Felipe Massa, Ferrari, Singapore, 2011

Furious Massa hits out at Hamilton after crash

2011 Singapore Grand PrixPosted on | Author Keith Collantine

Felipe Massa, Ferrari, Singapore, 2011
Felipe Massa, Ferrari, Singapore, 2011

Felipe Massa said Lewis Hamilton “could have caused a big accident” in their collision during the Singapore Grand Prix.

The Ferrari driver referred to their run-in during qualifying yesterday, saying: “My thoughts is that again, I told you yesterday, he cannot use his mind. Even in qualifying, so you can imagine in the race.

“So, again, you know, what he did could have caused a big accident. And he’s paying for it, that the problem, he doesn’t understand, even paying for a problem, you know?

“Anyway, the problem was that I was in the middle so I had a puncture in my tyre and I pay a lot. I was not even lucky on the safety car because I’d stopped for the super softs in that moment to gain lap time.

“But them after five laps, six laps, the safety car came inside, and I had the wrong tyres to finish the race. So I was not very lucky as well with the strategy.

“And also, again, something happened with a guy who did how many times something with me this year? So many times.

“As I said it’s important the FIA is looking and penalising him all the time he is going in the car because he cannot think about it.”

Massa confronted Hamilton while the McLaren driver was conducting a television interview after the race.

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323 comments on “Furious Massa hits out at Hamilton after crash”

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  1. everyone makes mistakes… to me it was just a mistake, why didnt webber get penalised last year when him and hamilton collided, and hamiltons mclaren was done for. Hamilton shouldnt have really been penalised for that, and massa needs to calm a bit.

  2. This thread has really push my buttons.

    FIA inconsistency or not Hamiltons driving mistake cost Massa a top 6 finish and set him around 1 minute behind where he would have been.

    Flashback 2 weeks to Italy Schumacher was torn to shreads by the same people crying about Hamilon today because his driving was dangerous and deserved a penalty. WHAT!

    In both these cases i think the FIA made the correct decisions however Lewis did not.

    Onto today Lewis made the worst attempted move i’ve seen by any of the world champions this year actually on par with Schumacher and Petrov in Turkey. In both cases the car had been slowed and were then inexplicably drove into the back of another car. Massa had every right to be angry with what happened but his responce may have been overboard although what do we know about what went on before that.

    1. Worst attempted move? Really Schumacher on Perez was not worse? Hamiltons was a slightly misjudged move, schumachers was sheer stupidity! Only one resulted in a car flying through the air. Hamiltons move could have been a fantastic overtake if had been less than an inch further back (that is less than an inch at 40 odd MPH with a wing the driver can not see and on the dirty side of the track) You really should understand the difficulty of driving these cars to realise that Hamilons incident was merely a racing incident and one that happens in every single race at least once. I would bet that massa has done exactly the same at some point along with every other driver on the track.

  3. Hamilton wasn’t trying to undercut, the problem is those kerbs on the outside.
    They damage the cars when they are run over.
    When Webber forced Hamilton wide last year, it was terminal for the Mclaren.
    This race track is more dangerous than Monaco.

  4. Right, can we rewind back to Monaco.

    Lewis hit Massa. Lewis admitted it was his own fault, after watching the replays and quite rightly so. It was a dumb move.

    Fast-forward to Spa, where Lewis was taken out in what most people believe was a 50/50 incident with Kobayashi, after watching the replays, he openly said it was his fault.

    In this case, it was not Lewis’ fault. You could clearly see the tyres lock up, and therefore there was NOTHING he could have done to prevent it. It also appeared Massa drifted off to the middle of the track slightly. It was a racing incident.

    After almost taking Hamilton off in qualifying, and subsequently blaming him for it, I think it was incredibly childish and unprofessional of him to:

    1) Immediately blame him without watching the replays.

    2) Making sarcastic little comments like he did.

