Row 1 | 1. Lewis Hamilton 1’40.63 McLaren | |
2. Mark Webber 1’40.978 Red Bull | ||
Row 2 | 3. Pastor Maldonado 1’41.226 Williams | |
4. Kimi Raikkonen 1’41.26 Lotus | ||
Row 3 | 5. Jenson Button 1’41.29 McLaren | |
6. Fernando Alonso 1’41.582 Ferrari | ||
Row 4 | 7. Nico Rosberg 1’41.603 Mercedes | |
8. Felipe Massa 1’41.723 Ferrari | ||
Row 5 | 9. Romain Grosjean 1’41.778 Lotus | |
10. Nico Hulkenberg 1’42.019 Force India | ||
Row 6 | 11. Sergio Perez 1’42.084 Sauber | |
12. Paul di Resta 1’42.218 Force India | ||
Row 7 | 13. Michael Schumacher 1’42.289 Mercedes | |
14. Bruno Senna 1’42.33 Williams | ||
Row 8 | 15. Kamui Kobayashi 1’42.606 Sauber | |
16. Daniel Ricciardo 1’42.765 Toro Rosso | ||
Row 9 | 17. Jean-Eric Vergne 1’44.058 Toro Rosso | |
18. Heikki Kovalainen 1’44.956 Caterham | ||
Row 10 | 19. Charles Pic 1’45.089 Marussia | |
20. Vitaly Petrov 1’45.151 Caterham | ||
Row 11 | 21. Timo Glock 1’45.426 Marussia | |
22. Pedro de la Rosa 1’45.766 HRT | ||
Row 12 | 23. Narain Karthikeyan 1’46.382 HRT | |
24. Sebastian Vettel* 1’41.073 Red Bull |
*Sent to the back of the grid for having insufficient fuel in his car after stopping on the track.
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Gustav (@gustav)
3rd November 2012, 14:04
Awesome qualifying lap by Hamilton – what will happen to Vettel for parking on the track?!
Keith Collantine (@keithcollantine)
3rd November 2012, 14:39
After qualifying Christian Horner said Renault advised them to stop the car. I think immediate suspicion will fall on the alternator.
He doesn’t automatically get a penalty for stopping on the track after qualifying. Though, as we all remember from Spain, if it turns out he didn’t have enough fuel he’s in big trouble and row twelve awaits him.
A more realistic worry will be that his car has a technical problem which requires a parts change which could lead to a penalty, for example if there’s a gearbox fault (though one would suspect if that is the case the warning would not have come from Renault).
Fer no.65 (@fer-no65)
3rd November 2012, 14:46
It didn’t look like the car was out of fuel. More like some sort of technical problem, so I guess he won’t start from the back.
Alonso’s quite a witch, isn’t he? He wanted it, he got it. Sad for him it wasn’t on sunday :P.
bananarama (@bananarama)
3rd November 2012, 14:47
Apparently Magneti Marelli has changed the alternator design after the second failure, so it’d surprise me if the new configuration fails again. If RedBull actually run the new alternator or something else (as was suggested after Monza that they returned to an older design) I don’t know though. Lets wait and see whats wrong.
Eggry (@eggry)
3rd November 2012, 15:01
@bananarama I heard new alternator wouldn’t come at least until USA so I don’t think it’s new one.
BasCB (@bascb)
3rd November 2012, 15:11
I understood it differently @eggry and @bananarama. Apparently the 2010 version is perfectly fine, so all Renault teams now run those. But there’ only so many of them and earlier Renault stated that by the USA race there would definitely be issues with these having had a really big milage on them, so Red Bull would sooner or later have to start using the redesigned new ones, something they were reluctant to do.
Eggry (@eggry)
3rd November 2012, 15:19
@bascb I heard that either. I don’t know why they can’t produce same components now. Surely, They don’t know what caused the problem so it might be production line related which makes them worrying though.
Keith Collantine (@keithcollantine)
3rd November 2012, 15:08
Also worth noting there is a list of engine parts a team can change without incurring a grid penalty. See article 5.20 of the Technical Regulations for the list.
Yoshisune (@yobo01)
3rd November 2012, 15:18
So, if the problem is the alternator they can change it without penalties.
Keith Collantine (@keithcollantine)
3rd November 2012, 15:21
Looks like it, it’s on List B. Article 34.1 of the Sporting Regulations indicates they would need the permission of the technical delegate to do it.
Q85
3rd November 2012, 16:34
makes parc ferme bit of a joke really doesnt it
Fer no.65 (@fer-no65)
3rd November 2012, 16:40
Q85 How?
Q85
3rd November 2012, 17:47
the idea is to stop over night work and save money etc. yet you can change an engine.
