is free to be used when they choose, such as the starts. So expect carnage for some races.
Bäremans
3rd February 2011, 12:06
in the first lap, most cars will still be within 1 second of the car in front of them, so except for the leading car, all others will activate the ARW, which would largely cancel out the benefit for anyone. Except if one car would gain more advantage (ie speed) from it than the other.
What I am interested in, are battles of cars that match each other in speed. You’ll see nerve-wrecking situations in which one car stays on the back of the other, only to have a go on the pass with the ARW in the last round, to avoid the opportunity to be passed again the next round and lose your place again.
What would the regulations say on cars that deliberately move away and brake, so force the tailing car to shoot by and gain that strategic position? Would that be allowed? Are there any regulations against a driver who willingly gives up a position?
BBT
3rd February 2011, 13:08
Not any more ;-)
BasCB (@bascb)
3rd February 2011, 15:15
LOL!
Zindon (@zindon)
3rd February 2011, 15:56
Keith, any news on the mobile site?
Shimks
5th February 2011, 9:28
Hey, Keith, is that you in the centre of the pic.? Nice one!