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Aston Martin tipped to become Red Bull title sponsor

F1 Fanatic Round-upPosted on | Author Will Wood

In the round-up: Aston Martin are set to become title sponsor of Red Bull Racing for 2018.

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After one of the most dramatic – and potentially defining – moments of the season, @gt-racer ponders if IndyCar style spotters could have helped to avoid the chaos during yesterday’s start.

It was more Vettel’s fault however I think the problem was that Vettel didn’t know that Kimi was on the inside, He moved over & squeezed Max thinking Max was the only car there. If he had known about Kimi I don’t think he’d have moved over as much as he did.

It’s easy to look at an incident like this from the outside & think that he should have known, However you don’t have enough visibility out of the mirrors in an open wheel car to see a car alongside a car thats alongside you. This is why on the ovals in Indycar (As well as Nascar) you have the spotters who are able to tell drivers where other cars are & in the odd case where they do go 3 wide its critical for the spotters to tell the drivers that there 3 wide because the car ahead especially won’t have any idea there 3 wide based on what they can see from the cockpit.

I recall that BAR used to give there drivers spotter calls at the start of races informing there drivers where other drivers were. Have always been a little surprised that didn’t catch on for the start & 1st corner.
@gt-racer

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39 comments on “Aston Martin tipped to become Red Bull title sponsor”

  1. Sorry but spotters are for lesser sports, like NASCAR and Indy.

    We want the best drivers in the world driving. Not their secretaries telling them where to point the car.

    1. I think spotters work better in NASCAR. Basically things happen more slowly, and drivers can hold a line longer it needed..

      It’s hard to imagine how a spotter would have communicated the incident in time for Vettel to make a better decision.

      I also wonder how much more information an F1 driver could handle in those seconds between lights out and the first corner.

      1. Very easy to imagine… “Stay right, Stay right!”

        “Leave me alone I know what I am doing…”

        “Are you OK?”

        *Silent driver with car damage*

        1. Kimi 110%! Do a VET now.

    2. I think it was Mansell that used a spotter in Adelaide, because he couldn’t see! Manly!!!

    3. Spotters for race starts only or the duration of the race?
      Spotters work well on ovals where the speeds are fast and relative speeds much slower with very minimal change of direction.
      On a limited overtaking track, the driver’s instinct would still overrule any third party suggestion. Because, on an oval you can retake the lead any other lap, but in F1, more often than not, if you lose it, you’ll never get it back.
      He’d probably get told to shut up anyway.

      1. I remember the shock I had, followed by laughter when FOM replayed Sato (or some Honda driver) being guided via radio on which way to drive at the start.

      2. Spotters for race starts only or the duration of the race?

        Just the start, It wouldn’t really be possible to do it around the whole lap anyway.

  2. this is just in my imaginary world but 2021 to have red bull aston martin, ferrari, mercedes,renault, mclaren, porsche, honda,haas ford

  3. Newgarden replaces Grosjean at Malaysia!

  4. What does is say about a car manufacturer, when they are happy to put their name on someone else’s piece of engineering. It kinds creates an image where Aston Martin is nothing more than a shell of a brand. Nothing more than a fancy badge to put on a car which is designed and manufactured by another company. As if they don’t even have a factory and engineering studios any more, but just offices for bureaucracy and marketing teams. Makes you think that when you are buying one, you are buying a Mercedes with a different sticker.

    1. Have you been in one? The more recent ones probably share less but the ford era ones are basically a Mondeo with a sext back drop. That has been their operating model for years.

    2. Biggsy, under Ford, Aston Martin were heavily borrowing components from other parts of Ford’s sub-brands (for example, I recall that a fair chunk of the interior electronics came from Volvo). The Aston Martin V12 was effectively two V6 Ford Duratech engines stuck together, whilst the V8 Vantage’s engine is a bored out version of the Jaguar V8.

      The thing is though, in reality it makes much more sense for companies to share resources when it comes to the development of new technology, since often they need to draw on more resources than they can muster themselves, and rebadging of technology is hardly new within the automotive industry.

      After all, would you complain that BMW is a “shell of a brand” because they have been buying in expertise for the development of their new 5 and 7 series cars from external suppliers such as the Magna Group (one of the larger manufacturing plant owners and component part manufacturers)?