Fer no.65 (@fer-no65)
3rd November 2012, 18:18
With a penalty. What do you want? that car and driver not to race tomorrow?
If there’s something bad with the car, they need to fix it. Otherwise it’s game over even before the race, which goes beyond the ridiculous.
PhilEReid (@philereid)
3rd November 2012, 14:05
Vettel stopped on track, could this be a repeat of Hamilton at Catalunya?
Hamilton absolutely dominated that one. Mighty happy.
Zubair (@zubair380)
3rd November 2012, 14:08
My thoughts exactly. If it was the same fuel issue, the stewards better be consistent!
Franton
3rd November 2012, 14:21
Stewards consistent? HAHAHAHA! That’ll be the day.
Abuelo Paul (@abuello-paul)
3rd November 2012, 15:02
Depends which rule book they’re using, the alls fair in F1 or the prancing horse exempt version, usually the latter.
Eggry (@eggry)
3rd November 2012, 14:06
Well, the qualifying itself was quite exciting but result is disappointing. surely Ferrari is hit by temperature problem more seriously than others. I hope Ferrari’s race pace and Alonso’s first lap performance would make Vettel-Aloso situation sooner than later.
mixwell (@mixwell)
3rd November 2012, 14:07
he has Kimi and Mal to tackle which should be interesting. .
i wonder where the updates are ? is it true that Mas had no updates on his car? If so, looking at the difference in lap times, it doesn’t look any better. .
Eggry (@eggry)
3rd November 2012, 14:12
They brought new front wing, new rear wing so it can be said quite big but improvement seems not.
mixwell (@mixwell)
3rd November 2012, 14:15
yes i know but were they applied to Massa’s car?
Eggry (@eggry)
3rd November 2012, 14:21
@mixwell I don’t think all of them at least. as far as I concern, new front wing is only for Alonso(due to lack of production) and it seems Massa’s rear wing also India spec which was only used by Alonso.
bananarama (@bananarama)
3rd November 2012, 14:29
The way the sector times looked throughout q2 and q3 I guess there was about 1-1,5 tenth more in the car, so that position was the best possible today. Hopefully Ferraris awesome quail improving updates haven’t hurt their race pace so we can see him trying to get to Vettel. Looking at Hamiltons and the McLarens medium tyre performance I suppose he will take this win.
BasCB (@bascb)
3rd November 2012, 14:40
I think the result is quite nice too. Its Hamilton and Webber up front, so defenitely not a Seb building a gap and winning it race.
And who knows whats with Vettels car, he might still be fine, or start behind Alonso, or even in the back.
Asif (@)
3rd November 2012, 14:06
At the start of the year I said that Lewis would beat Jenson 70/30 in the season and was told that my prediction was more exciting than the race itself :). I just want to say to that random person whose name I don’t remember, “take a look at that!”
Can’t believe so many were fooled by an anomaly last year. I watch F1 to see drivers like Lewis, Fernando and Vettel. Accumulators are boring!
Max Jacobson (@vettel1)
3rd November 2012, 14:08
What’s happened to Vettel’s car? I hope it isn’t a lack of fuel. It could be another alternator failure…
Kingshark (@kingshark)
3rd November 2012, 14:12
Back of the grid. :D
Asif (@)
3rd November 2012, 14:15
That will be good, will make the WDC more interesting!
Frain stermin (@fanser)
3rd November 2012, 14:13
he will start 24.
Max Jacobson (@vettel1)
3rd November 2012, 15:05
@fanser – so all of a sudden you know exactly what happened? Please, enlighten us since you are obviously well informed!
Max Jacobson (@vettel1)
3rd November 2012, 14:15
@kingshark – I doubt it, it looks like a gearbox problem judging from the on-board (as Ant said on Sky). I doubt Renault would tell Red Bull to stop the car over fuel.
Frain stermin (@fanser)
3rd November 2012, 14:16
a gearbox problem means -5…so vettel start 8th
Jono (@me262)
3rd November 2012, 14:19
@vettel1 – I heard vettels car got refueled with webers fuel xD
Eggry (@eggry)
3rd November 2012, 14:24
@vettel1 I don’t think it’s gearbox since it was Renault man said to stop. Gearbox is made by Red Bull and monitored by them. It should be engine related. I don’t know it’s serious or not.
Max Jacobson (@vettel1)
3rd November 2012, 14:29
@eggry – I thought that, maybe they advise Red Bull on the whole drivetrain but in all honesty I’m as clueless as Horner looked!
mixwell (@mixwell)
3rd November 2012, 14:15
instructed to stop asap by Renault, acc to twitter
mixwell (@mixwell)
3rd November 2012, 14:16
. … which could be an overheating issue or something more. let’s see. .i hope not.
Frain stermin (@fanser)
3rd November 2012, 14:17
i hope yes.