    I did have a lot of respect for Felipe, especially having the man-fruit to come back after his life-threatening incident at Budapest, but after this I’ve lost most of that respect.

    1. In this case, it was not Lewis’ fault. You could clearly see the tyres lock up, and therefore there was NOTHING he could have done to prevent it.

      Assuming the brake locking was the reason for the contact, what he should have done was brake earlier and less hard.

      But you don’t need to break down the incident in that detail to see why it was Hamilton’s fault and why he got a penalty. He was behind, Massa was ahead, and Hamilton ran into him. There’s nothing more to it than that.

      1. Fault and blame aside, what Massa did afterwards was unprofessional, provocative and childish. There’s noting more to it than that.

      2. If you use car lenghts as a marker then you can see HAM brake slightly ealier, but they are playing the last off the late brakers, Massa hangs `around` trying too dictate the apex speed Hamilton turns in an clips the rear right. The End.

      3. He was behind, Massa was ahead, and Hamilton ran into him. There’s nothing more to it than that.

        So using that logic, LH wasnt to blame for the incident at Spa?

        1. I think you just answered your own question?

      4. It reminds me a bit of the clash between them at Japan in 2008. Who got a penalty??

  5. There are two types of defense. Positive defense and Negative defense. What Alonso did to Vettel at Monza was positive defense. What MSC did to Hamilton was negative defense.

    What Alonso did to Webber at spa was positive defense, what koby did to Hamilton at spa was negative defense.

    How Vettel defended his position at Monaco this year was positive defense and so on…

    Look how Hamilton made it easy for others at the start. His start wasn’t bad almost overtook Webber but then the situation changed so he accepted to loose few places than to risk a collision. Had it been Massa he definitely would have touched someone. Alonso made it easier for Webber at this race and also at Spa he left Webber enough room. Also he left enough room for Vettel in Monza. The good drivers and overtakers are also often good at giving others room and they know when to stop defending and that they been overtaken.

    That is why as Webber said at Spa and Vettel said at Monza that they have confidence when overtaking top drivers that ‘they will leave enough room not so much but enough’ room.

    Massa and some others like MSC(Koby a good overtaker but at Spa i think he could have made it little bit easier for Lewis) just don’t understand this. They blindly keep on defending position and therefore risk of collision increases very much.

    The overtaker now have no confidence, he thinks the driver ahead will not let him pass even if he makes a right/legal/acceptable move and will endlessly defend, so he tries some different/unconventional move to get ahead.

    After doing this a lot some drivers develop this NEGATIVE reputation. You see Hamilton done so many overtaking today. Why only with Massa he collided? Because when he approached Massa to overtake his brain automatically tells him that he is in that category of drivers who will not make it easy not positively but negatively.

    Massa needs to learn when to give up defending. Lewis just didn’t had confidence that Massa will allow him past even with a correct/legal/acceptable move, so he pounced at the first opportunity and didn’t want to stuck behind him for long time. This wouldn’t have happened if overtaker knew that the person ahead is positive and will give up if he is properly overtaken.

    1. It’s a good point about Massa’s negative defending (to which you can add his clumsy overtaking).

      However I’d say this incident shows the big mistake Hamilton has been making this year: going for the overtake a bit too early. He would have caught Massa later that lap or the next, he´s actually very easy to get past if you don’t give him a chance to collide. Massa braked very heavily into the turn, Hamilton adjusting locked up and bingo, puncture for Massa.

      Hamilton doesn’t need to adopt Button’s strategy, he just has to find his own balance, wait a few more turns sometimes. That will make all the difference.

    2. I’m sorry, but that’s rubbish.

      First, Schumacher and Kamui both had every right to do what they did.

      ‘they will leave enough room not so much but enough’ room.

      It was Lewis that pushed Kamui off the track.

      Lewis has made many errors. Latest of which was to drive into the right rear of Massa at a left hand turn.

      How exactly do you make this Massa’s fault?