      1. People who buy these cars as status symbols (let’s face it the majority) either don’t care or are clueless what is under the skin

    3. This is just Aston’s first steps into getting involved in F1, Andy Palmer (CEO) was interviewed by Martin Brundle on the grid and stated this tie up is about getting the Aston Martin brand attached to F1 prior to entering as a PU manufacturer in 2021. Their entry is dependent on the PU regs taking shape favourably (in line with what is expected, 1.6 V6, twin turbos, no MGU-H) at the end of 2017.

      Makes strategic sense to enter the brand now, obtain some familiarity prior to a full entry as PU supplier in 2021.

  5. I’m not sure Red Bull could keep Aston Martin whilst being powered by Honda.

    1. Exactly what I was going to say.

      If (and thats a big IF) Red Bull does become the Honda works team in 2019, its almost impossible to imagine that Aston would be able to continue as a Title Sponsor. From Honda’s perspective, it would be counter productive and confusing. Aston Martin Red Bull Racing Honda? The layman will have no clue as to who does what!

      Christian Horner is a pretty clever chap, Im sure he’s got it sussed. If Renault have served RBR notice, they dont have much else choice apart from Honda. I’m very curious to see how this plays out, because from a marketing sense, it makes no sense for Honda…unless of course STR remains the “works” team and RBR become the customer?

      1. This… And imagine if Honda becomes better than Renault next year. Not at all impossible.

  6. Singapore is in many ways the template for what Liberty Media, F1’s owners, are trying to accomplish in their modernisation of the sport

    Yup. Match with their decision not to penalized Verstappen for him was the only one who could avoided accident. Before liberty, every incident like this will result a penalty to the one who disrupt championship contenders.
    More drama. Americanized indeed.

    1. What could Verstappen do to avoid getting sandwiched by two Ferrari’s? Seb made an aggressive move to defend his poor start and Max had nowhere to go because Kimi had good start and was driving right beside him. Seb ruined his own championship chances by squeezing Max into Kimi. Ferrari has been known to point fingers at everyone and everything but themselves so their view of this incident is anything but surprising.

      1. Agree that it’s VET/Ferrari at fault here, but it’s not just Ferrari blaming others or something else for their own fault. Blaming others or a 3rd party is the standard in more than 90% of the cases.

      2. Neviathan, you will find from his post history that @ruliemaulana is rather heavily biased in Vettel’s favour: because of that, it is no surprise that his instinctive reaction is to throw abuse and blame towards Verstappen, even when both Vettel and Raikkonen both refused to blame Verstappen for the accident.

        Incidentally, @ruliemaulana, whilst I would agree with the general consensus that it was a racing incident, I think that even you have to admit that Vettel did have the option of going to his right to avoid the accident given that there was nobody to his right.

  7. Do not know, that’s why I’m asking, but does AM have the money and the engineers to develop and keep developing such an F1 engine?! They don’t seem to be that big and prolific company up for this job. Or is it RBR going to do it and just glue the AM badge on the engine?

    1. @mg1982, they have said that they’d only do it if the rules are massively simplified and the budgets are very heavily restricted, because in reality Aston Martin really doesn’t have the technical or financial resources to do so.

      Their annual turnover is <£500 million a year, and I think that, after about 6 straight years of losses, they've only just now begun to start making a slight profit again – without Investindustrial having bailed them out for years, Aston Martin would be bankrupt by now – whilst in terms of motorsport they've had fairly limited involvement in the top ranks (their first LMP1 car was just the standard Lola chassis with a slight styling tweak and their V12 engine, whilst the second was an underdeveloped and unreliable disaster with major engine issues).

      In reality, it is more likely to be a badge engineering exercise – it will probably be another party that actually makes the engine (it could be an independent outfit like AER) and Aston Martin would probably pay to put their name on it.

      1. Pathetic.
        Do we really want these kind of brands in F1?
        Do we really want to simplify the rules so that we attract “manufacturers” who aren’t manufacturing anything, and don’t have money to invest into anything, and don’t have engineers to produce anything.
        It’s a one-way road into irrelevance for F1.