BasCB (@bascb)
3rd November 2012, 14:41
or a fuel pickup issue (i.e. not having enough fuel to pick up, meaning it ran out of fuel)
Max Jacobson (@vettel1)
3rd November 2012, 14:25
@mixwell – has anything else appeared on twitter?
mixwell (@mixwell)
3rd November 2012, 14:29
no not yet. .just speculations about what the penalty would be if x or y fails.
Max Jacobson (@vettel1)
3rd November 2012, 14:35
If there was a failure of a component I think I’m right in saying he wouldn’t incur a penalty merely for not being able to return to the pits at least, but he could incur a penalty for something else.
If there is a genuine failure in the engine then I believe they a allowed to change it without incurring a penalty (although then the engine isn’t allowed to be used again in a race).
mixwell (@mixwell)
3rd November 2012, 15:30
engine issues, as mentioned by Keith on twitter. .hopefully he can escape a penalty..
Gustav (@gustav)
3rd November 2012, 14:17
Most likely not. It looks like he doesn’t lose power from the onboard shots, the diodes in the steering wheel are still going which indicates that he still had electricity.
Max Jacobson (@vettel1)
3rd November 2012, 14:21
@gustav – The battery can hold enough electricity for 30 seconds of running so alternator failure is still a possibility. Gearbox possibly, an engine problem possibly or a KERS problem.
Jono (@me262)
3rd November 2012, 14:30
why did renault tell vettel to switch engine off and pocket the ecu?
Max Jacobson (@vettel1)
3rd November 2012, 14:50
@me262 – that’s what is being speculated! I think it is probably an alternator issue, but that is just a guess.
UnitedKingdomRacing (@unitedkingdomracing)
3rd November 2012, 14:14
Congrats to Hamilton1 Fanstastic Result.
But a few questions about Vettel. Do anyone know what the rules say. Do you have to make it back to the pits under your own steam in general or is it only for fuel, when you get set to the back of the grid.
And if there is another failure like the alternator are the allowed to repair it in parc ferme or do they than have to start from the pits?
Max Jacobson (@vettel1)
3rd November 2012, 14:17
@unitedkingdomracing – I think the rule breach that Hamilton/McLaren contravened was the fuel sample limit. They couldn’t make the minimum limit of 1kg and return to the pits so they incurred the penalty.
BasCB (@bascb)
3rd November 2012, 14:43
They could give that 1 Kg @vettel1, but the FIA judged that had they driven to the pits, then they would NOT have had enough anymore, which is not allowed (that was specified after Hamilton’s 2010 Canada pole)
Max Jacobson (@vettel1)
3rd November 2012, 14:48
@babsc – exactly, so that was a rule contravention completely separate from this incident (provided of course Vettel was also short on fuel).
BasCB (@bascb)
3rd November 2012, 15:14
Yes,thats true. There’s no rule that if your car breaks down you cannot start the race where you qualified @vettel1.
Max Jacobson (@vettel1)
3rd November 2012, 14:51
@bascb ^
davidnotcoulthard
3rd November 2012, 16:33
@vettel1
Isn’t it 1dm3 of fuel? Or it it really 1 kg?
davidnotcoulthard
3rd November 2012, 16:34
@vettel1
Isn’t it 1
dm3litre of fuel? Or it it really 1 kg?Max Jacobson (@vettel1)
3rd November 2012, 16:46
@Davidnotcoulthard – it is measured by the mass of fuel as the volume changes with temperature
mnmracer (@mnmracer)
3rd November 2012, 14:19
You have to make it back under your own steam because of the fuel, but if you have a genuine issue, then it’s not like you have to keep driving a death trap.
I think changing engines/gearboxes just results in a 5-/10-grid penalty, but maybe someone else can verify that.
Max Jacobson (@vettel1)
3rd November 2012, 14:45
@mnmracer – Gearbox changes are a 5 place penalty whatever the circumstances, engine changes are a 10 place penalty if a new engine is needed, but an old engine can be used (8 engines are allocated for the season and can be used for whatever races the team likes).
If Red Bull can prove there was an engine issue they can change it in parc ferme without incurring a penalty, but then that engine can only be used for practice.
disjunto (@disjunto)
3rd November 2012, 14:24
“Except in cases of force majeure (accepted as such by the stewards of the meeting), if a sample of fuel is required after a practice session the car concerned must have first been driven back to the pits under its own power.”