  6. I cannot accept the argument that all these incidents are entirely the fault of (Insert your driver here) , clearly Hamilton was the car attempting to overtake and should not have collided with Massa, however I am beginning to think that Massa is defending against a faster Hamilton harder than is sensible using the Senna tactic of “if you try to pass me we will crash” he should look to Fernando who has sensibly avoided colliding with Mark Webber when he probably could have banged wheels with Webber and claimed Webber was at fault, the result is evident in the points table.

  7. A simple apology from Hamilton would have been enough,i can understand Massa,s frustration when you politely ask to speak in private and the other person just walks away.

  8. I think Brundle summed it up the day before, on a qualifying out lap you can travel at any speed, but Massa mistimed Hamiltons run and was left for dust.

    As for `the incedent` that wasn`t a incedent into turn 10, chip chip chip, they wear Him down eventually, well done, Ive never met a sychophant, but I presume your feeling very proud tonight.

  9. The criticism Hamilton gets after such incidents is unbelievable! Other drivers get involved in similar incidents and you don’t hear much about it. Hamilton got stuck behind Schumacher for 27 laps at Monza due to Schumacher’s unreasonable driving and not much is said about it.

    Hamilton was involved in an incident today and got penalised for it. What’s the bashing all about. We’ve soon forgotten about Vettel who was called the “CRASH KID” on this forum. Because he is doing well this year, he is the best driver anyone has seen. The inconsistency of people’s views is nothing different from the inconsistency displayed by the stewards. I don’t have a problem with the stewards punishing Hamilton when they deem it fit. I have a problem with their inconsistency when similar incidents occur and i’m sure people on this forum can find so many examples to support that.
    Massa’s behaviour after the race today in nothing less than provocation and FIA needs to look into that. There was absolutely no need for that.
    The problem we have is not because Hamilton is a dangerous driver but because we have inconsistent stewards and people forgetting that we are watch Racing and not a prossession of cars. The fact that teams factor safety car in their strategy, most especially in Singapore should tell you that accidents do happen. I don’t believe for a second any F1 driver goes on the track to deliberately cause accidents.
    Most overtakes, apart from some of the ones that occur on the straights, partly depend on the driver being overtaken to be reasonable and leaving enough room. We all know Hamilton can overtake and the number of overtakes he’s made during the Singapore race, this year and previous years’ races speaks for itself. How many times have other drivers tried to overtake Hamilton and they’ve crash? It’s because he plays it fair. Why can’t other drivers do the same? He got stuck behind Schumacher and he got the stick for it. He makes a solid pass during this race and no one mentions it. The guy is having a bad year and some drivers do so give him a break.
    Vettel had the same opportunity he’s got this year and he almost blew it last year. This year hasn’t been good for Hamilton but that doesn’t mean he is a crap driver. We all know he is good!!

    1. Schumacher’s unreasonable driving

      Unreasonable? Maybe. Illegal? No.

      1. that fact that his team boss (Ross), not his engineer, came on the radio to tell him on two occassions to give enough room to Lewis says it all. Yet it wasn’t investigated. This inconsistency by the stewards does nothing but damage the sports!

        1. that fact that his team boss (Ross), not his engineer, came on the radio to tell him on two occassions to give enough room to Lewis says it all.

          The fact that he didn’t get a penalty and that the driver he was racing against didn’t accuse him of breaking the rules (at least, not after the race) says rather more.

          There’s an explanation of why it was legal here:

          2011 Italian Grand Prix Mercedes team review: Schumacher fifth after Hamilton battle

          1. The fact that a steward said the only reason he didn’t get a penalty was because the matter wasn’t reviewed, says yet more.

            Reasonable people can disagree on the Monza “blocking”, and I’m not sure Schumacher broke the black letter rule, but it seems that the precedents get interpreted with a thumb on the scale depending on the party.