        1. Biggsy, at the moment, there is a drive to simplify the regulations, but mainly with an eye on making it possible for the smaller specialist independent engineering companies, such as Ilmor, Cosworth or AER, to potentially develop engines for F1 and thus give teams a wider range of options to choose from.

          That may have the consequence of attracting Aston Martin, about whom you are being quite scathing, but it may also attract a wider range of manufacturers than that, such as Porsche (who have also indicated that they might be open to entering F1 if costs could be kept down).

    2. I should imagine the engine would be built by Cosworth. They have a history with Aston Martin and are providing the engine for the Valkyrie that Adrian Newey is designing.

    3. Lol this is what Merc used to do. They could have a sponsor for the Glue brand!

  8. Can’t disagree with the COTD, but considering how often F1 drivers ask their engineer to be quiet I can’t see a spotter being a welcome addition.

  9. F Truth (@offdutyrockstar)
    18th September 2017, 11:26

    Re: Toto feeling sorry for Ferrari, as fans we are constantly at each others throats, F1 fandom is certainly divisive however the camaraderie amongst the teams in real life is actually quite strong.

    They travel together, eat together, socialise together and yes, feel bad when their competitors fail, even when it’s Mercedes and Ferrari believe it or not.

    I had a close friend who worked for McLaren during the late 2000’s and he swore there was genuine sympathy even from Ferrari guys for the team’s downward slump from 09 onwards.

    1. F Truth (@offdutyrockstar)
      18th September 2017, 11:28

      Also remember only a short time ago, some of these guys were work colleagues working towards a common goal. Hiring is generally a rotation in F1 and just because you move to another team it doesn’t mean you automatically disconnect from all the friendships you made at your old workplace.

  10. For the record my suggestion regarding spotters in the COTD was just for the race starts & not around the whole lap.

    Something like what BAR used to do – https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RrPHLcfqUl8

    It wasn’t just Takuma Sato that got that information either, Jenson Button, Jacques Villeneuve, Olivier Panis & Rubens Barrichello all got the same while at that team. It was something Jacques started I believe & then his team mates also adopted & they just kept doing it for a time after JV was replaced.

    1. The messy starts I remember (yesterday, 2012 Spa, Spain last year) all went down so quickly that I doubt the whole cycle of observe-tell-listen-react between spotter and driver would ever occur in a timely enough manner to make a difference.

  11. Pat Ruadh (@fullcoursecaution)
    18th September 2017, 15:17

    That pathetic tweet makes me ashamed to be a Ferrari fan

    1. @fullcoursecaution – heh, which tweet? The first one was bad enough, without the follow-up one trying to rationalize the first.

      Vettel + Kimi fan here, though not a Ferrari fan. My first reaction on seeing the tweet made me rage “Are you nuts?” at Ferrari. The follow-up tweet just made things worse. There’s a reason why they say “Silence is golden”.

      1. Pat Ruadh (@fullcoursecaution)
        18th September 2017, 19:52

        Hear hear @phylyp
        I was annoyed at the first, forgiveable in the fog of war perhaps, but the second makes me fume!!
        I’m the reverse of you, a Ferrari fan with no great love of their current line-up. This sort of behaviour from Maranello makes me feel like my red allegiance is hangover from childhood that should have been binned along with the tamogotchis and rollerblades

        1. I wanted Vettel to win the race to keep thing reasonably interesting but the stupidity of him and Ferrari almost make a Merc domination palatable.
          Your talk of tamogotchis and rollerblades make me wonder if the Ferrari staff and management still have posters of their cars on their bedroom walls. Their PR team surely have those Ferrari duvet covers too.

  12. I agree spotters would assist at the start of F1 races as it’s the only time that a drivers situational awareness would not possess all the necessary information. At all other times in a typical F1 race, the driver should be 100% aware of who’s around him (or likely to be). Someone suggested that in the case of Singapore, a spotter would have transmitted “3 wide!” as Vettel could not have seen Raikkonen on the extreme inside. This may or may not have resulted in Vettel taking avoiding action/swerving right, but it would certainly aid the stewards coming to a decision in a post race investigation.

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