Going to be down to the stewards to decide whatever reason Red Bull give is valid. Probably why they are blaming Renault right off the bat, as that’s obviously out of their control
Q85
3rd November 2012, 17:50
exactly. a point all of the journalist on twitter(who again seem very trusting…) are all missing.
but to lie to the stewards can be a mistake also…
safeeuropeanhome (@debaser91)
3rd November 2012, 14:16
The only way that could have gone any worse for Alonso is if Vettel was on pole. Unless of course there are some sort of ramifications of Vettel stopping out on the track.. Even so to be out-qualified by both Mclarens, both Red Bulls and then throw in Maldonado and Raikkonen and it has been a fairly terrible day for Alonso. Great job by Hamilton, he’s been in a class of one all weekend, how people can argue Button is a better racing driver is beyond me. Also I really am starting to warm to Maldonado as well for some strange reason, the guy can be an absolute lunatic at times but what is undeniable is that he is really fast!
Younger Hamii (@younger-hamii)
3rd November 2012, 15:53
There’s more to a driver than speed over one-lap, hence people claiming that Button OVERALL is a better driver as well as claiming the complete contrast with Hamilton still being the better driver so in that sense it operates both ways.
Certainly Maldonado has the enviable speed but the race craft is one that’s been questionable – & still is.
Bob (@bobthevulcan)
3rd November 2012, 14:18
Should Hamilton get a clean exit at the start, he’ll probably able to hold on for the race win. Alonso could very well recover from his poor starting position with one of his lightning starts, and I can see him making up ground as he did in India. Vettel and Webber have a good chance of filling up the podium, while Button looked rather lost, but his long-run race pace seems strong enough.
Not entirely sure whether this bodes well for the championship.
PieLighter (@pielighter)
3rd November 2012, 14:45
@bobthevulcan it all depends on what the stewards do about Vettel.
Bwal87 (@bwal87)
3rd November 2012, 14:47
I wonder if Vettel’s problem was something gearbox related due to the brush with the wall at turn 19?
cg22me (@cg22me)
3rd November 2012, 15:09
It might be related to that… It seems like most of the speculation doesn’t consider this fact…
But then again, how would that brush against the wall effect something Renault-related?
davidnotcoulthard
3rd November 2012, 16:37
No, how could he still manage a decent lap with a damaged gearbox?
Max Jacobson (@vettel1)
3rd November 2012, 15:10
@bwal87 – that’s actually an interesting possibility, good connection!
Antonio Rossi (@bnm123)
3rd November 2012, 15:05
could be interesting if Vettel does get a penalty as unlike Alonso he wont have the top speed to overtake
Alexis Ryan (@wench)
3rd November 2012, 15:13
Maldonado is going to cause some trouble tomorrow. His top speed is so much higher than all those around him, it would seem unlikely that anyone will be able to pass him using DRS. Might end up with a chain of cars behind him for half the race.
Yoshisune (@yobo01)
3rd November 2012, 15:21
@wench
Williams had a pretty good race pace yesterday, I think Maldonado can keep up with the leaders.
mixwell (@mixwell)
3rd November 2012, 15:29
Vettel has engine issues acc to. .well F1Fanatic :D
https://twitter.com/f1fanatic_co_uk
mixwell (@mixwell)
3rd November 2012, 15:31
oh snap. .missed the IF. sorry guys. .please ignore !
Eggry (@eggry)
3rd November 2012, 15:42
@mixwell I did same thing at Twitter lol
nackavich (@nackavich)
3rd November 2012, 16:21
Nice work Charles Pic! Beat his team mate by 4 tenths and almost had both Caterham’s too.
Chris170987
3rd November 2012, 16:30
So, Webber will be third by the time Turn 1 comes around, at which point a flying Maldornardo will try to move down the inside, taking out both RB’s…..
VSI
3rd November 2012, 17:57
+1
petebaldwin (@)
3rd November 2012, 17:02
I hear Horner has now said Vettel stopping was “fuel-related.”
Any more news?
Atticus (@atticus-2)
3rd November 2012, 17:44
This gets better and better.
According to Formula1.com, Vettel said it was definitely not fuel-related as the team ordered him to get back to the pits as soon as possible at the end of his last flying lap. He doubted they would issue such an order if fuel would have been low.
Keith Collantine (@keithcollantine)
3rd November 2012, 17:53
Can you post a link to that story?
Yoshisune (@yobo01)
3rd November 2012, 17:57
@keithcollantine
http://www.formula1.com/news/interviews/2012/11/14016.html
Keith Collantine (@keithcollantine)
3rd November 2012, 18:01
Thanks.
That’s Vettel suggesting it wasn’t fuel-related, not saying it definitely wasn’t.
Atticus (@atticus-2)
3rd November 2012, 18:27
@keithcollantine Sorry, it was only a suggestion.
Latest rumours are that it is fuel-related indeed. See one of the latest comments on the qualifying report.
AndrewTanner (@andrewtanner)
4th November 2012, 10:57
It’s good to see Pic do so well, I hope he manages to hold on to his seat.