  10. Rosberg causing a incedent that sent Perez wide at turn 1…….no penalty

    Schumacher becoming a hazard to Singapore ATC………….reprimand

    Hamilton clipping Massa`s rear right during braking into the fasteat corner on the circuit……….Drive through.

    Occams Razor…..again…

    1. +1.. exactly my sentiments

    2. Occam’s razor: the simplest explanation is probably the correct one.

      The simplest explanation is that Hamilton broke the rules and the other two didn’t. And sure enough that’s exactly what happened.

      Hamilton drove into the back of another rival’s car and punctured his tyre, ruining his race. Penalty.

      Rosberg was cleanly down the inside of Perez, the pair made minor contact and Perez continued. No penalty.

      Schumacher caused an accident which eliminated himself… and that’s it. No penalty (reprimand).

      I fail to see how anyone can have a problem with any of that.

      1. Keith your argument is flawed i’m afraid. Are you saying the end result should determine whether a driver gets punished?

        1. I’m saying this is why they were penalised, as far as I’m concerned it’s consistent with what we’ve seen before.

          The end result alone does not determine the penalty but it clearly has a bearing. Whether it should or it shouldn’t is a different matter.

          1. The end result should never be taken into account as it is completely irrelevant. What would happen if by some freak accident Massa had spun out and was killed?

            Taking the result into account makes the decision far too complicated and leads to different decisions for the same incidents. It is far simpler to punish the action rather than the result and this would also lead to far more consistent penalties. Just look at monaco! What is the difference between a clean pass and a crash when the lines and car placings are identical? Things happen so quickly in F1 the outcomes can be very different given an inch difference in track position, that inch could be the difference between a brilliant pass or a punishable collision, put that together with the pointless mirrors and you get a recipe for inconsistency.

      2. The only thing I had a problem with was Rosberg’s corner cut at the start. He made up 3 places by doing it.

        On F1 2011 you’d get a DSQ for Illegal overtake.

        1. I only counted one, Massa, and he gave that back.

          1. Yep, he only got past Massa there and Massa repassed into turn 7.

      3. fair enough! So why did Lewis got a penalty in Hungary when he “forced” DiResta off track? Rosberg did force Perez off track. Same situation.
        Usually when the faulty driver breaks something and also lose time in the pits, there is no penalty … well it is what I obeserved with Schumacher vs Petrov for instance.

        1. Drivers force each other off the track in overtaking or defending all the time, that’s nothing new. Needlessly spinning your car into the path of another is rather different.

          1. Keith, you used this same argument to justify hamilton’s penalty for forcing another driver off the track. Now you using the same argument to justify other drivers not penalised for forcing others off that track as normal. do i smell anti Hamilton sentiments here? I’m sure the rule book states that a driver should not force another driver off the track?

        2. +1.. Good question

      4. What about Webber taking Hamilton out last year? did he get a penalty? NO! Yet Hamilton’s race was ended…

        1. The two moves were completely different. Webber was alongside Hamilton, not behind him.

        2. Good point by Ro-Bert!
          It was clearly a mistake by Lewis.
          Found the drive thru a bit harsh but you can’t argue against it either.
          But my feeling says if he did what Nico did, he would have been punished for that as well.

  11. He didn’t get a penalty not because the stewards investigated and found nothing wrong. They didn’t investigate it all. That is the difference. If Hamilton had complained after the race, he would have still got the stick for it.

  12. Keith,
    If I remember well, Perez said that the contact with Schumacher punctured his rear right tyre, and forced him to pit earlier than planned. He added to go for a third and final stint of around half race distance, and couldn’t defend from Massa’s late charge because his tyres were shot.
    Actually, Schumacher’s move had consequences on Perez’s race and result…

    1. Perez said that the contact with Schumacher punctured his rear right tyre, and forced him to pit earlier than planned.

