Ferrari escape further punishment for German GP team orders (Updated)

Fernando Alonso, Felipe Massa, Ferrari, Hockenheimring, 2010

The FIA have announced Ferrari will not be punished any further for using team orders during the German Grand Prix.

However the World Motor Sport Council upheld the $100,000 fine imposed by the stewards after the Hockenheim race.

Update: The FIA have said they will review the ban on team orders (article 39.1). See below for their full explanation for the decision and Ferrari’s reaction:

On 25 July 2010, at the Grand Prix of Germany, the Stewards of the meeting found an infringement by the Scuderia Ferrari to the prohibition of team orders interfering with a race result and then decided to impose a fine of $100,000 and to forward the dossier to the World Motor Sport Council for further consideration.

The Judging Body of the World Motor Sport Council held an extraordinary hearing in Paris on 8 September 2010 to examine this matter.

After an in depth analysis of all reports, statements and documents submitted, the Judging Body has decided to confirm the Stewards? decision of a $100,000 fine for infringing article 39.1 of the Sporting Regulations and to impose the payment of the costs incurred by the FIA.

The Judging Body has also acknowledged that article 39.1 of the Sporting Regulations should be reviewed and has decided to refer this question to the Formula One Sporting Working Group.

The full decision will be available on the website www.fia.com on 9 September 2010.

Proceedings

In March 2010 at Bahrain at the initiative of the FIA President, the World Motor Sport Council adopted a new transitional disciplinary procedure, in order in particular to ensure the separation between the prosecuting body and the judging body. At the General Assembly on 5 November 2010, a more global reform of the FIA judicial system will be submitted for approval, including in particular the creation of an International Tribunal which will exercise the disciplinary power in the 1st instance in place of the World Motor Sport Council.

In application of this new procedure, previously applied within the context of the US F1 case, the FIA President exercises the role of prosecuting body. As such, he has the authority to notify any person being prosecuted of the grievances brought against him and to submit the matter to the Judging Body of the World Motor Sport Council, chaired by the Deputy President for Sport, Mr Graham Stoker.

The Deputy President for Sport has the power to proceed with an investigation and, within this context, to designate a reporter from among the members of the World Motor Sport Council.

In the present case, the Deputy President for Sport designated Mr Lars ?sterlind, a member of the World Motor Sport Council, as reporter. Mr ?sterlind?s report was forwarded to the Scuderia Ferrari Marlboro as the party being prosecuted.

Prior to the hearing, the members of the Judging Body of the World Motor Sport Council received all the documents in the case, including the observations submitted by the Scuderia Ferrari Marlboro.

The FIA President did not attend the hearing but was represented by Ma??tre Jean-Pierre Martel from the law firm Orrick Rambaud Martel.

The hearing before the Judging Body of the World Motor Sport Council, assembled on 8 September 2010 in an extraordinary meeting, was chaired by the Deputy President for Sport and allowed the hearing, in person, of Mr Stefano Domenicali, Team Principal of the Scuderia Ferrari Marlboro, assisted by lawyers, Mr Henry Peter and Nigel Tozzi. The World Motor Sport Council had the possibility to join the drivers Mr Fernando Alonso and Mr Felipe Massa via video conference.

Ferrari released the following statement:

Ferrari has taken note of the decision of the FIA World Council, relating to the outcome of this year?s German Grand Prix and wishes to express its appreciation of the Council?s proposal to review article 39.1 of the Formula 1 Sporting Regulations, in light of what emerged during today?s discussions. Now, all the team?s efforts will be focussed on the next event on track, when the Italian Grand Prix takes place at Monza this weekend.

The World Motor Sport Council's verdict on Ferrari is...

  • Far too harsh (3%)
  • Slightly too harsh (1%)
  • About right (19%)
  • Slightly too soft (14%)
  • Far too soft (61%)
  • No opinion (2%)

Total Voters: 2,435

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Ferrari team orders in Germany

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389 comments on Ferrari escape further punishment for German GP team orders (Updated)

  1. msugea said on 8th September 2010, 21:39

    I just can’t seem to find the right words to describe this farce.

    You break the rules, you get punished ACCORDINGLY.
    How hard can it be?

  2. Drowsy said on 8th September 2010, 21:41

    I can’t understand why most of you in here are so upset about this decision today! MANY of you here have a VERY VERY short memory in terms of formula 1 regulations in the past 11 years.

    First of all, those saying ” why did they leave the £100,000 fine then?? ” Well very easy, there was a rule and it was broken, you can’t revert the fine, plain simple. Secondly, ” why are they going to revise the rule? Is it becuase it’s FERRARI again? ” NO, simply because the rule is stupid, dump, useless and nonsense.

    For those of you have a very very short memory, may I remind you that after the 1999 championship ended with McLaren Fans celebrating and pointing fingers at how Ferrari had yet to win the drivers championship after 20 years, from 2000 till 2005 they all got their answer, thus urging the FIA to change rules because the sports NEEDED it they said. Not because other teams couldn’t catch up! All teams were angry with themselves because Ferrari had done what others never dreamt of; they made ferrari look like it was their fault the sports was becoming monotonous, not becuase the rest of the 9 teams were out of ideas and out of resources. They even tried to make ferrari look bad when Michelin tyres weren’t good enough to comptete in the US GP, now that’s really Ferrari’s fault! Yeah what ever, they tried to stop the race…but useless, so let’s again blame Ferrari. None the less, after 5 years of total dominion by the Ferrari’s, the FIA started messing with the rules, aerodynamics, teams orders crap and stuff we all know about but we don’t want to be reminded about. All these problems about the lack of show, the lack of overtaking, the testing ban and the lack of sponsors wanting to enter F1, is because the FIA messed with the rules after a 5 year total domination from Ferrari to try and put ferrari down.

    Today F1 is seeing the end of the tunnel again, we hope for a better F1, with stupid rules like the team orders to be eliminated. It’s a team sports, why no team orders? Why blame Alonso if he had more points then Massa and the championship is a 5 way battle? You seriously think Massa can do something this year? Its obvious Ferrari will count on it’s best driver of the season, so what if he needs help? IT’S A TEAM SPORTS. You don’t like it? Stop watching F1, plain and simple. By backing team orders we might even see more fun in the track, more holding up rivals, more overtaking…so let’s just wait to see what the revised rule will say. As I said before, you don’t like the rule? Stop watching F1, but in any sports with TEAMS, there should be team work. If you don’t like Ferrari, it’s not the FIA’s problem.

    • To me it has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that it was Ferrari, who did it…
      When I watch F1, I evaluate what I see from a frame of reference, which is primarily the rules.
      It is fair to demand that the sport is regulated according to the rules, everything else is a scandal. When those who regulate the sport can’t find out how to issue a fair punishment for a breach of the existing rules, then they do not full fill their “contract” with the audience. If they want the rule to go away – fine, do that, but not before next season, and punish Ferrari accordingly.
      Alonso gained an advantage by cutting the corner on Kubica – he was punished according to the rules, fair enough. But by issuing a direct team order Ferrari gained a risk free 1 – 2 victory with most points to the driver, they believe can win the title, and Alonso gained 7 points and a rival of his lost 7 points. For this they got a fine, not a fair reduction of points.
      I strongly suspect that the FIA knows about several more cases of team orders, which are not known to the public and maybe therefore they can’t punish Ferrari as they should. Like if the International Bicycle Union knew about EPO but didn’t act on it unless it got public…And this is definitely bringing the sport in disrepute – it is a farce.

  3. F1 Dave said on 8th September 2010, 21:44

    Going back to past examples.

    Since the team orders ban we’ve seen.

    Fisichella letting Alonso past at Istanbul in 2005, Massa letting Schumacher past at Suzuka in 2006, Kimi been helped past by Massa at Brazil 2007, Heikki helping Lewis past at Hockenheim in 2008, Kimi letting Massa past at China in 2008, Heidfeld letting Kubica past at Montreal in 2008.

    Plus many others I’ve forgotten,

    Hockenheim 2010 was not the 1st time since 2002 team orders have been used in a fairly blatant way, It was however the 1st time we heard tha radio comms as it was the 1st race FOM had permission to broadcast any radio traffic they wished to.

  4. aNT366 said on 8th September 2010, 21:58

    If alonso he should receive more points, surely would have sanctioned.
    The FIA continues to be the Mafia

  5. diseased rat said on 8th September 2010, 22:00

    Thank Christ for that. Trying to ban team orders is like trying to ban drugs – that is to say it is an utterly futile exercise. Clearly the only way forward is to embrace it in a form that is acceptable rather than attempt full prohibition.