      I see where you’re coming from on this one but Perez was able to pit under the safety car so it didn’t cost him anything. If you look at the lap chart you’ll see he was eighth before and after it:

      2011 Singapore Grand Prix lap chart

      You say he was unable to defend from Massa, but Massa himself was disadvantaged by the timing of the safety car.

      That said I can’t say for sure the stewards took all this into account. As always, we would all be better off if they published their reasoning.

    2. Actually the fact that Senna later collided with Perez (he/his team was penalized for that, never had a clue of the incident during the race) at the restart might have hurt Perez more.

      1. I was also disappointed to not have seen that incident when I heard about it afterwards. I suppose FOM were showing Button trying to get through the back markers, and the Webber overtake, etc., but a repeat later on might have been helpful.

        On the (lack of) penalty for Schumacher, it seems a bit open to interpretation, but that’s with most of the rules.

        A rule that you risk a penalty if you hit someone and cause them to puncture/need new nose, causing them a large time loss, seems to be rather clear cut and predictable.

        And if then only a reprimand follows when you take yourself out and the other guy happens to not lose too much time (due to “your” SC), well, that seems to sort it pretty well for me.

        Keith is absolutely right in again pointing to the reasoning being published as a good fix for part of these discussions.

  13. mcl02,
    I think Lewis was penalised in Hungary because his move to get back on track was considered “dangerous driving” that could have had dramatic consequences, worse than just forcing Di Resta off track a little.

  14. Like Ive said before its better to be penalised in race than afterwards, better to ruin a race than 2 for me good call.

  15. Meanwhile on the other cubicle of the McLaren garage the cool, collected, debonair, Jenson “I need a scarf flying in the Wind” Button goes about his business of driving fast and being a gentleman about it.

    1. Button was helped greatly by hamiltons attack on Webber. Button was never really in a position where he needed to overtake anyone (apart from slow backmarkers). He had a great drive and fully deserved his second place but the two drives were under completely different circumstances.

  16. I only wrote what Perez said when interviewed, it was his point of view, but seemed to make sense.

    But I agree with you on the fact that Schumacher ended his own race in a spectacular way and I think his painful back will remind him of his mistake for a few days.

    On the opposite, Hamilton managed to finish 5th after two more pitlane visits than planned (front wing change + drive through).

    Therefore, a penalty might appear more legitimate in Hamilton’s case, otherwise he wouldn’t have been disadvantaged by his mistake, whereas Massa lost a lot of positions while getting back to the pits on three valid wheels.

    Of course stewards judge incidents based on drivers positions relative to each other, and the dangerous aspect of their moves, but it seems appropriate and sensible for me to also make sure that a driver who spoils another driver’s race, will also lose time because of his mistake…

    This is my opinion.

    1. I think your about right with that.

  17. All drivers make stupid errors from time to time,
    but lewis hamilton seems to make them in every race.

    The guy is going to cause a serious accident sooner
    or later, maybe ban him for rest of seasons races.

    1. Really. How about banning Schumacher too for his unbelievably dangerous error?

  18. I like lewis he,s a talanted driver and a nice guy but lets look at the facts. At the moment he is driving like a tool.

  19. something id like to point out is that on the BBC Forum Martin Whitmarsh said that had the roles been reversed (Between Massa & Hamilton during the contact) he’d have pushed for Massa to get a penalty.

    This suggest’s tht he not only believes it was Lewis’ fault but also that he feels a penalty for that was fair.

  20. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BEUVZXR18_4

    Look how Massa is hitting Lewis. I know it was sarcastic but he didn’t hit Lewis very softly either. You can see the video Lewis was quite shaken at 0.36 second. If i was Lewis i would have slapped Massa very hard after that ugly act of his.
    Poor Massa is getting beaten so badly by Alonso and he can’t do anything about Alonso so that is how he releases his frustration.

    Okay i agree for a second that it was 100% Hamilton’s fault but he also received penalty for it. Why such kind of fuming and getting physical after the race. If that is the case Perez should have been more angrier with MSC.

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