  6. Woffin said on 8th September 2010, 22:16

    Don’t shoot me down here, but just a few observations. Alonso has been involved in a fair few controversies in his career so far and in each one, he has walked away without any direct punishment. The spy scandal, the deliberate crash and now the free victory from Massa. Not to mention all the smaller incidents such as deliberately running yellow flags (Brazil 2003, Japan 2009) etc.

  7. I think its time for Mclaren and Willams to step-up and really work on a “GP1″ series for 2013. ALL current contracts run till end of 2012, so its the most obvious thing to do. F1 = Ferrari, Mercedes, FIA, Schumi, Kubica, Vettel. GP1 = Mclaren, Willams, Red Bull, Bernie, Webber, Hamilton, Button, et. al.

    This would be perfect. Ron, are you listening?

  8. Martin said on 8th September 2010, 22:36

    The team orders ban should be removed. Instead the FIA should make it difficult for team orders to happen during the race. Pit-to-car radios should be banned. This would mean the only teams orders that are given are before the race or via the pit board. Both of these would have their big limitations on affecting the result of the race. For safety reasons e.g. debris on track, the FIA could use the standard ECU to display pre-set messages to the driver.

    I think this would work and may also improve the racing as a result because the drivers will have less information. For example the instruction to the driver from his race engineer to save fuel at the end of the race would be gone. The drivers would also have to make more decisions themselves during the race which would open up more room for mistakes or master strokes by the driver. Imagine it starting to rain during a race the driver alone would have to decide when to come in.

    All of these could go towards improving the overtaking during the race.

    • This could be a good idea, but can’t remove the stains from a failure to regulate the sport according to the set rules for this season…

  9. Dgilles said on 8th September 2010, 22:43

    I hope smidley and massa quit the team after causing this problema with their child’s behaviour

    • This could be an internal Scuderia perception, but if You are just a Ferrari fan, how would You think of it, if it had been RedBull doing it in Turkey?

  10. Mr JoeBlack said on 8th September 2010, 22:44

    Thank you FIA for your efforts to disappoint F1 lovers all over the world. The big question is why? Why one more time FIA’s decision is unfair? What are the purposes and what for?
    well, what FIA did today well let the door open for all the teams to show us their politics skills rather than racing!
    One more time I’m very sorry for the F1. Sorry and sad!

    • Why did Mclaren never get punished for their orders? why are you so mad? This is a win for comon sense, this is a team sport mate !

      • Mr JoeBlack said on 8th September 2010, 23:24

        i am a fan for ferrary from early nineteens, although this a team sports, it was humiliating for messy and ferrary! there is no comon sense, after all Alonso is fighting for nothing, he nave no chance to win or to fight this season, it wasn’t worth it!

  11. I’m gonna start watching wrestling less chance of a rigged result.

    • Alistair said on 9th September 2010, 1:06

      What F1 needs is some competition from another World Series of single seater race cars. In many ways, it’s a shame that IndyCar is nowhere near as popular as it was in the early-mid 1990s. If fans had a credible alternative, that listened to them as the American series do, then Bernie might have some cause for concern…

    • hehe, great comment

  12. This is nothing compared to all the crap that they have let Lewis get away with and even the drivers are shaking there heads as to how he has been able to escape…. Had they enforced those rules he would not be leading now…. Which by the way is a JOKE…

  13. I hope people remember US Grand Prix 2007, if not let me refresh your memory.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SH9nMtJmx6Q

    FA wants LH to move aside. FA does not get his way, and we all know what happened next. Mclaren lost WDC that year because they let their drivers race. Had Ron forced Lewis to step aside FA would have won WDC 5 times by now and would still be at Mclaren and Lewis may have gone off to some other team and we would have seen another Schumi\Ferrari like era. Thank Ron that it did not happen.

    This is the same FA now at Ferrari, shouting on the radio “This is ridiculous” the same way he punched his hands towards the team pit box.

    US GP 07 was the turning point.

    My wish is a breakaway series( aka GP1 ). No FIA, no Ferrari, No Fernando Alonso, No Vettel.

    Ideally FOTA minus Ferrari, Mercedes and some loose change.

    GP1 rights are held by Bernie ( unlike F1 heald by FIA )

    Come on Bernie make it happen!

    • anthony said on 9th September 2010, 0:01

      no ferrari no f1 get real will you

      • Thats the whole point. It wont be F1 and it wont have Ferrari. All problems solved in one fell swoop. FIA and Ferrari can continue the excellent international assistance, IDK. We get to watch a good open series which would listen to fans. Ferrari fans wont moan about the website user demographics and the world will be a better place. Time for gp1fanatic.co.uk ;)

      • Alistair said on 9th September 2010, 1:00

        F1 doesn’t need Ferrari. Many fans may forget that they were somewhat of a laughing stock before the then ‘dream team’ turned their fortunes around. Besides, there are many other big (though not as big, granted) names in F1. F1 would survive quite happily sans Ferrari.

    • DaveW said on 9th September 2010, 0:05

      Well, it was the turning point for Hamilton, in driving Alonso from that team—and in making way for Hamilton to claim the title the next year, with only Kovalainen to deal with. Hamilton was young enough to care nothing that a 2X WDC was waving his fist and swerving around behind him, and was so unchastened that he maliciously shut the older man from his agreed last lap turn in Hungary later that year. Hamilton didn’t care that it cost uncle Ron a trophy.

      Massa needs to have his Indy moment. Is he as good as Alonso? Nope. Probably neither is Hamilton. But Massa is good enough to top anyone else Ferrari could bring in. If you want your title you must take action in your self-interest, and at this point unless Massa can run Alonso off or jump to RBR, he will never win a title.

      • I think the interest of the sport is far greater than than those of drivers. Massa will never have any Indy moments but he will have many Austria moments. If you think you have seen 2007 season and still say that FA is better than LH, well then nvm. I am looking forward to a final solution to this “Ferrari” problem plaguing motorsports.

      • Alistair said on 9th September 2010, 0:55

        ‘Is he as good as Alonso? Nope. Probably neither is Hamilton’.

        ! Lewis beat Alonso when Alonso was the reigning double-world champion and Lewis was a rookie who didn’t know half the tracks. Look how much Lewis has matured over the last few years since his debut: the few mistakes he used to make, mostly through impetuosity, he makes no longer; his driving is much calmer; he looks after the car and tyres much better; he’s much more relaxed. Lewis is already better than Alonso. But Alonso has (probably) passed his peak; whereas, Lewis, at 25, with just three years experience of F1 under his belt, is nowhere near his peak. A scary thought for his competitors!

  14. Anyone interested in supporting an Online Petition
    supporting a new “Formula” which is not controlled in anyway by the FIA and does not include Ferrari?

  15. manatcna said on 8th September 2010, 23:21

    Well, this is the result I expected, (and predicted)

  16. Travis said on 8th September 2010, 23:22

    No. No. No.

    I can’t believe I woke up to this news this morning.

  17. Obviously Todt is still Jet setting on Mclaren money, seriously though this sets a bad example as we are in the midst of a Cricket betting scandal, Betting syndicates talk, fair play walks.

  18. Richard said on 8th September 2010, 23:36

    Massa should go study barrichello’s career, his is going to be the same now.

    • Alistair said on 9th September 2010, 0:47

      Clearly, Massa should never have moved over for Alonso. To do so was to capitulate to Alonso and Ferrari in front of the world. So long as Alonso drives the other Ferrari, Massa’s hope of winning a championship and even a race, in many circumstances, is dead. So are his dreams of being regarded as one of the very best; for one of the very best would never have acted as he did. Even Damon Hill apparently said he would have Ralf off the track if he tried a pass at Spa 98. That’s how you do it!

      Rubens now says that his decision to move over for Schumi at Austria was the worst decision of his career. I wonder how long it is before Massa thinks the same, mutatis mutandis?

      • Icthyes (@icthyes) said on 9th September 2010, 1:30

        Didn’t Massa blame Alonso for losing the world title in 2008? I think Keith had an article on it very early in the year. Then he gave Fernando’s hopes a boost his year.

        Massa should have called Ferrari’s bluff; Ferrari would not be allowed to fire him (any basis to do in his contract would be an illegal clause) and by the time his contract was up another op team would be waiting for him and his services.

  19. sulzerpower said on 8th September 2010, 23:48

    Someone said they expected 300 comments, well, here is the 300th. Couldn’t resist when I logged on and saw ‘299’ mentioned.

  20. dragon said on 9th September 2010, 0:13

    Now i definitely hope Alonso wins the WDC this year (after Webber, that is) – just to see the reaction on this site :D

    • Im sure Mr Todt is working hard to make your dreams come true. LOL. A sad day, I wonder what Senna would have to say all about this. If only, :-(

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